WHAT DO YOU HATE THE MOST ABOUT COLT 1911s YES EVEN THE OLDER SERIES 70 GUNS ?????

fencer said:
Well, when I went into the Marine Corps homosexuality was still a dis qualifier, and you were asked. I will grant you that there have always been gay men and women in the military, but they enlisted fraudulently. However, to your point, when I have visited my fathers grave in Bourne or my brothers in Sarasota, I have never once given a single thought to the percentage of gay people interred, because it does not matter to me, but obviously it does to you.

Now, you may not appreciate my suggestion that a guy that drives a Prius and eats tofu, might be gay, but truth be told, the chances are better than average. I also understand that your post was an attempt to make me feel guilty for my comment or ashamed of myself for not being more sympathetic towards gay men, and had nothing to do with the military, but I am not.
Some people were raised to believe that homosexuality is a sin and unnatural, and to try to make us, not just accept it, but condone it, is far more offensive than a Prius joke. I hope when you visit Arlington you don't feel the same level of contempt for those of us who were raised this way. You know, the other 93% of us.
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Fascinating. fencer, who/what were the influencers during your upbringing that affected you in the manner you report? Be specific.
 
polygraph603 said:
Fascinating. fencer, who/what were the influencers during your upbringing that affected you in the manner you report? Be specific.
Click to expand...
…why?

It‘s a fun thread that most of us are enjoying. Why are you pissing in our collective cheerios?

Want to psychoanalyze fencer? PM is the appropriate place for it, though don’t be shocked if he tells you to get bent. I certainly would.
 
Boghog1 said:
I would argue you should have a ruger no1 on your list.

What I hate about the Colt 1911 is the owners who think they are the be all end all in pistols.
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I think the "1911 is the best pistol ever" crowd is less about the 1911 and more about how gun information was spread back in the day.

Let's say it's 1990. You're shopping for a new handgun. Where are you going to get information?

Probably not the internet unless you're super cutting edge at the time, and gun guys tend to not be super cutting edge when it comes to tech (yeah there's the IT/engineer gun guys but that's a specific niche). And probably not TV because the concept of unsponsored, unpaid, direct reviews of guns on TV didn't yet exist like it now does on YouTube.

That leaves:

(1) Dead tree media, like American Rifleman, which is paid advertising;
(2) The gun club and competitive shooting;
(3) The gun store;
(4) Friends and family; and
(5) Military experience.

If you're relying on 1-4, you'd probably get a lot of stuff that sounds like "the 1911 is the best pistol ever" by Jeff Cooper, and "GREATEST BATTLE IMPLEMENT EVER DEVISED" about the M1 from CMP/GCA sources, and "the deadliest mushrooms in the forest" about Remington Core Lokt.

Meanwhile, at the same time, I know vets who saw some really abused and nasty 1911s towards the end of its service life. On the flip side, a vet who used a nicer 1911 in say WW2 or Korea or Vietnam or peacetime service would probably have a much more positive view of it.

I think most people under 40 these days don't tend to idealize specific guns as much because information is out there that allows for more informed decisions and much different choices. Want a $400 pistol from Slovenia without any mainstream distribution in the US? No problem, I have one. Want the latest news about gun developments? No problem, all that's available online. Want to get a gun not available locally at the gun shop? Easy.

That, and people have more disposable income these days. If all you can afford are a couple rifles, a shotgun, and a handgun, you're probably going to fixate more on what you have. Same's true today - newer gun owners who haven't bought many guns don't have the experience to objectively view their buys, usually. If you give someone who never owned or shot a handgun before a Glock, they'd be using that Glock as their benchmark for what a good handgun is because that's all they know.

Edit: oh and movies. Movies were a lot more effective for gun advertising back before the internet. The Dirty Harry movies drove up sales of the S&W M29. I can't see that happening today. Imagine a cop show where the cop talks up his new S&W .30 Super Carry. Probably won't move the needle that much. With 1911s, there were tons of famous war movies that had 1911s - A Bridge Too Far is a good example.
 
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C. Stockwell said:
I think the "1911 is the best pistol ever" crowd is less about the 1911 and more about how gun information was spread back in the day.

Let's say it's 1990. You're shopping for a new handgun. Where are you going to get information?

Probably not the internet unless you're super cutting edge at the time, and gun guys tend to not be super cutting edge when it comes to tech (yeah there's the IT/engineer gun guys but that's a specific niche). And probably not TV because the concept of unsponsored, unpaid, direct reviews of guns on TV didn't yet exist like it now does on YouTube.

That leaves:

(1) Dead tree media, like American Rifleman, which is paid advertising;
(2) The gun club and competitive shooting;
(3) The gun store;
(4) Friends and family; and
(5) Military experience.

If you're relying on 1-4, you'd probably get a lot of stuff that sounds like "the 1911 is the best pistol ever" by Jeff Cooper, and "GREATEST BATTLE IMPLEMENT EVER DEVISED" about the M1 from CMP/GCA sources, and "the deadliest mushrooms in the forest" about Remington Core Lokt.

Meanwhile, at the same time, I know vets who saw some really abused and nasty 1911s towards the end of its service life. On the flip side, a vet who used a nicer 1911 in say WW2 or Korea or Vietnam or peacetime service would probably have a much more positive view of it.

I think most people under 40 these days don't tend to idealize specific guns as much because information is out there that allows for more informed decisions and much different choices. Want a $400 pistol from Slovenia without any mainstream distribution in the US? No problem, I have one. Want the latest news about gun developments? No problem, all that's available online. Want to get a gun not available locally at the gun shop? Easy.

That, and people have more disposable income these days. If all you can afford are a couple rifles, a shotgun, and a handgun, you're probably going to fixate more on what you have. Same's true today - newer gun owners who haven't bought many guns don't have the experience to objectively view their buys, usually. If you give someone who never owned or shot a handgun before a Glock, they'd be using that Glock as their benchmark for what a good handgun is because that's all they know.

Edit: oh and movies. Movies were a lot more effective for gun advertising back before the internet. The Dirty Harry movies drove up sales of the S&W M29. I can't see that happening today. Imagine a cop show where the cop talks up his new S&W .30 Super Carry. Probably won't move the needle that much. With 1911s, there were tons of famous war movies that had 1911s - A Bridge Too Far is a good example.
Click to expand...

Yeah. I started buying guns before the Internet.

The 1911 was just about the only pistol I knew, mostly because of movies and GI Joe. The fact that I actually liked the one I bought, and shot it pretty well? That was a bonus.

I've told this story before, but I brought that first 1911 out to an M9 range I was running at Ft Bragg and my platoon sergeant wanted to fire it. He'd been in the Army long enough to have carried a 1911 when he was with the Berlin Brigade in the late '80s. He said mine fired just like the one he'd been issued. "Even malfunctions the same!" he smiled; it occasionally failed to go entirely into battery.

It was one of the AutoOrd 1911A1 repros, an early one.
 
C. Stockwell said:
I think the "1911 is the best pistol ever" crowd is less about the 1911 and more about how gun information was spread back in the day.

Let's say it's 1990. You're shopping for a new handgun. Where are you going to get information?

Probably not the internet unless you're super cutting edge at the time, and gun guys tend to not be super cutting edge when it comes to tech (yeah there's the IT/engineer gun guys but that's a specific niche). And probably not TV because the concept of unsponsored, unpaid, direct reviews of guns on TV didn't yet exist like it now does on YouTube.

That leaves:

(1) Dead tree media, like American Rifleman, which is paid advertising;
(2) The gun club and competitive shooting;
(3) The gun store;
(4) Friends and family; and
(5) Military experience.

If you're relying on 1-4, you'd probably get a lot of stuff that sounds like "the 1911 is the best pistol ever" by Jeff Cooper, and "GREATEST BATTLE IMPLEMENT EVER DEVISED" about the M1 from CMP/GCA sources, and "the deadliest mushrooms in the forest" about Remington Core Lokt.

Meanwhile, at the same time, I know vets who saw some really abused and nasty 1911s towards the end of its service life. On the flip side, a vet who used a nicer 1911 in say WW2 or Korea or Vietnam or peacetime service would probably have a much more positive view of it.

I think most people under 40 these days don't tend to idealize specific guns as much because information is out there that allows for more informed decisions and much different choices. Want a $400 pistol from Slovenia without any mainstream distribution in the US? No problem, I have one. Want the latest news about gun developments? No problem, all that's available online. Want to get a gun not available locally at the gun shop? Easy.

That, and people have more disposable income these days. If all you can afford are a couple rifles, a shotgun, and a handgun, you're probably going to fixate more on what you have. Same's true today - newer gun owners who haven't bought many guns don't have the experience to objectively view their buys, usually. If you give someone who never owned or shot a handgun before a Glock, they'd be using that Glock as their benchmark for what a good handgun is because that's all they know.

Edit: oh and movies. Movies were a lot more effective for gun advertising back before the internet. The Dirty Harry movies drove up sales of the S&W M29. I can't see that happening today. Imagine a cop show where the cop talks up his new S&W .30 Super Carry. Probably won't move the needle that much. With 1911s, there were tons of famous war movies that had 1911s - A Bridge Too Far is a good example.
Click to expand...
Well said, and that's why JMB'S 1911 Jam-o-Matic is the most over-rated handgun in history.

A century of propaganda fuels the current adoration of the 1911 Jam-o-Matic, and the lovefest shows no signs of slowing down.

1911 fanbois are like climate change whackos -- fiercely committed to their religion -- as evidenced by fanatical worship of its gods and idols (JMB, Cooper, et al) -- and profoundly averse to arguments rooted in critical thinking.

But that's how the zealouts were raised.
 
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polygraph603 said:
A century of propaganda fuels the current adoration of the 1911 Jam-o-Matic, and the lovefest shows no signs of slowing down.
Click to expand...
What do you expect? The army is keenly interested in equipment that does not fail in a middle of a battle. Yet, it took them 60 years to replace 1911. I suspect the "halo" around 1911's among civvies will wane in another 20 years...
 
polygraph603 said:
Well said, and that's why JMB'S 1911 Jam-o-Matic is the most over-rated handgun in history.

A century of propaganda fuels the current adoration of the 1911 Jam-o-Matic, and the lovefest shows no signs of slowing down.

1911 fanbois are like climate change whackos -- fiercely committed to their religion -- as evidenced by fanatical worship of its gods and idols (JMB, Cooper, et al) -- and profoundly averse to arguments rooted in critical thinking.

But that's how the zealouts were raised.
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My guess is that you prefer IKEA over antique Mission style oak furniture?
 
Soundwave said:
My S&W E-series has never jammed. My Gen 5 Glock 17 I bought with 500 rounds through it jammed on my first range trip. I couldn't even get the slide to budge. Had to fix it at home. THOSE DAMN JAM-O-MATIC GLOCKS!
Click to expand...
Looks like the 1911-apologist canard about the "break-in period" doesn't apply here. [rofl]
 
Bt74 said:
This plasticgun slide didn't budge either :p :View attachment 594640
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Nobody has still ever verified that pic, fwiw. IMHO someone took an M80 hand and put a pic of a blown up glock next to it.

I've seen plenty of other "glock hands" after a gun explosion and most of them involved superficial wounds compared to that.

The most common glock hands are the ones where the owner actually shot themselves in the hand with the gun, but is that the guns fault? [rofl]
 
polygraph603 said:
If you want to psycho-analyze me, send a PM. Otherwise, get bent. [laugh]
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Kinda touchy? Show us on the doll where the 1911 touched you. Actually, my analogy was comparing a well constructed, heavy, piece, built by real craftsmen, compares to a modern cheezy piece of crap? Glock fanboys seem to get their panties in a bunch awful easily.
 
Bt74 said:
Kinda touchy? Show us on the doll where the 1911 touched you. Actually, my analogy was comparing a well constructed, heavy, piece, built by real craftsmen, compares to a modern cheezy piece of crap? Glock fanboys seem to get their panties in a bunch awful easily.
Click to expand...

Nah, he's just plagiarizing something I wrote to him earlier.

This has become one of those situations where it might be wisest to stop feeding the troll.
 
Bt74 said:
Kinda touchy? Show us on the doll where the 1911 touched you. Actually, my analogy was comparing a well constructed, heavy, piece, built by real craftsmen, compares to a modern cheezy piece of crap? Glock fanboys seem to get their panties in a bunch awful easily.
Click to expand...
Yeah, those guys who worked at the Colt factory in the mid-1970s when I bought my first Jam-o-Matic were real "craftsmen." :rolleyes:

As for your doll question, we've been through this before...

1911 victims are most often touched nearest the spot where one carries their wallet.
 
It appears that half of the reasons for 1911 greatness is the fact that it is metal(see fake Glock hand picture above). This is not a unique feature of 1911. There are modern metal guns with far better reliability. Heck, even M9/Beretta92 has a better reliability record. Metal CZ 75 series are way more reliable too.

As to why 1911 is still popular:
Let's face it, 1911 is like Harley Davidson: it USED to be a racing bike but today, with far more powerful and far more reliable motorcycles, HD has become a poser bike and a status symbol. Dentists and old people who remember days when Harley was "modern", buy $40,000 Harleys so they can dress up in leathers and pretend for a week in spring that they're bad-ass bikers.
 
Sammy said:
It appears that half of the reasons for 1911 greatness is the fact that it is metal(see fake Glock hand picture above). This is not a unique feature of 1911. There are modern metal guns with far better reliability. Heck, even M9/Beretta92 has a better reliability record. Metal CZ 75 series are way more reliable too.

As to why 1911 is still popular:
Let's face it, 1911 is like Harley Davidson: it USED to be a racing bike but today, with far more powerful and far more reliable motorcycles, HD has become a poser bike and a status symbol. Dentists and old people who remember days when Harley was "modern", buy $40,000 Harleys so they can dress up in leathers and pretend for a week in spring that they're bad-ass bikers.
Click to expand...
Your comments about Harleys is spot on.

It's amazing who many people get sucked into that subculture and end up dropping tens of thousands of dollars on those obsolete, wheezing pieces of sh*t.

To top it off, the Murican HD is made up of about 40% foreign parts.

There's a peer-pressure element hard at work here, both in the gun culture and the motorcycle scene.

And if you wanna talk "craftmanship," Harleys are most fertile ground.

I'll start with the crappy cam-chain tensioning system on the twin cam and M8 motors.

HD got it right with the gear-driven quad-cam sportster starting in the 1950s, but that's a girl's bike. [rofl]
 
Sammy said:
It appears that half of the reasons for 1911 greatness is the fact that it is metal(see fake Glock hand picture above). This is not a unique feature of 1911.


There are modern metal guns with far better reliability. Heck, even M9/Beretta92 has a better reliability record. Metal CZ 75 series are way more reliable too.
Click to expand...

Sure but they still don't have the ergnomics or trigger of a 1911. Back not long ago I had a Sig P220 that could basically take any 1911 to the cleaners on
reliability, but it is not a gun for everyone and has its own shortcomings in other areas. But it /would/ embarass a 1911 in terms of just pouring garbage down the
chute and having it fire it downrange without complaint. [rofl]

There are hybrids that get there but never take off. Think of things like SW 945, Dan Wesson DWX (which is vaporware) etc. Because of a lack of 3rd party
stuff.

As to why 1911 is still popular:
Let's face it, 1911 is like Harley Davidson: it USED to be a racing bike but today, with far more powerful and far more reliable motorcycles, HD has become a poser bike and a status symbol. Dentists and old people who remember days when Harley was "modern", buy $40,000 Harleys so they can dress up in leathers and pretend for a week in spring that they're bad-ass bikers.
Click to expand...

Yes theres some 110% HD style brand faggotry with the platform but thats another thing... a 1911 is a platform not a brand. Sure there are less beer fgts, Krapber types, etc, but thats
not an absolute.

Some people are on the platform because their needs are not met elsewhere. Even if it is easy to argue in a lot of aspects the platform is fundamentally a steaming turd in a lot of
ways, it's the issue of "it has this, the others dont" that keeps people around.

Also WRT "racing" unlike HD, 1911s and 2011s (we might as well lump them in the mix because theyre just as much of a dumpster fire) are still relevant in many gun
games.

HD Analogy sort of sucks in one other way- There are clearly bikes that exist that do everything better than an HD does, with the exception of the farting noise the exhaust makes and the
logo. The 1911's reason for existence isnt quite in that level of "shallow c***" land. [rofl]

One other thing..... big part of the reason 1911 is still relevant is its one of the few open platform handguns that exists. You can make parts and shit for it, and unless you directly ripped off
someone elses part or something, its difficult to get sued for it. Theres no IP Blockade around 1911s. That cant be said for too many others in modern use.
 
I purchased a Colt Combat Commander series 80 back in 1984 and I owned it for 9 years but no matter how much I spend or what I had done to the pistol it was never 100% reliable. Yes, I brought t to La Roccas gun works but nothing he did would make that pistol 100% reliable. I have tried every kind of ammo that was being made including reloads but the best I was able to get was around 90% reliable. Since I sold it I never bought another .45 of any type or brand. I think I'll stick with my Glock and H&K.
 
Sparky123 said:
I purchased a Colt Combat Commander series 80 back in 1984 and I owned it for 9 years but no matter how much I spend or what I had done to the pistol it was never 100% reliable. Yes, I brought t to La Roccas gun works but nothing he did would make that pistol 100% reliable. I have tried every kind of ammo that was being made including reloads but the best I was able to get was around 90% reliable. Since I sold it I never bought another .45 of any type or brand. I think I'll stick with my Glock and H&K.
Click to expand...

I've never dealt with him but if he was unable to tell you why it was broken you needed a different smith. That gun probably had a bent frame or some shit
like that going on. I have seen 1911s that were just fundamentally bad guns from the factory, and when you have a piece of dog meat like that? forget it you will bash
your head into the wall long before it will ever work right.

Even though I own like 4 of the things I wouldn't blame anyone for swearing off 1911s if they have other guns that work better and no desire to keep it. If keeping the guns around doesnt
result in a perceived "win" for you then dump that shit and move on. [laugh] Especially if you don't care or arent impacted by any of the other stuff.
 
Sparky123 said:
I purchased a Colt Combat Commander series 80 back in 1984 and I owned it for 9 years but no matter how much I spend or what I had done to the pistol it was never 100% reliable. Yes, I brought t to La Roccas gun works but nothing he did would make that pistol 100% reliable. I have tried every kind of ammo that was being made including reloads but the best I was able to get was around 90% reliable. Since I sold it I never bought another .45 of any type or brand. I think I'll stick with my Glock and H&K.
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I feel your pain.

Did any 1911 sodomites ever suggest your malfunctions were the result of limp wristing? That's a common denial mechanism that's often bandied about in Jam-o-Matic self-help and group therapy circles.

Also, I agree that the Sig 220 is a trustworthy gun. Long ago I had one sold under the Browning BDA label. It cycled everything under the sun and was highly accurate.
 
polygraph603 said:
I feel your pain.

Did any 1911 sodomites ever suggest your malfunctions were the result of limp wristing? That's a common denial mechanism that's often bandied about in Jam-o-Matic self-help and group therapy circles.

Also, I agree that the Sig 220 is a trustworthy gun. Long ago I had one sold under the Browning BDA label. It cycled everything under the sun and was highly accurate.
Click to expand...
This guy. [laugh2]
I find all of this pretty hilarious, but I have a feeling that moderation is imminent. Lighten up Francis.


View: https://media.giphy.com/media/krhW9yWEI0x0Y/giphy.gif
 
Another thought on why 1911 is still around is the fact that they work very well for some. While most here seem to think their 1911's are unreliable, my 1911 from S&W is hella reliable even though I appear to be in a minority. Most S&W 1911 owners don't like 'em.

I also think there is something to the "gun fits person" theory. I have a very gucci Glock 19: custom barrel, slide, Timney trigger, fancy sights, etc. That thing is super reliable. I could spend a day doing nothing but dump mags and I'm sure it will keep on ticking. My friend hates that Glock! He can't get through two mags without the thing jamming!
 
Sammy said:
Another thought on why 1911 is still around is the fact that they work very well for some. While most here seem to think their 1911's are unreliable, my 1911 from S&W is hella reliable even though I appear to be in a minority. Most S&W 1911 owners don't like 'em.
Click to expand...

Not sure where you get this idea from, as someone who has been around bowling pin shoots for a long ass time in MA I havent run into too much hate
for them, given that they made up like 80% of the 1911s that would show up.

I have seen some f***ed up smiths on the line but hardly a majority. For the average smoe most of them worked fine. Unless you were that guy that got the
"off" one here or there.
 
Sammy said:
Another thought on why 1911 is still around is the fact that they work very well for some. While most here seem to think their 1911's are unreliable, my 1911 from S&W is hella reliable even though I appear to be in a minority. Most S&W 1911 owners don't like 'em.

I also think there is something to the "gun fits person" theory. I have a very gucci Glock 19: custom barrel, slide, Timney trigger, fancy sights, etc. That thing is super reliable. I could spend a day doing nothing but dump mags and I'm sure it will keep on ticking. My friend hates that Glock! He can't get through two mags without the thing jamming!
Click to expand...

Mine (e-series round butt) always worked well, too.

I regret trading it. A lot of the time.[wink]
 

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