MOVING to Massachusetts? Read Here First!

[sreiter]

Just curious where the OP info came from. I called the Executive Office of Public Safety and Security (people listed on the states web site who issue the CCWs). i asked about bring my weapons here after I got my class a, as opposed to bringing them in before.
They said there was no issue and i didnt even have to self reg the gun. They said its a good idea, but not required This is directly opposite the OP saying the only way to get them here is to bring them in first, then take the class..I guess ultimately, they would have no idea when you bring them in, since you arent required to register them

.also curious to see the actual law re: bringing in a post 1994 AR and having to modify it.. I was at LaRocco gun works today, and he said something totally different. Not saying he's correct, just wondering where the law is written to see for myself - thanks in advance

 

[browncoat]

Just curious where the OP info came from. I called the Executive Office of Public Safety and Security (people listed on the states web site who issue the CCWs). i asked about bring my weapons here after I got my class a, as opposed to bringing them in before.
They said there was no issue and i didnt even have to self reg the gun. They said its a good idea, but not required This is directly opposite the OP saying the only way to get them here is to bring them in first, then take the class..I guess ultimately, they would have no idea when you bring them in, since you arent required to register them

.also curious to see the actual law re: bringing in a post 1994 AR and having to modify it.. I was at LaRocco gun works today, and he said something totally different. Not saying he's correct, just wondering where the law is written to see for myself - thanks in advance

First, what the EOPS says does not have force of law, and they will not be the ones prosecuting you for violations. You can read the law on the move in exemption here (part j): https://malegislature.gov/Laws/GeneralLaws/PartI/TitleXX/Chapter140/Section129c

What you need to look up is the MGL defining the assault weapons ban. However, if you look up that law here: https://malegislature.gov/Laws/GeneralLaws/PartI/TitleXX/Chapter140/Section121

you will find that you actually need to look at the expired federal AWB to get a definition for what is banned.

Here is the part applicable:

(B) a semiautomatic rifle that has an ability to accept a detachable magazine and has at least 2 of--
(i) a folding or telescoping stock;
(ii) a pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon;
(iii) a bayonet mount;
(iv) a flash suppressor or threaded barrel designed to accommodate a flash suppressor; and
(v) a grenade launcher;

 

[browncoat]

So, many modern semi-auto rifles have the pistol grip, which means they can't have any of the other features. It is not legal to bring them into the state with multiple features.

There are two easy and legal options:

1. Ship it to a MA FFL who will make the modifications for you, then pick it up

2. Have the modifications done by a gunsmith before you come.

There are other options that may be more risky or I just didn't think of.

 

[Len-2A Training]

Just curious where the OP info came from. I called the Executive Office of Public Safety and Security (people listed on the states web site who issue the CCWs). i asked about bring my weapons here after I got my class a, as opposed to bringing them in before.
They said there was no issue and i didnt even have to self reg the gun. They said its a good idea, but not required This is directly opposite the OP saying the only way to get them here is to bring them in first, then take the class..I guess ultimately, they would have no idea when you bring them in, since you arent required to register them

.also curious to see the actual law re: bringing in a post 1994 AR and having to modify it.. I was at LaRocco gun works today, and he said something totally different. Not saying he's correct, just wondering where the law is written to see for myself - thanks in advance

EOPS does NOT issue the licenses, your local PD does. EOPS is not expert in MA gun laws and will (sadly) be helpful but give out bad info.

Legally you can not possess any post-9/13/1994 AW in AW configuration in MA for even a second. Legally the gunsmithing work should be done outside MA or ship it to the MA gunsmith from outside MA. Not to say that people don't bring it into gunsmiths in MA all the time, because I'm sure that is the case. However, legally there is no exemption. MGL C. 140 S. 131M Definitions of what constitutes an illegal AW can be found in MGL C. 140 S. 121 (definitions section of MA gun law).

 

[sreiter]

thanks browncoat and 2a

 

[sreiter]

FYI - PER GOAL

E-FA 10

Registration

“Use this option if 1) you are a Massachusetts resident and you obtained a firearm, rifle, shotgun or machine gun from out of state 2) you recently moved to Massachusetts and you wish to record ownership of a firearm, rifle, shotgun or machine gun or 3) you possess a firearm, rifle, shotgun or machine gun and there is no record of the weapon on file with the Firearms Records Bureau.”


Again, there is no requirement in Massachusetts to “Register” any gun. There is only a reporting requirement to match the sale with the type of license. There is no law that allows agencies to compile databases on firearms that are owned.

In regard to :

On 1)...

On 2), there is absolutely no statutory authority to collect information on firearms from people moving into the Commonwealth. Just because the FRB is stating “and you wish” does not make it legal to ask or to collect this information.

On 3)...

#2 is in line with what I was told on the phone - YMMV

 

[sreiter]

First, what the EOPS says does not have force of law, and they will not be the ones prosecuting you for violations. You can read the law on the move in exemption here (part j): https://malegislature.gov/Laws/GeneralLaws/PartI/TitleXX/Chapter140/Section129c

Maybe I wasn't clear, or maybe I'm reading this wrong..but

Section 129C. No person, other than a licensed dealer or one who has been issued a license to carry a pistol or revolver or an exempt person as hereinafter described, shall own or possess any firearm, rifle, shotgun or ammunition unless he has been issued a firearm identification card by the licensing authority pursuant to the provisions of section one hundred and twenty-nine B.

(exemptions)

(j) Any resident of the commonwealth returning after having been absent from the commonwealth for not less than 180 consecutive days or any new resident moving into the commonwealth, with respect to any firearm, rifle or shotgun and any ammunition therefor then in his possession, for 60 days after such return or entry into the commonwealth;


What that says to me is IF I move here with my guns in my possession and have 60 days to get a license without being in violation of the law.

It doesnt say anything about me being here, getting my license, then at some time in the future (> 60 days of moving here) bringing in my weapons from out of state (which is what the OP says ie "You can bring your firearms with you when you move, and this may be desirable as this is the only way you can get your firearms into the state without having to file registration forms on them once they're here." )

It appears to me that this statement is incorrect (IANAL)

 

[browncoat]

Maybe I wasn't clear, or maybe I'm reading this wrong..but

Section 129C. No person, other than a licensed dealer or one who has been issued a license to carry a pistol or revolver or an exempt person as hereinafter described, shall own or possess any firearm, rifle, shotgun or ammunition unless he has been issued a firearm identification card by the licensing authority pursuant to the provisions of section one hundred and twenty-nine B.
(exemptions)

(j) Any resident of the commonwealth returning after having been absent from the commonwealth for not less than 180 consecutive days or any new resident moving into the commonwealth, with respect to any firearm, rifle or shotgun and any ammunition therefor then in his possession, for 60 days after such return or entry into the commonwealth;


What that says to me is I can move here with my guns in my possession and have 60 days to get a license without being in violation of the law.

It doesnt say anything about me being here, getting my license, then at some time in the future > 60 days of moving here then bringing in my weapons from out of state (which is what the OP says ie "You can bring your firearms with you when you move, and this may be desirable as this is the only way you can get your firearms into the state without having to file registration forms on them once they're here." )

It appears to me that this statement is incorrect (IANAL)

If you bring in firearms after you have your ltc, you need to "register" them via FA-10. You aren't looking at the right part of the law. The requirement to file fa - 10 applies to every resident with fid or ltc who brings a gun into MA.

 

[browncoat]

Here is the law that applies to those who hold an Ltc or FID,which is the requirement to use FA10 and why you are wrong and OP is right: https://malegislature.gov/Laws/GeneralLaws/PartI/TitleXX/Chapter140/Section128B

 

[browncoat]

In other words, there isn't an exception that applies after you have an LTC. If you are interested in understanding MA gun law, be prepared to do a lot of reading because it is pretty disjointed

 

[browncoat]

Finally, there may be no authority by which they can construct a database of guns that you own, and neither do the current laws allow the construction of a perfectly accurate database. However, they can make an educated guess, and they can build a list of guns they think you own if they ever have a reason to seize them, say for a 209A situation. They have in the past.

 

[Sf Becket]

It sounds to me that if you are a non resident with a Ltc and you are moving to Massachusetts the thing to do would be to let your non resident Ltc expire prior to moving then you will avoid registration of your firearms?

 

[sreiter]

In other words, there isn't an exception that applies after you have an LTC. If you are interested in understanding MA gun law, be prepared to do a lot of reading because it is pretty disjointed

I'm coming here from Ca. and spent the last 20 years trying to understand their laws...I know the struggle all too well

appreciate you're insight/assistance

 

[browncoat]

I'm coming here from Ca. and spent the last 20 years trying to understand their laws...I know the struggle all too well

appreciate you're insight/assistance

Congratulations, you are one of the few who are moving into a more free state. Not too many places worse, but CA definitely is

 

[sreiter]

Here is the law that applies to those who hold an Ltc or FID,which is the requirement to use FA10 and why you are wrong and OP is right: https://malegislature.gov/Laws/GeneralLaws/PartI/TitleXX/Chapter140/Section128B

I'm not trying to be argumentative, and certainly what I think and what the DA thinks can greatly differ... but, for discussions sake, the above ..

Section 128B. Any resident of the commonwealth who purchases or obtains a firearm, rifle or shotgun or machine gun from any source within or without the commonwealth,.. within seven days after receiving such firearm, rifle, shotgun or machine gun, report, in writing, to the commissioner of the department of criminal justice information services the name and address of the seller or donor and the buyer or donee,...

None of those apply, as they're my weapons. there is no 'seller, donor, buyer, or donee' to list.
And I guess it depends on their definition of what "obtain" is. I've already obtained the weapons.

- - - Updated - - -

Congratulations, you are one of the few who are moving into a more free state. Not too many places worse, but CA definitely is

LOL - I bought a gun here and felt like I was in a free state when i was able to leave with the gun the same day I purchased it

Not to mention I got a class-a and in L.A. NO ONE gets a CCW

 

[308rifleman]

Here is the law that applies to those who hold an Ltc or FID,which is the requirement to use FA10 and why you are wrong and OP is right: https://malegislature.gov/Laws/GeneralLaws/PartI/TitleXX/Chapter140/Section128B

Assuming that I can even get an FID with my BCD from the military (all I did was refuse the dangerous and untested anthrax vaccine!), I will have to register both of my bolt-action rifles and my two pump-action shotguns as well with this FA10 thing? Maybe purchasing a home in southern NH may be the better choice? Kind of confused here. Thought FID was a shall-issue permit and the chief would have to prove that I was a menace to society or something in court. Other than a BCD, never had any legal problems. Keep a low profile and live quietly with my wife and kids.

 

[browncoat]

Assuming that I can even get an FID with my BCD from the military (all I did was refuse the dangerous and untested anthrax vaccine!), I will have to register both of my bolt-action rifles and my two pump-action shotguns as well with this FA10 thing? Maybe purchasing a home in southern NH may be the better choice? Kind of confused here. Thought FID was a shall-issue permit and the chief would have to prove that I was a menace to society or something in court. Other than a BCD, never had any legal problems. Keep a low profile and live quietly with my wife and kids.

If you bring in guns when you move, you don't need to FA-10 them.

An FID used to be shall issue. Now, FID have essentially the same chief discretion as LTC. Now, a chief who wouldn't give you an LTC might be more willing to give you an FID - but that would be up to the chief to decide.

Purchasing a home in NH would let you avoid all that. It may even let you get a NH P&R permit. However, NH is technically not a shall issue state. They are almost entirely shall issue, but some towns have denied people for things that are not statutory disqualifiers.

 

[308rifleman]

If you bring in guns when you move, you don't need to FA-10 them.

An FID used to be shall issue. Now, FID have essentially the same chief discretion as LTC. Now, a chief who wouldn't give you an LTC might be more willing to give you an FID - but that would be up to the chief to decide.

Purchasing a home in NH would let you avoid all that. It may even let you get a NH P&R permit. However, NH is technically not a shall issue state. They are almost entirely shall issue, but some towns have denied people for things that are not statutory disqualifiers.

So, a Masachusetts chief can just arbitrarily deny my an FID card. Interesting. So, a chief can theoretically disarm his or her whole city or town by denying all firearms licenses across the board with no Second Amendment prohibitions whatsoever. Should make an interesting SCOTUS case, similar to Heller and McDonald. Maybe NH is the best choice in this scenario. The FBI and the ATF told me that I am not prohibited under federal law because of my BCD. In fact, I passed the NICS checks when I purchased those rifles and shotguns.

 

[browncoat]

So, a Masachusetts chief can just arbitrarily deny my an FID card. Interesting. So, a chief can theoretically disarm his or her whole city or town by denying all firearms licenses across the board with no Second Amendment prohibitions whatsoever. Should make an interesting SCOTUS case, similar to Heller and McDonald. Maybe NH is the best choice in this scenario. The FBI and the ATF told me that I am not prohibited under federal law because of my BCD. In fact, I passed the NICS checks when I purchased those rifles and shotguns.

The denials are subject to court appeals. Courts in MA have a tendency to side with chiefs, but in the case of a chief not issuing licenses wholesale, even an MA court would over rule the chief. In your scenario, the fact that you have a BCD gives the chief leverage against you that a court might not overturn. I would guess that there are probably chiefs in "green" towns who would issue without a problem. I just don't know. Maybe somebody else has better information.

 

[308rifleman]

The denials are subject to court appeals. Courts in MA have a tendency to side with chiefs, but in the case of a chief not issuing licenses wholesale, even an MA court would over rule the chief. In your scenario, the fact that you have a BCD gives the chief leverage against you that a court might not overturn. I would guess that there are probably chiefs in "green" towns who would issue without a problem. I just don't know. Maybe somebody else has better information.

My attorney told me to go ahead and apply. I have to answer Question 10 in the affirmative and explain that the court martial and BCD was the result of refusing the mandatory anthrax vaccine, which high-ranking military officers, including doctors, have also refused. There is no equivalent punishment in the civilian world, other than losing one's job, for refusing vaccines. Attorney stated that as long as the BCD was not the result of violence, drug-dealing, stealing government property or treason, I should be OK. I did pass all NICS checks to purchase the shotguns and rifles, so I am not a prohibited person. He stated that the chief would have to go to court with credible evidence, not hearsay, and prove to a judge that I am a danger to society. The attorney said that is not the case, since my only "crime" was refusal of an order to take a drug that I feared may cause permanent damage to my health. Worse case scenario, attorney will have chief served with federal lawsuit by a U.S. Deputy Marshal. That will likely change his turn really quickly!

 

[browncoat]

My attorney told me to go ahead and apply. I have to answer Question 10 in the affirmative and explain that the court martial and BCD was the result of refusing the mandatory anthrax vaccine, which high-ranking military officers, including doctors, have also refused. There is no equivalent punishment in the civilian world, other than losing one's job, for refusing vaccines. Attorney stated that as long as the BCD was not the result of violence, drug-dealing, stealing government property or treason, I should be OK. I did pass all NICS checks to purchase the shotguns and rifles, so I am not a prohibited person. He stated that the chief would have to go to court with credible evidence, not hearsay, and prove to a judge that I am a danger to society. The attorney said that is not the case, since my only "crime" was refusal of an order to take a drug that I feared may cause permanent damage to my health. Worse case scenario, attorney will have chief served with federal lawsuit by a U.S. Deputy Marshal. That will likely change his turn really quickly!

Cool, good luck.

 

[jrock427]

I m moving to ma from Florida with a few glocks and an under folding ak not pre ban. do I need to pin once I'm here or just buy new mags?

 

[Tommy Gun]

Both, you need to pin the stock and leave the preban mags behind

 

[PATRON]

I m moving to ma from Florida with a few glocks and an under folding ak not pre ban. do I need to pin once I'm here or just buy new mags?

?

 

[soam]

I m moving to ma from Florida with a few glocks and an under folding ak not pre ban. do I need to pin once I'm here or just buy new mags?

The Glocks are fine to bring.
The AK needs to be made Assault Weapons Ban legal, which means folding stock has to be pinned and muzzle device permanently attached to the barrel.

Magazines that hold more than 10 rounds and were made after Sept 1994 can't be brought into the state, so you'll have to sell/trade them off or leave them with a friend/relative in FL.

 

[ryanc]

Hi,

I have a very odd, hypothetical question...please humor me. Say you have a Massachusetts AWB compliant/high capacity magazine compliant handgun and you live in a different state. If you were to move to MA and you decided not to apply for an LTC upon moving to MA, would you be able to legally sell/transfer your gun away to another MA resident within the first 60 days of moving to MA? (My thought is "no".)

Thanks!

 

[Len-2A Training]

No and not only that per MGL, you can't even bring a MA legal AW or MA legal pre-ban large cap mag or gun into MA when you move here! This is due to two conflicting laws, the one that someone was prosecuted for (and convicted) the judge pointed out (correctly) the no exemption for large-cap anything w/o a MA LTC in-hand . . . has no grace period. I go into detail about it in my MA Gun Law Seminar along with a few work-arounds that I won't post anywhere. I've also requested a high ranking legislator to "fix" this problem.

 

[ryanc]

No and not only that per MGL, you can't even bring a MA legal AW or MA legal pre-ban large cap mag or gun into MA when you move here! This is due to two conflicting laws, the one that someone was prosecuted for (and convicted) the judge pointed out (correctly) the no exemption for large-cap anything w/o a MA LTC in-hand . . . has no grace period. I go into detail about it in my MA Gun Law Seminar along with a few work-arounds that I won't post anywhere. I've also requested a high ranking legislator to "fix" this problem.

Thanks as always, Len. Sending you a quick PM.

 

[turbo89]

Bump - 2 new questions regarding those whom have lived in MA, moved out, then are moving back to the same town:

1) Are you required to re-notify the FRB / Local police that you're moving back (even with an expired license)?

2) If moving to the same town, can one just "renew" their license?

Thanks in advance.

 

[Len-2A Training]

Bump - 2 new questions regarding those whom have lived in MA, moved out, then are moving back to the same town:

1) Are you required to re-notify the FRB / Local police that you're moving back (even with an expired license)?

2) If moving to the same town, can one just "renew" their license?

Thanks in advance.

I haven't moved out yet but never plan on moving back when I do! That said:

1. No notification if the LTC/FID is expired or administratively cancelled due to moving out of MA. You notified on the move, thus no notification on the move back.

2. If you EVER had a MA LTC/FID, even if expired for years, it is considered a "renewal" by FRB. That said the only real difference between new and renewal (legally) is a training cert and fingerprint card. All the other stuff is extra-legal crap thrown in by local chiefs.