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Fiasco at Bass pro shop tonight
- Thread starter Maj. Boom Boom
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So, let me get this straight... you went to a box store, for a contest, and they didn't even follow their own rules, and you're aghast and surprised?
![[rofl]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/013.gif "ROFL [rofl]")
So when you go to gun stores, do you shoulder surf people filling out 4473s, to you know, make sure they're filling them out right?![[thinking]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/010.gif "Thinking [thinking]")
People should not be jumping to "straw purchase" land without understanding the context and intent behind whatever transfer is going to occur.
-Mike
So when you go to gun stores, do you shoulder surf people filling out 4473s, to you know, make sure they're filling them out right?
People should not be jumping to "straw purchase" land without understanding the context and intent behind whatever transfer is going to occur.
-Mike
I don't see the issue here either. Even if this guy was disqualified, each member of the mob would have basically had a 99.99% chance of going home empty handed anyways.
On a side note, I was disappointed over the magnitude of this "fiasco." I thought the OP was going to report that BPS was selling new manufacture glocks and other non-mass compliant guns again
On a side note, I was disappointed over the magnitude of this "fiasco." I thought the OP was going to report that BPS was selling new manufacture glocks and other non-mass compliant guns again
I was in a raffle when I was 16. I won a gift certificate to Kens Steak House. They had me pull the next number, I won again this was for a 8 gun wood cabinet with a glass front, again they had me grab the next number. Once again I won. This prize was a remington 12 guage, I can't remember which model. They would not give it to me and the rest of the participants threw a fit because I won three times. I was pissed, My dad was pissed because he could have taken possession legally. Needless to say we both never returned to that establishment, likely the losers did not as well.
Moral of they story is -
Not giving the winner the prize is bad for business
Unorganized raffles are bad for business
Shotgun raffles in Ma. are bad for business
I bet this kid already got an application for his FID so he can take possession because in the OP he said "not yet", and I am extremely happy that they will allow his brother to have it.
+1 to bass pro
-1 to Ma.
Moral of they story is -
Not giving the winner the prize is bad for business
Unorganized raffles are bad for business
Shotgun raffles in Ma. are bad for business
I bet this kid already got an application for his FID so he can take possession because in the OP he said "not yet", and I am extremely happy that they will allow his brother to have it.
+1 to bass pro
-1 to Ma.
Are you "f'ing" serious? what is there to complain about, kid won a shot gun be happy for him...
Seriously when we drew the winner of the Hanson Machinegun Raffle the fella who won the Thompson didn't have have a Mass Green Card, should we have said Oh sorry bud never mind we gotta pick some one else??? You want to talk about fair that doesn't seem particularly fair to me...I won't delve into our winners personal business, but he had numeous options to collect his prize, and he selected a method not all that different from "having his brother with a license" take it for him... Do you feel cheated because of that too I mean hey that was for $14,000 Thompson not a $300 shotgun, wanna call the police????
Seriously when we drew the winner of the Hanson Machinegun Raffle the fella who won the Thompson didn't have have a Mass Green Card, should we have said Oh sorry bud never mind we gotta pick some one else??? You want to talk about fair that doesn't seem particularly fair to me...I won't delve into our winners personal business, but he had numeous options to collect his prize, and he selected a method not all that different from "having his brother with a license" take it for him... Do you feel cheated because of that too I mean hey that was for $14,000 Thompson not a $300 shotgun, wanna call the police????
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the way I see it, the first winner basically designated his own choice for the winner. IMHO, a new number should have been picked as the guy he designated to take the shotgun was not there....
Garys
NES Member
+1. I'd suggest that the OP get some better grapes next time.
I was told Cabela's wanted to move to Mass...but because of "confusing firearms laws which would lead to a loss of revenue" they came to CT...i could be wrong..just heard employees there talking about it there
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yes, but you cant drive it. with the shotgun, you cant even posses it without at least the FID*
cant BassPro do a transfer if they wanted to? they ARE an FFL.
*assuming it was a MA resident.
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There's also a perfectly normal, common solution to prizes you cannot possess for whatever reason...
It's called "or cash equivalent"...
I guess I am just a liberal, if people want to get involved in a cluster f#@$%, I feel that consenting adults can do as they please...
![[laugh]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/012.gif "Laugh [laugh]")
your right it is evil that an fid exist but that doesn't change the fact that it exist for everyone! not a select few.
tell me, what happens if the kid has something in his background that precludes him from getting an fid? should he be allowed to have it? that's why they say an fid is required.
its not sour grapes - i don't care that i didn't win it. i had a great time, received a free knife and was fed. that's a win win win to me.
next thing you know it will be alright for little "sally" to start driving alone before she gets her first licence.
I bought a used 20 gauge shotgun at the local hardware store when I was 14 years old in Tennessee. The only question asked of me was "Does your dad know you're buying this?" This wasn't that long ago, not the 1950's but 1980.
The fact that a 20 year old man needs some sort of special government license to buy a shotgun is absurd and very sad.
ETA- Oh, and I meant to ask, Hobbit, were you by chance the hall monitor in middle school?![[wink]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/002.gif "Wink [wink]")
no i wasn't the hall monitor in school.
now let me ask you something. if this kid is not able to get an fid is that alright in regards to the law? is it alright (if the kid can't get an id) to allow his brother to have it when it was a members only event? if you were in my shoes last night and thought they were going to hand this over to someone without an fid would you just walk out or would you try to make sure its done legally?
sorry if i am on the side that believes everyone should follow the same rules. that doesn't mean i like the rules but until there changed, there what we follow.
how is it legal if the kid doesn't have or can't get an fid? actually i do consider it a win for me because i got a free knife and food. as for the rest of your post see the above - i did have a great time.
BINGO!! the only problem there would be if he was unable to get an fid
very acceptable and i wish that was thought of last night. that would have been a perfect solution.
people listen its about the kid not having an fid. and the off chance that he may be precluded from getting one - how would bass pro ever know about? its about following written rules.
its not about the ma laws being bad, not about me (or the other people who were upset) wanting the gun or sour grapes. its not about what other states allow.
i was just making sure that an fid holder would be getting the gun and i think bp handled it wrong. plain and simple. I love the cash option and wish that was thought of last night.
What if the winner was not qualified, ie; FELON?
Just sayin.
thank you! at least someone is seeing my point.
Much better than a new pistol.
FWIW I don't thing the Bass Pro thing is that big of a deal and I kind of expect it from a chain store.
Maybe they should have held a separate raffle for the shotgun where people would have to show proper license before getting a chance to win it. I'm willing to bet more than half the people there that night with tickets in hand didn't have an FID.
i agree about the separate raffle and that would have fixed the whole issue as would not having a prize that requires a licence to have.
wrt who had an id that's unknown and you could be right. had one of them been the winner and stated they didn't have an fid i would have done the same thing.
had the kid not been asked about the fid until they were all in the other room and we didn't hear the kid say he didn't have one, this would not be an issue. it would have been a bp issue but not for the rest of us who heard it.
i was just trying, as a law abiding gun owner who thinks we already get enough bad press, to make sure the law (and bp's rules) was followed.
is that really so hard for people on here to understand?
Do you know the kid is from Mass? What if he was a preferred customer from RI, 10 miles down the road. People come to bass Pro from hundreds of miles away. Can only locals be Preferred customers?
If he wasn't a Mass resident, he couldn't have an FID card, and Bass Pro couldn't make the transfer, but if he was a preferred customer, they may have determined to honor his "win" in another way that didn't involve an out of state transfer.
I'm all for following (most) rules, but I'll bet there is more to this.
Maybe a Bass Pro employee on the forum can explain what happened.
btw, If I had been there, waiting 2 hours for the drawing, and the written rules said you needed an FID to win, I'd have asked for clarification too.
What if the winner didn't have an FID, but rather, a LTC? Would they be disqualified? If they were properly licensed out of state, couldn't they buy the gun by having it shipped to a dealer in their state? Could they have wanted to find a way to not have one of their promotional items, or customers end up in a different strore?
There's no such thing as a free lunch, or I guess free raffle tickets.
I don't know, I don't go to Bas Pro much. I've heard a rumor they have a big, goofy, red faced guy there named C-pher that kisses people and says, "I love you man". Gives me shivers just thinking about it.
the kid is from ma and i believe (although not positive) he said his brother was from R.I.
yes an LTC would have been ok
I have another question.. Was there a specific raffle for the shotgun, or did you enter, and were eligible to win gift certificates, or the shotgun?? The answer to this might change my opinion, about the winner, but I still think they should have raffled a kayak..![[smile]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/001.gif "Smile [smile]")
First, notice the
by the hall monitor comment.Second, since you asked what I would do were I there, well, I'd probably say "Damn it! I never win gun raffles. NEVER!" and then console myself by saying "It was just a entry level shotgun".
And, if by chance I heard the guy didn't have an FID, I wouldn't really care how they resolved it, I wouldn't be standing around listening more or caring. Why would I? Seriously. How is it my business, let alone my responsibility to "try to make sure its done legally"?
So, let me get this straight... you went to a box store, for a contest, and they didn't even follow their own rules, and you're aghast and surprised?
no i went there to get ammo for the gunpowder pig event and since they were having the member event i decided to go last night instead of today. i guess maybe i should only go to gun stores for ammo huh and give up a free knive if they are willing to give it to me at the same time.
![[rolleyes]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/042.gif "Roll Eyes [rolleyes]")
So when you go to gun stores, do you shoulder surf people filling out 4473s, to you know, make sure they're filling them out right?
People should not be jumping to "straw purchase" land without understanding the context and intent behind whatever transfer is going to occur.
-Mike
Umm no i don't. I guess if you were standing next to someone who admits to breaking the law or about to break the law you would look the other way - nice.
Seriously dude what the f*** are you talking about?
Working backwards:
Moving on:
Finnally just a bit of a rant because of your nonsense....I'm guessing you don't have kids? I do they are both too young for an FID, yet they both have guns. Until my kids are licensed (or we don't live in MA) thier guns will be "techincally" mine and the kids can't use them with out me, but that does negate the fact that they are thier guns. Just as the winners shotgun will be his brothers until he gets a license...
Working backwards:
Umm bad analogy, because actaully, not having a license will not prevent "sally" from winning (or buying) a car, she can even drive it all she wants on private land, she just can't drive it on a public road till she's licenses.
Moving on:
I don't even know where you are going with this one, are you suggesting that if the young man didn't offer up his licensed brother that you think Bass Pro (a licensed dealer) would have just given him the shotgun anyway? Unless you are mentally challenged you can't really think that was going to happen....
Awww Crap that is what you think isn't...
The problem is NO ONE broke any law. The winner of the raffle did not at the time have the neccarry license, so the had his appearently properly licensed brother collect his winnings for him. The illegal part is what exactly?
Finnally just a bit of a rant because of your nonsense....I'm guessing you don't have kids? I do they are both too young for an FID, yet they both have guns. Until my kids are licensed (or we don't live in MA) thier guns will be "techincally" mine and the kids can't use them with out me, but that does negate the fact that they are thier guns. Just as the winners shotgun will be his brothers until he gets a license...
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I don't see the issue here either. Even if this guy was disqualified, each member of the mob would have basically had a 99.99% chance of going home empty handed anyways.
On a side note, I was disappointed over the magnitude of this "fiasco." I thought the OP was going to report that BPS was selling new manufacture glocks and other non-mass compliant guns again
once again its not about the others who may have won, although that is in the overall picture, its about the kid not having an fid and the way bass pro made it seem like he was still getting the gun. i would have thought the same thing had i not had the conversation.
the fiasco was because of the way they handled it. printing certain rules and not following them, allowing it to seem like the gun was changing hands to a person, by law, who was not able to receive it, and for not explaining that they would either make a cash arrangement or letting everyone know at the beginning that a "pass on was allowed". they did the opposite. they stated an fid was required and then when the kid stated that he didn't have one, they take him into the other room and start filling out papers. they tell everyone the raffle was over without one word about what just happened, knowing we all just heard the kid say he did not have an fid.
difference is, everything in your case was legal. your name comes up you win - 2x's or 10x's
last night it was about the fid which is a requirement by law and by bp rules
So very true! I do find it funny that MA gun laws continually turn MA gun owners against one another as there are the supporters of following these laws to the T and then there are those who think it is all a load of crap and don't care if everyone follows them. If every single person in MA went out and bought a gun tommorow (by any possible means) the government could do nothing about it and would probably have to nullify the laws. Same with paying taxes... if no one did it, the government could do nothing about it.
Hobbit: I can see your arguement in that the person the gun was actually going to in name was probably not a prefered customer. However, what I am seeing here is the brother is taking it in name only and the real user will be the original winner. Being mad at someone because of an un-constitutional law doesn't make sense to me.
if the law called for him needing a licence and your club said it was needed to win the gun then yes you pick someone else. seems plenty fair to me. if you listed the above in the rules and he entered a ticket anyway, well that's his choice.
i don't feel "cheated" at all. either in your case or what happened last. its about the laws.
if i was standing there and saw the guy didn't have WHAT WAS REQUIRED BY LAW and that it appeared you were giving it TO HIM ANYWAY, i would have talk to you too. i wouldn't call the police because, like last night i would have inquired about it. to those that didn't inquire about it it would look like an illegal transaction, it is those people who may call the police.
if you were waiting in line at you fav. gun store and something seemed lawfully out of place with the transaction going on in front of you, would you just shut up, inquire, or always wonder if your fav. store is on the up and up?
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