Two Weapons, a Chase, a Killing and No Charges: A 25-year-old man running through a Georgia neighborhood ended up dead

[42!]

I didn't say "all Black guys are criminals" I said they're tendency is to avoid de-escalating situations. In this instance did the victim yell for help? No. Did he call 911? No. Did he attempt to run after shotgun man got out of the truck? No.

If shotgun man shoots him while he tries to flee, that's murder, open and shut case. Instead victim lunges for his gun. Why give shotgun man excuse to shoot you?

I've covered this already but for you I'll go through it again.

Running from an aggressor with a gun only gets you shot in the back. Yes, that would make it clearly murder, but that's not really a benefit to the victim.

If running isn't an option, fighting is. You close space quickly and get inside the arch of the weapon, gun, knife, bat, doesn't matter, its better to be on the safe side even if that puts you in contact with the other person.

Someone points a gun at you and you're wondering what he has in mind, remember you 4 rules. Never point a gun at something you don't intend to shoot.

 

[Picton]

Okay, you're right, bit of a generalization, but do you not agree that the victim acted aggressively at a time when instead he could have not initiated contact with shotgun man and instead continued to flee upon seeing the guy had a gun?

I'd never tell you what to do. Basic reading comprehension would have shown you that what I was doing was suggesting. Helpfully.

But see, the difference between what you posted above and what other people are saying is that you "seem to be suggesting" (I'll give you the benefit of the doubt) that the vic's skin color made him more likely to act aggressively.

See why that's racist?

 

[42!]

Okay, you're right, bit of a generalization, but do you not agree that the victim acted aggressively at a time when instead he could have not initiated contact with shotgun man and instead continued to flee upon seeing the guy had a gun?

Contact had already been initiated by the shooter. He chased him down. 2 guys with gun in one truck and a third coming up behind.

 

[Bonesinium]

but do you not agree that the victim acted aggressively

As opposed to going to grab guns, jumping in a truck, and chasing someone up and down the street? But dear lord, great point! He was the aggressor! JFC.

 

[T-Unit]

I've covered this already but for you I'll go through it again.

Running from an aggressor with a gun only gets you shot in the back. Yes, that would make it clearly murder, but that's not really a benefit to the victim.

If running isn't an option, fighting is. You close space quickly and get inside the arch of the weapon, gun, knife, bat, doesn't matter, its better to be on the safe side even if that puts you in contact with the other person.

Someone points a gun at you and you're wondering what he has in mind, remember you 4 rules. Never point a gun at something you don't intend to shoot.

I didn't know the guy was pointing the gun at him, if he was that changes things and if it was me, yeah, I'm going to try and grab the gun to stop it from being pointed at me.

I don't know if that was the case tho, but what I do know is if you initiate contact with the gunman, especially in a stand your ground state, you're opening yourself up to having deadly force be legally used against you.

This is all starting to sound like Trayvon Martin all over again, but in that case Zimmerman had his gun concealed and Martin was on top of him in a ground and pound. Again, that's another instance where the unarmed Black youth acted aggressively and apparently made the first move. In that instance tho, Zimmerman had no choice but to shoot to stop from being assaulted because he was in a position he couldn't retreat.

Shotgun man had backup with him and had no reason to approach the victim with a gun basically at the ready.

 

[T-Unit]

As opposed to going to grab guns, jumping in a truck, and chasing someone up and down the street? But dear lord, great point! He was the aggressor! JFC.

I agree that grabbing the guns and chasing the victim down was wrong and it does show premeditation, but do you have any evidence to believe that no matter what the victim did, whether he just stood there, called for help, called 911, or ran that they were going to shoot him regardless?

I think shotgun man is guilty and stupid. There was no reason for him to approach the victim while armed in a way that he was ready to shoot in a split second because that gave the victim a reason to fear for his life and use force to defend himself. Firstly, he shouldn't have chased after him in the vehicle and once he had him stopped he shouldn't have even gotten out of the truck, let alone armed in the manner in which he was.

 

[polygraph603]

T-Unit, I asked about your frequency of carry because there may be some suitability issues that could come back to haunt you, given your self-proclaimed ability to read the "Black man's mind."

 

[T-Unit]

I'd never tell you what to do. Basic reading comprehension would have shown you that what I was doing was suggesting. Helpfully.

But see, the difference between what you posted above and what other people are saying is that you "seem to be suggesting" (I'll give you the benefit of the doubt) that the vic's skin color made him more likely to act aggressively.

See why that's racist?

I do, but depending on the way that this played out, it wasn't smart for the victim to close distance and grab the gun because that gives the shooter every reason to fear for his safety. Of course, that goes both ways in that the brandishing of a weapon gives the victim reason to fear for his safety.

What ultimately became the reason for the shooter pulling the trigger was the victim grabbing his gun. Doesn't mean he wasn't right, but he sure wasn't being smart.

 

[T-Unit]

T-Unit, I asked about your frequency of carry because there may be some suitability issues that could come back to haunt you, given your self-proclaimed ability to read the "Black man's mind."

Oh, well if it's in that instance it's probably best I don't answer.

 

[Guyute]

My basis is this shit happens all the time. When is the last time you saw or heard of a Black guy walking away from a potentially bad situation as a means to avoid it?

Yes because we always hear about situations where nothing happens.

 

[polygraph603]

Why not answer, T-Unit? What are you trying to avoid?

 

[T-Unit]

Why not answer, T-Unit? What are you trying to avoid?

Well, I wouldn't want to put myself into any potential future legal troubles. So don't bother asking any more questions, I won't be answering them.

 

[Reptile]

they are absolutely guilty of assault because the brandishing of arms is an aggravating circumstance.

Open carrying a shotgun is legal in GA and not brandishing.

"Brandishing" is a legal term in Massachusetts. Almost never used anywhere else. Kind of like the crazy list of items in Mass Knife Law. Words so crazy I never heard most of them before reading that law.

I think open carrying can escalate a situation - however it's legal, so does not diminish the innocence of whomever does it.

Don't even think of it in Massachusetts.

 

[T-Unit]

Open carrying a shotgun is legal in GA and not brandishing.

"Brandishing" is a legal term in Massachusetts. Almost never used anywhere else. Kind of like the crazy list of items in Mass Knife Law. Words so crazy I never heard most of them before reading that law.

I think open carrying can escalate a situation - however it's legal, so does not diminish the innocence of whomever does it.

Don't even think of it in Massachusetts.

It's legal in GA if not committing a crime, in which them chasing down the victim in their truck and stopping him was the crime.

As far as my term of brandishing, I'm not using it in a legal way, I'm saying they had the guns visible as a means to be a force multiplier and, IMO, was done in a threatening manner.

 

[Picton]

I do, but depending on the way that this played out, it wasn't smart for the victim to close distance and grab the gun because that gives the shooter every reason to fear for his safety. Of course, that goes both ways in that the brandishing of a weapon gives the victim reason to fear for his safety.

What ultimately became the reason for the shooter pulling the trigger was the victim grabbing his gun. Doesn't mean he wasn't right, but he sure wasn't being smart.

Gyrate all you want.

But if a man gets a shotgun and pursues a man in jogging clothes, then faces him down with his weapon ready, he's got no reason at all to "fear for his safety" even if Daddy's not pulling overwatch from the truck bed.

Disgusting.

 

[Matt_SERE]

"Brandishing" is a legal term in Massachusetts. Almost never used anywhere else. Kind of like the crazy list of items in Mass Knife Law. Words so crazy I never heard most of them before reading that law.

I don't believe it is. We have has this discussion before I can't find it. I was jacked up with guns drawn in the late 90's by the Cambridge police. I've told the story before. I was let go from the scene with a 'look at what you caused' statement from a/one Cambridge leo. The Sgt told him he was wrong. I've posted the story here a few times.
Matt

 

[polygraph603]

Picton, don't be so hasty. Perhaps both the McMichaels, like T-Unit, know the machinations of the "Black man's mind."

 

[T-Unit]

Gyrate all you want.

But if a man gets a shotgun and pursues a man in jogging clothes, then faces him down with his weapon ready, he's got no reason at all to "fear for his safety" even if Daddy's not pulling overwatch from the truck bed.

Disgusting.

Hmm... yeah, I agree. Considering shotgun man was the one who went out of his way to chase down and stop the victim, that's not exactly behavior indicating someone fears for their safety and must use lethal force because he has every ability to not put himself in a situation where the victim will try to grab his gun.

Guilty, 20 years in state prison without parole.

 

[KBCraig]

But were there turtles on the road?

All the way down.

 

[KBCraig]

Oh, well if it's in that instance it's probably best I don't answer.

While it's generally never too soon to STFU, in this case I think you've waited too long.

 

[KBCraig]

Watch the video.

Does the video not show the burglar running towards the stationary truck from about 50 feet away?

It does.

No it doesn't, and now you're just piling on more lies.

The victim is jogging. Not "hauling ass", and not "running towards", just jogging. And then Bubba Jr. jumps out of the driver's door, shotgun in hand. The victim darts around the right side, to get away, but Bubba Jr. goes around the front of the truck to confront him again. Faced with being shot in the back or closing the distance, Arbery chooses the latter. It's not a pleasant choice, but it was probably the correct one at the time.

This is a neighborhood of large unfenced lots (cf. satellite view and street view maps). Arbery could have sprinted off through any of the yards and left the Double Tubba Bubbas in his dust, but he didn't. Why? He had no reason to, because he was just out jogging, as he reportedly did every day.

Some of you folks are just entirely too eager to justify killing a man, and that makes me sad.

 

[NannerClips]

Some of you folks are just entirely too eager to justify killing a man, and that makes me sad.

Yep.

 

[10thSFFD]

Here is your answer:


View: https://twitter.com/i/status/1259358968717033472

Now, go back on your sofa and Covid!

 

[Rob Boudrie]

"Brandishing" is a legal term in Massachusetts. Almost never used anywhere else. Kind of like the crazy list of items in Mass Knife Law. Words so crazy I never heard most of them before reading that law.

Nope. You are confusing MA with CA.

 

[Guyute]

For those who say the gun man didn’t go after him how do you explain at 27 seconds he’s standing in the opposite lane but by the time they make contact at 33 seconds he’s in front of his car?

 

[crazymjb]

T-unit is just a racist f***. I don't think he's ashamed of it either. He's also an obnoxious know-it-all. It's no surprise that clowns like him who "know what's in the mind of a black man" also know exactly how every situation should always go down. They are the same type of insufferable people we have all met or had to work with, who never have a conversation and always have to tell you how something is, why you are wrong, etc, with ZERO backing other than their arrogance.

 

[weekendracer]

My eyes have glazed over. Where did the dead guy live? Is it probable that he was 'out for a jog', or did he live 10 miles away, which wouldn't mean much if he was training for a marathon.

Anyone know?

 

[Picton]

My eyes have glazed over. Where did the dead guy live? Is it probable that he was 'out for a jog', or did he live 10 miles away, which wouldn't mean much if he was training for a marathon.

Anyone know?

That wouldn't tell the whole story. Very, very often I go for runs in neighborhoods far from where I live, just for a change of pace.

This guy was a daily runner. Any daily runner craves new routes, often.

 

[Bonesinium]

My eyes have glazed over. Where did the dead guy live? Is it probable that he was 'out for a jog', or did he live 10 miles away, which wouldn't mean much if he was training for a marathon.

Anyone know?

Not sure but I read an article that said he was around 2 miles away from home.

 

[T-Unit]

While it's generally never too soon to STFU, in this case I think you've waited too long.

Hey... IDGAF what u think.