Hypothetical- ccw

If anyone here thinks for a moment the "toss the cash" is the ultimate solution for every situation, you missed the point.

For the ORIGINAL QUESTION where no threat other than verbal existed, the 'toss cash' is a nice tool for A) possibly getting away cheap, and B) creating a diversion if you need to access something else.

Lets face it, if Mongo is in your face and you let him get that close without any defensive action, your ability to pull from your strong side from under cover is going to be pretty limited. Having 'alternatives' is a good thing.

And I'm going to harp on the "in your face" bit. There is no reason anyone should be that close an you not see it coming. You've got to keep your head up and look around. Be rude and look everyone in the eye. Given the guy moving down the street checking every dark spot for a threat and the guy bopping to his iPod watching the ground, who do you think will be the victim?

I don't carry pepper spray. I don't feel a use. A person is either a threat or not. If they are a threat, may my training be faster than them. If not, all the better.

The guy walking up to you mouthing off is difficult to categorize. If tossing cash results in them running off - Not a Threat. If tossing cash does not stop the assault, THREAT. Granted it will NEVER be that simple, but it is a way to make a judgement. Not the only way mind you, but it is an alternative I have.

That said, have I ever once used it? Nope, not once. But if I did as some on this list advocated and shot someone for making nothing more than a verbal threat, I'd have done that twice now.

A verbal threat alone is not enough. Verbal threat and the wrong action, motion, hand position, etc is a WHOLE DIFFERENT story.

Every situation is different.
 
This is quite a discussion! Here is my 2¢.

I've quoted it before I'll quote it again

Evil Abounds When Good Men Do nothing!!

I think I'll add this to my sig line.

Give him your money?? What about the next time you walk down that street? He now knows your an easy buck. What if next time you have your girl with you? Your kids? What if he follows you home to see what else you'll gladly hand over? If you don't stand up for yourself no one will! Your responsible for number 1!! We need to stop telling people to submit to a BG's threats! If the guy is a rapist and the woman submits to him then the defense attorney will argue that she gave consent!!! Don't believe me, well its happened before!! Like others have said I'd rather go down fighting. At least the next bad guy will think twice about harming another person on that street!
 
drgrant said:
While we're at it let's not forget this part of the RSA's....

In NH you can also use deadly force against arsonists. So if some POS is trying to burn your house down, you can shoot him.

http://gencourt.state.nh.us/rsa/html/lxii/627/627-7.htm

-Mike
Click to expand...

If some POS is trying to burn my house down (and Myself or my family is in it), it falls under A and D. Fire can be just as deadly as a gun, knife, etc. While it is nice NH spelled it out in a separate RSA, I still feel as though it falls under section 627 IMHO.

II. A person is justified in using deadly force upon another person when he reasonably believes that such other person:
(a) Is about to use unlawful, deadly force against the actor or a third person;
(b) Is likely to use any unlawful force against a person present while committing or attempting to commit a burglary;
(c) Is committing or about to commit kidnapping or a forcible sex offense; or
(d) Is likely to use any unlawful force in the commission of a felony against the actor within such actor's dwelling or its curtilage
Click to expand...
 
soloman02 said:
If some POS is trying to burn my house down (and Myself or my family is in it), it falls under A and D. Fire can be just as deadly as a gun, knife, etc. While it is nice NH spelled it out in a separate RSA, I still feel as though it falls under section 627 IMHO.
Click to expand...

The difference is 627-7 allows protection of property under that specific circumstance. The other parts reference acts against people. That's a pretty big difference.

This means that you can protect your unoccupied barn, for example, from arson, with deadly force.

-Mike
 
RI_John said:
Love this thread! Full of win!

My 2 cents, and I have thought about this, with gun, with threat of gun, with knife, with threat of knife, etc. It's all the same to me. I figure I have ONE tactical advantage and ONE chance to use it, that's the fake compliance while slowly reaching for the wallet/gun.

"Hey, hey, ok! You can have my wallet, I'll even give you my pin number, whatever you want, whatever you want" as you slowly reach for the gun and then -- bang

that's it. The only response I will have for ANY scenario involving a mugging with a deadly weapon, seen or implied.

You don't have to be a quick draw for this. You get to take your sweet time retrieving your gun because mugger thinks you're retrieving wallet.

What the hell are you going to do if you DO give up your wallet, hand it to him, now your hands are in front of you, he pulls out the gun he told you he had and says "On your knees bitch!"? What then? You have gone from tactical advantage to about to die, for what???
Click to expand...
Well said, dude.
 
Eye5600 said:
Question for anyone on the "shoot first, ask questions later" side of the argument: The BG says he has a gun, and asks for money. You pull your gun and blast away. When the echos die down, you dial 911.

What happens if the cops don't find a deadly weapon on the BG? You con't have ANY evidence you were threatened.

It's almost as bad if the cops find a deadly weapon, but it's still in his pocket.
Click to expand...

SFW? Who's going to contradict your testimony?

Better yet, are you willing to be your life on calling a thug's bluff?

Sorry. I have a child and wife to back home to.
 
RI_John said:
Love this thread! Full of win!

My 2 cents, and I have thought about this, with gun, with threat of gun, with knife, with threat of knife, etc. It's all the same to me. I figure I have ONE tactical advantage and ONE chance to use it, that's the fake compliance while slowly reaching for the wallet/gun.

"Hey, hey, ok! You can have my wallet, I'll even give you my pin number, whatever you want, whatever you want" as you slowly reach for the gun and then -- bang

that's it. The only response I will have for ANY scenario involving a mugging with a deadly weapon, seen or implied.

You don't have to be a quick draw for this. You get to take your sweet time retrieving your gun because mugger thinks you're retrieving wallet.

What the hell are you going to do if you DO give up your wallet, hand it to him, now your hands are in front of you, he pulls out the gun he told you he had and says "On your knees bitch!"? What then? You have gone from tactical advantage to about to die, for what???
Click to expand...



+5
 
MACGYVR said:
Kill the bastard and leave.
Dont call the cops. Dont wait around for them. Save you alot of headaches
If he mugged you, there were probably no witnesses in the area either.


bad guy just becomes another random victim found on the street
Click to expand...

I hate these ccw hypotheticals.

But this reply has a certain visceral appeal. If only it could be so, every time ...
 
cekim said:
Unlike the teachings of Yeager - those are more serious works for the discerning low-drag operator.... [wink]
Click to expand...

Don't be a hater just because you aren't a switched on warrior.
[wink]

My problem is I almost never carry cash, but I carry.

This makes the choice a little easier.
 
You don't have time to think of legal ramifications of drawing your weapon, that should be all worked out way before carrying. If someone threatens you with a weapon and you question weather you should draw? Those are lost seconds and you will be dead. The bottom line is if you carry you should be 100% willing to use it.
 
massamerican said:
You don't have time to think of legal ramifications of drawing your weapon, that should be all worked out way before carrying. If someone threatens you with a weapon and you question weather you should draw? Those are lost seconds and you will be dead. The bottom line is if you carry you should be 100% willing to use it.
Click to expand...

Although I agree with the above statement. I think that alot of us who carry tend to automatically think the answer to a life threatening attack is to shoot the person. The gun is just one of the tools we have and it's not always the best tool.

I have several tool I carry daily.

1. Verbal / avoidance / awareness
2. Hands / feet
3. flashlight
4. oc
5. firearm

If the person with the gun was 18'' from my face I would be better off using my hands and my training in Martial arts than I would be to try and draw a j-frame from my front pocket. If I had a pen in my hand I might be better off using that and could probably take control of the situation alot faster.

We have a buffet of tools to use and we can choose whatever one may be the best at the time. If my answer to a personal attack was to shoot first I would have already shot a few people. [wink]
 
I would absolutely give up a company cc, and cellphone.. My personal property would be a different matter though.. I will not be a victim of a violent crime without putting up my best fight..
 
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Mike-Mike said:
Although I agree with the above statement. I think that alot of us who carry tend to automatically think the answer to a life threatening attack is to shoot the person. The gun is just one of the tools we have and it's not always the best tool.

I have several tool I carry daily.

1. Verbal / avoidance / awareness
2. Hands / feet
3. flashlight
4. oc
5. firearm

If the person with the gun was 18'' from my face I would be better off using my hands and my training in Martial arts than I would be to try and draw a j-frame from my front pocket. If I had a pen in my hand I might be better off using that and could probably take control of the situation alot faster.

We have a buffet of tools to use and we can choose whatever one may be the best at the time. If my answer to a personal attack was to shoot first I would have already shot a few people. [wink]
Click to expand...

Yup, I agree with having different tools at your disposal to subdue a BG but if they put a gun 18" from your face? Just use theirs...
 
$10 in a throwaway wallet? but but it's the only wallet i have and it's my last $10 [sad2] wait hold on a minute, you mean people actually have more than $10 now a days? and more than one wallet? boy am i living in the past, or is it the future?

these days i get confused so easily don't you know......
 
the-hobbit said:
$10 in a throwaway wallet? but but it's the only wallet i have and it's my last $10 [sad2] wait hold on a minute, you mean people actually have more than $10 now a days? and more than one wallet? boy am i living in the past, or is it the future?

these days i get confused so easily don't you know......
Click to expand...
Hobbit, just blast 'em we can work out the details later... [rofl]
 
This thread.

[sad2][thinking][hmmm]

Personally I won't post what I would do or wouldn't do, because it could be held against me in a court of law. Nevermind the fact I can't see the future, much.

[rolleyes]
 
Mike-Mike said:
Cool down guys. Someone want me money they can have it. I am not going to shoot someone if I don't have to.
Click to expand...

No one is taking my money, I would have done my civic duty, and called the ambulance for said bad guy.

Anomalously of course, fair game as far as I am concerned, just another deer in the woods.

But no one get's my hard earned paper.

( As noted I never said Gun, as I would have punched the Mother F,er in the face, especially with no gun actually produced )
 
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Blitz1 said:
Personally I won't post what I would do or wouldn't do, because it could be held against me in a court of law.
Click to expand...

I agree with that sentiment if you would be saying you'd do something illegal, such as-

"I would hunt down that accused pedophile and burn him alive while dancing around his flaming corpse."

But if you just say that you'd do something legal and appropriate, like-

"If someone tried to rob me with a deadly weapon, I would fear for my life and defend it"

then there's nothing that can be held against you in any court.
 

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