1. If you enjoy the forum please consider supporting it by signing up for a NES Membership  The benefits pay for the membership many times over.

  2. Dismiss Notice

Hopkinton chief pulls 3 officers' LTCs

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by JJ4, Apr 2, 2019.

  1. JJ4

    JJ4 NES Member

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2013
    Messages:
    2,764
    Likes Received:
    1,150
    Location:
    South Central MA
    This is interesting...

    Metrowest Daily News article: Hopkinton police chief pulls gun licenses from three officers

    The officers -... - have been on “injured on duty” leave for a year and a half and not working shifts, according to town officials.
    ...

    Lee sent letters informing the officers of their firearms license suspensions to their respective hometowns on Dec. 14. As part of the suspension, the officers must turn in all licenses, guns and ammunition to their local police station.

    “You are no longer deemed suitable as a result of post-traumatic stress related to injuries incurred while on duty,” the chief wrote to all three officers. “This is supported by medical reports.”


    [Bolding mine. Full story in link.]
     
    308rifleman likes this.
  2. appraiser

    appraiser NES Member

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2008
    Messages:
    8,994
    Likes Received:
    2,288
    WOW, they are eating their own.

    How do they ever get them back? (Court appeal?)
    P.O.P.A. protections and privileges just got shut off

    How can he pull a license issued in another town?

    What a D*CK
     
    amm5061 and PATRON like this.
  3. gamma19

    gamma19

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2011
    Messages:
    1,835
    Likes Received:
    850
    Location:
    Sheltering in place!
    Wow, cops being treated like us ordinary peasants in this state!
     
  4. PappyM3

    PappyM3 NES Member

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2012
    Messages:
    1,013
    Likes Received:
    293
    Sure sounds like they were gaming the worker’s comp game and ol’ Chief-boy decided to go full tyrant on them as payback. It’s also pretty ridiculous to use post traumatic stress as the reason, and what medical records does the chief have access to? Medical records should only be visible to certain individuals.

    Lastly, I’m a little confused about one aspect. He says he mailed the revocation orders to their hometowns. I guess they all lived in Hopkinton at one point within 6 years and he was the original issuer.
     
    Bob P, mibro, commodon and 2 others like this.
  5. PappyM3

    PappyM3 NES Member

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2012
    Messages:
    1,013
    Likes Received:
    293
    Good thing he doesn’t need to run down any criminals as chief
    [​IMG]
     
    Orvanic and snubnose like this.
  6. Squire

    Squire

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2009
    Messages:
    4,467
    Likes Received:
    2,009
    I might have to invest in a Dunkin' franchise in Hopkinton...

     
    Boris and crispnipz like this.
  7. Waher

    Waher NES Member

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2014
    Messages:
    7,705
    Likes Received:
    5,878
    Location:
    BG&RA, BR&PC
    I'm wondering if they were off duty claiming injuries while working lucrative full time security gigs on their ltcs. The chief would be stomping on this disability fraud by yanking their credentials.

    Also I wonder in the grand scheme of things if this opens a lawsuit against suitability on the basis of discrimination against persons with disabilities? Denied a constitutional right due to a disability?
     
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2019
    beaker, Leica_f32 and buckfarack like this.
  8. M1911

    M1911 Moderator NES Member

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2005
    Messages:
    39,004
    Likes Received:
    6,803
    Location:
    Near Framingham
    Chiefs routinely issue LTCs to their officers, whether they live in town or elsewhere.
     
  9. cams

    cams NES Member

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2013
    Messages:
    3,139
    Likes Received:
    7,913
    Location:
    Boston
    Well, I hope no recently ETS’d young Veterans were looking to move to Hopkington. He just set the standard for asshattery in that town. I predict more to follow, hopefully, lot of questions can be raised here.

    As a reminder, never take a right out of TJ’s if you’ve even had one beer.
     
    mothybee, Rat187, robjax and 7 others like this.
  10. Chevy 2 65

    Chevy 2 65 NES Member

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2013
    Messages:
    14,417
    Likes Received:
    5,121
    Location:
    Somewhere in the sands of time
    Chief seems like a dickhead. He has it out for those guys for sure.
     
    LTCRN likes this.
  11. nutsym16

    nutsym16 NES Member

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2007
    Messages:
    432
    Likes Received:
    347
    Hopkinton, where the marathon starts and your license to carry ends.
     
  12. JJ4

    JJ4 NES Member

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2013
    Messages:
    2,764
    Likes Received:
    1,150
    Location:
    South Central MA
    Reading between the lines of the story, I'm guessing the three are claiming that they cannot return to work and perform their duties as officers because of PTSD on-the-job related injuries. They may even be claiming specific symptoms (For example, and I'm making this up here, shaky hands and blurred vision in stressful situations). The chief is then applying the transitive property from 8th grade algebra and saying, essentially, "if you have shaky hands and blurred vision in stressful situations, you clearly shouldn't be carrying a firearm". I suspect that the chief believes the PTSD claims are bullshit and he's trying to call their bluff.
     
    BREWINZ, Picton, AMV and 19 others like this.
  13. JRT

    JRT NES Member

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2013
    Messages:
    1,472
    Likes Received:
    908
    Location:
    Philadelphia, PA
    This isn't about an attack on freedom. This is about three shitty police who want the world to run the way it did 30 years ago using PTSD to rape the town. This is a calculated play by the chief and I applaud him.
     
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2019
    Picton, Roadglide, AMV and 8 others like this.
  14. Len-2A Training

    Len-2A Training Instructor Instructor NES Life Member NES Member

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2005
    Messages:
    50,884
    Likes Received:
    8,287
    Location:
    Escaping to NH
    You'd be surprised at how employers get info that you'd think that HIPAA should protect.

    Likely Hopkinton issues to their officers and some may live elsewhere, so notifying their hometown PD to go and confiscate is SOP.

    Timing seems a bit suspicious however given they've been off the job for ~18 months. For those of us who read the entire article it does raise questions.

    LEOs don't work details on LTCs, they legally don't need LTCs at all. When I worked for the PD, my first chief couldn't convince 1/2 our officers to get LTCs even though he offered them for free back then (long before law changes that give them to their own officers for free).

    This whole deal is suspicious especially since we aren't given a clue what event led to their injuries.
     
  15. xtry51

    xtry51

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2010
    Messages:
    19,947
    Likes Received:
    7,913
    Location:
    NH (CT Escapee)
    I cannot find an article from 2017 about 3 officers being injured.
     
    JJ4 likes this.
  16. 1776

    1776 NES Member

    Joined:
    Mar 5, 2006
    Messages:
    3,321
    Likes Received:
    891
    Location:
    SE MA
    The waiting period and actions most likely clear them for SSDI and supplemental LTD payments.

    When you have a medically documented issue you can only manage it.
     
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2019
  17. Dip Dungles

    Dip Dungles NES Member

    Joined:
    Sep 5, 2012
    Messages:
    2,914
    Likes Received:
    1,368
    Location:
    Central MA
    Couldn't agree more. Hopkinton has been a shit show for years as they will look for any reason to pull you over.
     
    Talon3 and cams like this.
  18. LuvDog

    LuvDog NES Member

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2012
    Messages:
    4,436
    Likes Received:
    1,655
    Location:
    Metrowest
    HaHa... this is a very common saying among those that are familiar with the area and frequent TJs. Even though going that direction is easier for me... I still make the left turn out of that parking lot.
     
    drgelinas, Dip Dungles and cams like this.
  19. swatgig

    swatgig NES Member

    Joined:
    May 26, 2011
    Messages:
    4,927
    Likes Received:
    4,063
    Location:
    Chained together with 999 of my associates at the
    Timing seems suspect. They've been out with PTSD since July of 2017, but their PTSD suddenly makes them unsuitable two days after filing a grievance.
     
  20. amm5061

    amm5061 NES Member

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2016
    Messages:
    6,339
    Likes Received:
    3,924
    Location:
    Holliston, MA
    I've seen Ashland PD sitting in the parking lot, and with the new station going in down the street, taking a left isn't a great idea either.

    And who goes to TJs and drinks beer? You're not getting your money's worth if you aren't drinking the hard stuff there.
     
    drgelinas, Dip Dungles and cams like this.
  21. snubnose

    snubnose

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2015
    Messages:
    647
    Likes Received:
    182
    If the contention/reason for suffering ptsd was job related then the Officers just may still qualify for the -LEOSA- super permit ?
     
  22. appraiser

    appraiser NES Member

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2008
    Messages:
    8,994
    Likes Received:
    2,288
    LEOSA IIRC requires that the Officers right to carry be in good standing, and a couple of other things.



    I can not remember another instance, other than an Officer being accused or convicted of a serious crime, or being the victim of Lautenburg, where a LTC was revoked by a Chief. Even if this was a strong arm tactic by the C.O.P. to get the officers back to work or off the payroll and into retirement status, if this is his way of applying pressure, he is a d*ck, even if the officers are in the wrong.
     
    cams likes this.
  23. ProGun

    ProGun NES Member

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2012
    Messages:
    4,879
    Likes Received:
    1,199
    Location:
    Bizarro World
    The Chief may be a dick, but I have no issue with police getting the same treatment that a citizen gun owner would also be subject to in said town.
     
  24. appraiser

    appraiser NES Member

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2008
    Messages:
    8,994
    Likes Received:
    2,288
    OK playing devils advocate, short of the new "red flag" type legislation, or a "pink slip" committal against ones will (involuntary admission to a mental health facility) , a revocation based on a response where a person was observed being a danger to him/herself or others, or a notification from a medical professional to the licensing authority that a LTC holder was a danger to himself or others based upon statements made, how would a C.O.P. have any knowledge of a reason to yank a LTC?

    If an Officer went to E.A.P. and asked for help with a drinking problem, would a Chief bench them and pull their LTC?

    Look, if you read my posts, you will find the boys in Blue and I are often at odds, but at face value this stinks.

    A local cop that I had a long running battle with was the first officer into an office building where SEVEN people were killed. He walked in and the shooter was sitting there with the gun.... I know for a fact that that cop was never the same.. several reliable sources told me so, but he stayed on the job with his LTC... and he was the poster boy for PTSD IMHO ( and as much as I dislike the man, I would not wish upon my worst enemy what he went thru).
     
    cams likes this.
  25. Whiskeywon

    Whiskeywon NES Member

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2017
    Messages:
    804
    Likes Received:
    565
    Location:
    Western Massachusetts
    He's not saying you should drink beer over hard liquor, he's just saying you shouldn't even so much as drink one beer if you're there given the amount of cops around that are just waiting to spring their trap.
     
    cams likes this.
  26. xtry51

    xtry51

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2010
    Messages:
    19,947
    Likes Received:
    7,913
    Location:
    NH (CT Escapee)
    I still want to know what the original on the job injury event was that hurt three officers.
     
    Fixxah, Jason Flare, xjma99 and 3 others like this.
  27. Mr.E

    Mr.E

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2014
    Messages:
    2,927
    Likes Received:
    1,609
    Hope not. I had zero issues getting my LTC renewed prior to this guy coming in when I lived there. I hope it hasn't taken a turn for the that.
     
  28. Cap'n Mike

    Cap'n Mike NES Member

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2016
    Messages:
    378
    Likes Received:
    432
    Location:
    Mass
    This is why "May Issue" and "suitability" needs to go.
    The Chief should have the right to take their duty weapons and Police IDs, which he did 2 years ago.
    But to take away their Second Amendment rights to keep a firearm in the home, with out due process, is bullshit.
    These Cops are being treated worse than regular citizens, because a regular citizen wouldn't lose their civil rights over a dispute with there employer over an Injury or workers comp.
     
    Bistro, AntiHippie, vicorjh and 6 others like this.
  29. John42056

    John42056 NES Member

    Joined:
    Nov 30, 2018
    Messages:
    64
    Likes Received:
    48
    I looked at the logs for 7/24/17. The only incident listed with 2 out of the 3 officers was them bringing a guy in on a warrant. After that, they don't appear in the logs.
     
    JJ4 and xtry51 like this.
  30. SERE

    SERE NES Life Member NES Member

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2010
    Messages:
    5,024
    Likes Received:
    3,308
    Location:
    North of Boston
    I don't know if they responded to, then suffered PTSD, from this accident

    July 24, 2017 -- At about 5:53 p.m. Sunday evening, Massachusetts State Troopers from the Weston Barracks responded to a crash on Route 90 westbound, near the North Street Overpass, at mile marker 102.5 in Upton. The crash resulted in the death of a girl who had exited a motor vehicle that had pulled into a breakdown lane.

    You'll need to scroll down.
    Hopkinton News - only online !
     

Share This Page