Magazine Blocks to reduce capacity. Are they legal in MA?

[citoriguy]

A heat gun and a razor blade can undo just about anything. Or so I’ve heard...

 

[namedpipes]

I bought a newer gun a while back that didn't have prebans or 10 round mags available. The gunsmith put in some kind of plate and rod to keep it at ten rounds, but they all broke and reverted to standard mags after one range trip.

It's not a carry gun, just a range toy so I just use them as is.

Every single mag broke?

 

[Waher]

Unless the magazine is disassembled to be rendered a "part" or modified to be crippled capacity before being brought into the state you are already in clear felony territory just by possessing it without even getting into the question if the modification to downgrade the capacity is legally defensible.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

Some make it relatively impossible to defeat whereas I am told that a few make it relatively easy.

I'm just saying that any mag marked 12, 15, 17, 19, etc. on witness holes would give significant ammo (pardon the pun) to a rambunctious DA and conviction is quite possible. I've had dealings with one such A-hole ADA (but it was a pleasure putting him in his place in front of the judge!) and am aware of others by their actions.

In reality the issue is that the treat would be enough to coerce a plea bargain, especially if the choice were "take the non-PP deal or risk trial".

 

[Asaltweapon]

The GSG mags were pinned and I never removed a single pin for friends.

 

[ReluctantDecoy]

The thought of a mag block, epoxied or not, reminds me of that one case in the last year or two where someone was brought up over a fixed mag AR, and the cop working with the DA mangled the fixed mag out of the lower just to show it could then hold a standard mag. Heard the case went in favor of the defendant, but he still had to endure those tactics. And who knows, depending on the judge, which way that could have gone.

I think the only way I'd go with a mag block and/or riveted mag is purchasing it that way from a dealer who will provide me a receipt that says 10/15, 10/20, or 10/30 on it. That way, if it ever comes up, the focus shifts to the seller, not the user, as I only bought it for 10 rds as it says on the receipt.

 

[1903Collector]

I want a PS90 and this is why I don’t have one

 

[ReluctantDecoy]

I want a PS90 and this is why I don’t have one

Same. I really want one as well, but a 10/50 mag makes me sad.

 

[general disorder]

Or you could just use standard capacity mags. And if a cop gives you a hard time about you can just throw yourself to the ground and scream racism and police brutality. Not sure if that would work but it would at least be quite entertaining.

 

[seanc]

This is the answer, we don't know. It appears that if the mfr does it it is OK. I do believe that if you or I do it, that a MA DA would have an easy time convicting us . . . but that is just one person's belief.

I think Len is correct that this is a gray area that could go bad.

i can see an issue of..
its a 30 round mag.
Ok, so you BOUGHT a post ban 30 round,
you brought it into Mass
and then performed some sort of unknown half assed surgery on it.

And you think that’s ok?

 

[seanc]

Same. I really want one as well, but a 10/50 mag makes me sad.

They have 10 round mags for ps90.

 

[ReluctantDecoy]

They have 10 round mags for ps90.

Yes, that's what I was referring to with the 10/50 mags. With the design of the PS90, the 10rd blocked mags are still as long as the full capacity. So basically 10/50.

 

[In God We Trust]

Every single mag broke?

Every single one. Strange...

 

[wiryone1]

Yes, that's what I was referring to with the 10/50 mags. With the design of the PS90, the 10rd blocked mags are still as long as the full capacity. So basically 10/50.

Ha, that is retarded. That has got to be the most egregious example of the mag law stupidity in MA. That 50 rd mag in that caliber is the whole point of that gun.

 

[South Shore Guns]

Seems the key is "readily converted". I would think epoxy would render that difficult to impossible.
My interpretation- perfectly legal.
My legal experience = Zero.



QUOTE="oppressed, post: 5596397, member: 50926"]
See this thread by Boris: MUST READ: Hi cap mags in every recycle bin. We are all felons !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
[/QUOTE]

 

[308rifleman]

This is the answer, we don't know. It appears that if the mfr does it it is OK. I do believe that if you or I do it, that a MA DA would have an easy time convicting us . . . but that is just one person's belief.

If the ADA can knock out the block with a ball-peen hammer and load the magazine to its full (over 10 rounds) capacity in front of gullible jurors, he/she could very well secure a conviction. Most MA residents know little about firearms, other than they are extremely dangerous and should be used by military and police only. Massachusetts sheeple have been completely pussified!

 

[ncgbulldog]

I have a canik tp9sf, I bought 4 more mags online and they say 17 round on them but they have a dimple on both sides of the mag to keep you from loading to 10 rounds.

 

[Thirwell1216]

They have 10 round mags for ps90.

Yes I have a few. Precision point actually had them for $25 for a while: FN P90, PS90 5.7x28mm 10-Round Factory Magazine

 

[ThePreBanMan]

Friend in MA says that blocks were how his VP9 was massified....

I have the VP9 and that's not true. Not on the factory mags anyway. The magazine body between standard and low capacity are different.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

I have a canik tp9sf, I bought 4 more mags online and they say 17 round on them but they have a dimple on both sides of the mag to keep you from loading to 10 rounds.

Do they have the cut in the non-dimpled area so the mag falls apart if you dremel the dimple out?

 

[greencobra]

s&w 10 rd mags for the m&p .22 are blocked. the blocks will actually tumble out if you take the mag apart. there's no markings on either the 12 or 10 round mags but the part numbers are faintly put on with some type of video jet and the last 2 digits are different. it doesn't bother me online vendors don't know this and send along the 12 rounders when one orders the 10.

 

[MAGA99]

I have the VP9 and that's not true. Not on the factory mags anyway. The magazine body between standard and low capacity are different.

Maybe in your case but his are factory mags and from the outside look indistinguishable from real mags. Since that post I got myself a VP9, but with American mags. I have seen guns with the funny looking mags of which you speak, but his older VP9 does not have those.

 

[akma]

Unless the magazine is disassembled to be rendered a "part" or modified to be crippled capacity before being brought into the state you are already in clear felony territory just by possessing it without even getting into the question if the modification to downgrade the capacity is legally defensible.

So to understand you correctly you could receive "DISASSEMBLED" mags as parts in the mail with no issues? Or go to a free state and disassemble regular capacity mags then come back to Massachusetts and be legal?

 

[Amputee Marksman]

As the OP I can tell you the question was brought up because NY State Law specifically says if the modification is "permanent" then it is legal. Hence the company that sells the block includes some small envelopes of epoxy to glue the blocks to the magazine locking plate. There is no such language in MA law on whether modified magazines are legal regardless of whether the modification is "permanent" or not. That question remains unanswered.

 

[Amputee Marksman]

So to understand you correctly you could receive "DISASSEMBLED" mags as parts in the mail with no issues? Or go to a free state and disassemble regular capacity mags then come back to Massachusetts and be legal?

Except in general you are not going to find "companies" that will break a magazine down into components and ship them to you. You might find individuals.

If we assumed that I wanted to modify standard capacity magazines to make them 10 rounders I might do it this way. Buy all the parts required for modification ahead of time. Drive up north a few miles to the great state of NH and buy some standard capacity magazines and pay cash. Go back to my car and take them apart, swap out the parts required to make them 10 rounders, reassemble and head home. Or maybe I'm not so ambitious and I take them to my car, disassemble them and throw the parts into ziplock bags and head home. In all cases I'm probably going to throw away the packaging from the standard capacity magazines before crossing the border.

 

[pastera]

A 3d printed follower could be made that would fail if cut down.

But this topic really hinges on the fact that if you are in the position of being scrutinized over a modified follower, it's probably just a throw away add-on charge and you're screwed whatever you do.

I modeled up and printed new followers for a 380-EZ to allow 9 rounds. More than rugged enough to last.

 

[ThePreBanMan]

Maybe in your case but his are factory mags and from the outside look indistinguishable from real mags. Since that post I got myself a VP9, but with American mags. I have seen guns with the funny looking mags of which you speak, but his older VP9 does not have those.

My mags have an oval channel pressed into either side of them that runs vertically the length of the mag. This indentation prevents the cartridges from stacking as wide as they do in mags absent this channel which reduces the capacity. It turns it into more of a vertical stack mag similar to a 1911.

 

[Amputee Marksman]

But this topic really hinges on the fact that if you are in the position of being scrutinized over a modified follower, it's probably just a throw away add-on charge and you're screwed whatever you do.

Exactly. This is what I was told by a long time friend of mine who is LEO here in MA. It was suggested to me this would be the case by a good 2A lawyer that I know.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

The thought of a mag block, epoxied or not, reminds me of that one case in the last year or two where someone was brought up over a fixed mag AR, and the cop working with the DA mangled the fixed mag out of the lower just to show it could then hold a standard mag.

Was this an unlicensed defendant charged with possession of an AR or an LTC holder charged with possession of a post ban AW?

it's probably just a throw away add-on charge and you're screwed

Or they "want to get you". Imagine you are in a tactical encounter; solid evidence your actions were totally legal self defense. You can count on your gun being examined and if they want to get you, you could expect the system to go after the mag/AW issue (if possible) absent the ability to convict on something else ... especially if it i apolitically sensitive incident.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

My mags have an oval channel pressed into either side of them that runs vertically the length of the mag. This indentation prevents the cartridges from stacking as wide as they do in mags absent this channel which reduces the capacity. It turns it into more of a vertical stack mag similar to a 1911.

Some such mags also have cuts where the indentation isn't. This is so removal of the indent will cause the mag to fall apart rather than jump in capacity.