Gun Club Politics

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basscatfrank

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Let me preface my remarks by saying I am fairly new here, so if this is not the correct forum I apologize.

Two years ago, when I decided to start shooting again, I joined the NRA and a local gun club. I did some research and found a club that was reasonably close and had indoor and outdoor ranges. I attended a few meetings, was voted in, and paid my dues. All seemed well.

There has been a recent changing of the guard in the governing board and in the general atmosphere of the club. Let me make clear, I was looking only for a place to shoot. I have no desire to become an officer or to become deeply involved in the day to day operations. I have held postions in other outdoor/social organizations and I am too well aware of the commitments required. I also have many other irons in the fire which would preclude me from doing so.

The most recent and disturbing occurence is this: A bonfire was scheduled to be held on the club property. Members and guests were invited. The president took it upon himself to issue an edict banning guns from the event. This caused a firestorm of protest within the club. I have sat on the sidelines watching the battle play out. Charges of censorship have been made regarding the online discussions concerning the bonfire.

I have pretty much made up my mind to let my membership lapse at the end of the year. My question is are these common occurences within a club? Are other clubs torn by internal strife or is the dynamic here unusual?
 
basscatfrank said:
My question is are these common occurences within a club? Are other clubs torn by internal strife or is the dynamic here unusual?
Click to expand...

yep. put enough people together with different views on subjects and there will be problems.

i just wanted to shoot at my club, too--but i'm now on a committee. a few hours of my time at the club without a gun in my hand and trying to come up with solutions that will benefit not only myself but the other members? i can swing that.
 
Any group with more than one member will always have somethign that doesn't sit perfectly well with part of the membership.

If the President overstepped his "constitutional" authority, there should be more than a firestorm. I will say, however, that it's odd that guns could be banned from a gun club....

IMO, if this was an official event, approved by the BoD / Membership, then any discussion "should" have been in the open.

All that being said, if you like the club, then YOU need to get involved. My current club (7th year member) is run well, and smoothly. For the first 5 years, I just showed up. Now, my kids are older and more interested and useful, and I'm more involved. What I've seen is that courtesy is the most important component of these things.

If the Membership of your club feels that it was burned (bonfire pun intended) then elect a new president, and move forward.

All clubs will have politics, make the best of them.

Just my .02
 
Any time you get 2 people together, there will be politics. That does not necessarily mean that all clubs are "torn by internal strife."

There are times when a small-minded person gets a little power for the first time in their life when they are voted into a leadership position in some organization, and they get drunk with power. It happens. You can pack up and leave, or you can help the organization recover.
 
I wanted to shoot at my club too. But since I didn't want to shoot like the majority of those who make policy, they decided that the loss of members and income was worth the preservation of their fiefdom.

So be it. There are other clubs. Luckily the best isn't that much further away for me. I just need to find the $$ to join. (^_^)
 
MisterHappy said:
...All that being said, if you like the club, then YOU need to get involved...
Click to expand...

I agree that those who have the interest, capacity, and time to get involved, SHOULD.

However, there has to be some recognition that not everyone can, due to any number of reasons (family priorities, job commitments, health issues, etc. etc.). I don't know of ANYPLACE where I can just walk into the woods or a sand pit and just practice my skills. For all intents and purposes, gun club membership in MA is required if you want to train or just enjoy your firearms.

That situation shouldn't require everyone to take an active role in running their gun club. I like my club's approach...all members are 'required' to commit a couple of hours of service to the club each year.

It's too bad some folks feel stuck in a disfunctional club. It's not like eveyone has two or three choices near home.
 
But since I didn't want to shoot like the majority of those who make policy
Click to expand...

Chris gets right to the point of the problem - there are all too many people in many of the shooting disciplines who feel their form of shooting is "more legitimate" in absolute terms. This mode of thought most commonly rears it's ugly head with shooting sports that are different and more dynamic than watching paint dry. Some clubs never evolved to the point of getting comfortable with concepts like drawing a loaded gun from a holster; firing at a rate faster than the "rapid fire" stage of the NRA gallery course; or using a selector switch.

Some have evolved to the point where all safe activities are accepted as legitimate (Harvard and Hopkinton fall into this category), whereas certain groups become entrenched in other clubs to the point where it is hopeless - and only people who "think correctly" get on the board. Clubs can change over time, but it can take years, and sometimes involves waiting for a few people to die.
 
Chris said:
I wanted to shoot at my club too. But since I didn't want to shoot like the majority of those who make policy, they decided that the loss of members and income was worth the preservation of their fiefdom.

So be it. There are other clubs. Luckily the best isn't that much further away for me. I just need to find the $$ to join. (^_^)
Click to expand...

I'd be honored to sponsor you for membership, Chris. And I'm in awe of you for sticking out so long at that club; I didn't have the tolerance for the President's BS.
 
It all depends on the club and who's running it. Sadly with your story you described many clubs in MA. Too many old dudes with small penis syndrome trying to be "in charge" of something.

You're much better off going to a club that lets adults act like adults. Monadnock in NH is one of them.
 
Any adult beverages at the bonfire? If so, the prez may have been acting in the best interests of the club. Sometimes decisions have to be made that make some people unhappy, but keep the organization out of trouble. Just guessing the president and board of directors of the Westfield Sportsmen's Club are wishing they'd said "NO!" to the machine gun shoot.
On the other hand, if the prez is just generally a jerk, or there is one clique that runs everything and shuts out everbody else's ideas, then it's time to move on. Or start a revolution. Been there, done that.
 
Originally Posted by Pilgrim
Was there going to be drinking allowed at the bonfire? If so, no guns is a good policy.


derek said:
Yeah for those actually drinking. Or is a gun going to jump off of someone's hip because there is a beer can in the area?
Click to expand...

These seemed to be the two prevailing arguments. I side with the latter. If you can't be trusted with your firearm at a gun club, alcohol notwithstanding, where can you be? Can you just see the anti crowd getting a hold of this? What a perfect argument against being allowed to carry anywhere alcohol is served. They would be as giddy as a schoolgirl pointing out that even gun club members cannot be responsible enough to carry in a social setting.
 
Last edited:
Too many old dudes with small penis syndrome trying to be "in charge" of something.
Click to expand...
This issue is not limited to old dudes. I've seen it from younger people as well.

In the past few three years, three elderly members who were part of the leadership team at clubs I am a member of died. They were all friends, and without exception, supportive of all sports at the club - even the ones they did not personally partake in. Don't write off that 70+ person on the club board as an opponent to your way of life until he has done something to earn it - you may be pleasantly surprised.
 
Often a entire new group of officers gets voted in at one time. And then everything changes. Long time shooting disciplines are forced to give up because of the arbitrary rules that get put in by the club or existing rules that are interpreted differenty than before that now conflict with the rules of the sanctioning organization.
I've seen one club trying to prohibit any drawing from holster, leaving guns unattended which now includes going downrange to set targets. And rules about target placement all of which conflict with SASS and USPSA.
One of my clubs have club officers elected on off years (President & Secretary one year and Vice President & Treasurer another year. This helps to minimize "Regime Change".
 
Lots of clubs have oddball politics.

You basically have two choices:

-Get involved (and see how feasible it is- you'd be surprised, some clubs have "weak" leadership with only marginal support from the member base and it is easy to punt out
the problem children. ) You may find this to be feasible, or you may find that the problems are "entrenched". Find out what the internal biases are, etc. (EG, if you are a rifle/pistol shooter, trying to enact "reform" at a club which is mostly shotgunners, is about as useful as urinating into the wind. )

-Find another club. There are tons of them in MA. (or NH, CT, etc, for that matter) There are a lot of marginal clubs in this region but there are a ton of really good ones, too.


-Mike
 
my club is a fairly run club. we dont have any indoor ranges...but we dont have much in the way of disgruntled members either. basically if you are responsible and keep safety first and formost in mind when shooting/gun handling there are not too many other rules and what rules there are are mostly common sense rules. i know that like most clubs our officers and board of directors is usually the same 20 people every year with most people just moving the position they hold. with over 300 members we rarely have more than 25 at any given meeting. when it comes to club events it usually the same people (officers and bod) running them. it seems most people just want a place to use at their convience. i dont know why more people dont want to be involved but it would be great to get more people involved in running the club. i know for most of you here we are too far for you to join but anyone in western ma that is thinking of changing clubs should come and check out my club. there is usually someone there on the weekends. the club name is fairview sportsmens club. you can check us on line too as we just got our web site up and running, as a fact its still being worked on.
 
atilla said:
yep. put enough people together with different views on subjects and there will be problems.

i just wanted to shoot at my club, too--but i'm now on a committee. a few hours of my time at the club without a gun in my hand and trying to come up with solutions that will benefit not only myself but the other members? i can swing that.
Click to expand...

Hey... at least you were a member before you got thrown on that committee!


And I don't think gun clubs are any different than any other organization...people have differing opinions about things. I don't think you'll ever find a group or organization (or family even!) that works in perfect harmony 100% of the time.
 
basscatfrank said:
Let me preface my remarks by saying I am fairly new here, so if this is not the correct forum I apologize.

Two years ago, when I decided to start shooting again, I joined the NRA and a local gun club. I did some research and found a club that was reasonably close and had indoor and outdoor ranges. I attended a few meetings, was voted in, and paid my dues. All seemed well.

There has been a recent changing of the guard in the governing board and in the general atmosphere of the club. Let me make clear, I was looking only for a place to shoot. I have no desire to become an officer or to become deeply involved in the day to day operations. I have held postions in other outdoor/social organizations and I am too well aware of the commitments required. I also have many other irons in the fire which would preclude me from doing so.

The most recent and disturbing occurence is this: A bonfire was scheduled to be held on the club property. Members and guests were invited. The president took it upon himself to issue an edict banning guns from the event. This caused a firestorm of protest within the club. I have sat on the sidelines watching the battle play out. Charges of censorship have been made regarding the online discussions concerning the bonfire.

I have pretty much made up my mind to let my membership lapse at the end of the year. My question is are these common occurences within a club? Are other clubs torn by internal strife or is the dynamic here unusual?
Click to expand...

That is the kind of BS that happens from time to time. Everything goes in cycles. Including club politics. But, nothing will change if no one speaks up. Best you can do is write a detailed letter explaining why you will not be renewing and why you and your family will be going elsewhere. Otherwise, no one will get the hint. And don't just address it to the president. If he is a sleazeball he might just discard it and it will never see the light of day. Make sure everyone on the board reads it.
 
bob68 said:
my club is a fairly run club. we dont have any indoor ranges...but we dont have much in the way of disgruntled members either. basically if you are responsible and keep safety first and formost in mind when shooting/gun handling there are not too many other rules and what rules there are are mostly common sense rules. i know that like most clubs our officers and board of directors is usually the same 20 people every year with most people just moving the position they hold. with over 300 members we rarely have more than 25 at any given meeting. when it comes to club events it usually the same people (officers and bod) running them. it seems most people just want a place to use at their convience. i dont know why more people dont want to be involved but it would be great to get more people involved in running the club. i know for most of you here we are too far for you to join but anyone in western ma that is thinking of changing clubs should come and check out my club. there is usually someone there on the weekends. the club name is fairview sportsmens club. you can check us on line too as we just got our web site up and running, as a fact its still being worked on.
Click to expand...

Based on Bob's suggestion from a different thread, I checked out Fairview this past weekend. Met a couple of members and took a walk around. Seems like a good place. I'm planning on joining and seeing how it goes.
 
bob68 said:
i know that like most clubs our officers and board of directors is usually the same 20 people every year with most people just moving the position they hold. with over 300 members we rarely have more than 25 at any given meeting. when it comes to club events it usually the same people (officers and bod) running them. it seems most people just want a place to use at their convience. i dont know why more people dont want to be involved but it would be great to get more people involved in running the club.
Click to expand...
I agree. We could really use more people getting involved at our club.
 
I belong to this club as well Frank, and I will be letting my membership expire as soon as I get past the waiting list at another club. I can't take the headaches of the range policies changing daily, politics, etc. I feel the same way you do, so its not just you.

The prez figured if booze was allowed, no guns for anyone on club property. Some members argued, let people be adults and if they are drinking they should know not to carry. Myself, I dont drink, and because I was not going to drink, if I can't carry, I am not going to the fire.
 
Eh, I shoot the way I want to as long as it's in a safe manner. I also like to blow up water jugs, though I always clean up after myself. I'm usually the only one or part of a group when I go, but if someone wants to be a turd and "kick me out" then so be it. Like has been said before, there is probably more than one club within a half-hour of you.
 
Eh, I shoot the way I want to as long as it's in a safe manner. I also like to blow up water jugs, though I always clean up after myself. I'm usually the only one or part of a group when I go, but if someone wants to be a turd and "kick me out" then so be it.
Click to expand...

I suggest you inform clubs to which you apply for membership that you will shoot safely, but feel no obligation to be bound by any of their rules that you don't think are necessary for safety. It will let you and the club each make a fully informed decision if you are a good match for each other.
 
Rob Boudrie said:
I suggest you inform clubs to which you apply for membership that you will shoot safely, but feel no obligation to be bound by any of their rules that you don't think are necessary for safety. It will let you and the club each make a fully informed decision if you are a good match for each other.
Click to expand...

Oh, you mean rules like "no rapid firing" and "paper targets only"? Yea those were really conceived with safety in mind [rolleyes]

the club minds their own business and I pay them ~$100/year. If they don't want my money that's fine with me I'll find a club that does [grin]
 
I have to admit I'm of two minds regarding booze at a gun club function. While I feel that folks SHOULD be adult enough to know they should not carry if they're going to be drinking... there are too many alcoholic idiots in this world who simply don't KNOW when they're impaired. Witness all those killed by drunk drivers.

I'd love to hear a good compromise between no alcohol and no guns at an event. Check your guns when you start drinking and make arrangements to pick them the day after, maybe?
 
dwarven1 said:
I have to admit I'm of two minds regarding booze at a gun club function. While I feel that folks SHOULD be adult enough to know they should not carry if they're going to be drinking... there are too many alcoholic idiots in this world who simply don't KNOW when they're impaired. Witness all those killed by drunk drivers.

I'd love to hear a good compromise between no alcohol and no guns at an event. Check your guns when you start drinking and make arrangements to pick them the day after, maybe?
Click to expand...

How would you enforce this? Just like gun control and criminals, the people who follow rules aren't the problem. If someone (anywhere, not just at a gun club event) tried to search me, I'd leave and never come back.
 

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