CMP Releases 2019 Rulebooks....

mac1911 · Feb 19, 2019

Matt-CZ said:
Thanks. That'll give me something to work towards. Do you know if these matches are open to non-members?

All NRA and CMP sanctioned matches are open to public.
Only issue is The “match” shooters get dibs on the line.
Example if it’s a service rifle match and you show up with a non match legal rifle you only can shoot if they have room on the relays. It’s rare to get turned away you may have to shoot the last relay but you will shoot.

Mountain · Feb 19, 2019

mac1911 said:
All NRA and CMP sanctioned matches are open to public.
Only issue is The “match” shooters get dibs on the line.
Example if it’s a service rifle match and you show up with a non match legal rifle you only can shoot if they have room on the relays. It’s rare to get turned away you may have to shoot the last relay but you will shoot.

His Colt should be GTG.

millbilly · Feb 19, 2019

My WOA A4 ordered on black Friday has finally shipped!

mac1911 · Feb 20, 2019

dw617 said:
The first time I showed up to Reading all I had for data was a solid 200 yard zero. Beyond that, I had a notebook with the known comeups for 2-3 & 3-6 and also 77 grain ammo. So it can be done. I burned a match or two just finding and confirming my zeros. The Colt A2 wouldn't be my first choice for shooting CMP/NRA service rifle with, but it's definitely do-able. It wouldn't be too hard to build an SR for the future, you could even keep your existing lower and just swap between a White Oak upper and your A2 Colt upper and remove/add the buttstock weight. Trigger would be the same.

also i believe reading requires 69 grain or heavier ? I dont think they allow greetip either? Not that you want to shoot that crap for score.

the fun part is basic come ups work to get you close enough.
2,3,12= from a 100 yard zero +2min
200-300 +3min , 300-600 +12min

the more you know about your ammo and rifle the better. Heck just the change in light at the range can toss my zero of a few min.

Matt-CZ · Feb 20, 2019

dw617 said:
No 55 or 62 gr at 600, but why would you anyways?

The comeups will get you at least on paper.... From memory, my 3-600 yard comeup was only 10 minutes or so. Towards the end of the season as my barrel wore out I had to add another minute of elevation to 600. It's all written down in my book. I have a new barrel this year so I get to start fresh.

What kind of round count are you getting before barrel swap?

Matt-CZ · Feb 20, 2019

mac1911 said:
also i believe reading requires 69 grain or heavier ? I dont think they allow greetip either? Not that you want to shoot that crap for score.

Where were a couple months ago when I bought a thousand rounds of M855

Wasn't until after I got it that i learned that most consider it worse than pretty much everything out there at the same price. Whoopsie. Maybe 600 rounds left to go.

Sad thing is, I don't shoot well enough to notice the difference. You never know when you might need to punch through a Russian helmet on short notice.

mac1911 · Feb 20, 2019

Matt-CZ said:
Where were a couple months ago when I bought a thousand rounds of M855 Wasn't until after I got it that i learned that most consider it worse than pretty much everything out there at the same price. Whoopsie. Maybe 600 rounds left to go.

Sad thing is, I don't shoot well enough to notice the difference. You never know when you might need to punch through a Russian helmet on short notice.

For 200 yards and in wolf gold is the cheapest bestest stuff for general plonking and practice and decent scores also. I scored a 279/300 with wolf gold off hand kills my score no matter what ammo I use!

M855 ain’t “bad” there’s just cheaper ammo that is better IMHO

Remeber this game has a 6 min black bull. Keep them in the black and your doing well.
For me it’s not my groups that are bad but where I put them on the target.!

Like mountains group a few post ago, absolutely great group but deep into the 9ring , at that point even some one shooting 3 moa would beat a 1moa group in the 9 ring if they put them in the 3.19 moa 10 ring.
See it’s not hard at all, although if you use a now if you use a MR-31 at 100 yards you need to get down into the sub 2moa skills and ammo as it reduces the scoring rings to make up for lack of distance and wind at 600?
Also why cmp games just used the SR target at 200 for everything. Keeps the scores up and no need for clubs to have all different targets.
Try a MR-52 at 200 yards the 10 ring is 1.8 minutes.

Mountain · Feb 20, 2019

dw617 said:
OK Just came back from range with my SP1. Made up 30 rounds last night.

Took about 20 rounds to walk it in the 10 ring and get use to the rifle a little bit. Adjusting the A1 style sights is a pain in the ass. Shooting SR-1 at 100 yards.

I opted to use the web sling instead of a leather sling.

View: https://i.imgur.com/uPi5veq.jpg

I had 10 rounds left for the Winter Match, but one of the rounds got smashed while I was single loading it and I felt it was unsafe to shoot. So there is only 9 on paper. That 8 was me being a dumb ass, too.

View: https://i.imgur.com/qGkxd4n.jpg

Nice!

Looks like a little vertical stringing? In my case, that's usually my bad. Perhaps sling tension? Horizontal spread is pretty damn good.

When building up something new or with a recent purchase I use the laser cartridges to get me close. I have a couple cheap ones from Amazon for .30-06 and .223. I'll hold the .30-06 in a .308 and it seems to work well enough. Usually only a couple shots to be on center.

mac1911 · Feb 21, 2019

So my A2 went on a diet
I weighed my rifle several times and the final weight was 7.8lbs it right around 125oz,
First off was the crappy “mil style” A2 brake. Below the welded and pinned brake and about 1” of barrel. I need to face and cut the crown. Most likely I will re crown ala Harry Potterfield style

View: https://imgur.com/a/vkWGwpA

View: https://youtu.be/b43odFm0mrI

I also decided to borrow the Houge round Free float and aluminum barrel nut , will weigh that soon and compare. From another upper.

So now my A2 pre 2019 rules compliant rifle should be rules compliant for post rule changes. I also hope to pick up a few accuracy nodes with the free float.

mac1911 · Feb 21, 2019

dw617 said:
How did you hack that barrel end off?

Harbor Freight Sawsall, BUT I only buy the good harbor freight tools!
9 Amp Heavy Duty Variable Speed Reciprocating Saw

i have a jig like the one harry uses and recrowning tools.
Although if I can find the time I will take up a offer to use a lathe to face it and cut a recessed crown.

Mountain · Feb 21, 2019

mac1911 said:
So my A2 went on a diet
I weighed my rifle several times and the final weight was 7.8lbs it right around 125oz,
First off was the crappy “mil style” A2 brake. Below the welded and pinned brake and about 1” of barrel. I need to face and cut the crown. Most likely I will re crown ala Harry Potterfield style

View: https://imgur.com/a/vkWGwpA

View: https://youtu.be/b43odFm0mrI

I also decided to borrow the Houge round Free float and aluminum barrel nut , will weigh that soon and compare. From another upper.

So now my A2 pre 2019 rules compliant rifle should be rules compliant for post rule changes. I also hope to pick up a few accuracy nodes with the free float.

Nice! I'd be surprised if you don't see better accuracy from the free float. I don't think CMP really thought this through. Allowing free float is going to backfire against their intention.

mac1911 · Feb 22, 2019

Mountain said:
Nice! I'd be surprised if you don't see better accuracy from the free float. I don't think CMP really thought this through. Allowing free float is going to backfire against their intention.

IDK i never really laid this gun down for any accuracy testing. Its seen a diet of PPU M193 and wolf gold along with steel shit.
I have a box of 1000 69gn CustomComp to run through it.

Ju st need to decide on 11' crown or recessed target style.?

Mountain · Feb 22, 2019

mac1911 said:
IDK i never really laid this gun down for any accuracy testing. Its seen a diet of PPU M193 and wolf gold along with steel shit.
I have a box of 1000 69gn CustomComp to run through it.

Ju st need to decide on 11' crown or recessed target style.?

Square and burr free, the rest is personal preference.

mac1911 · Feb 22, 2019

Mountain said:
Square and burr free, the rest is personal preference.

im little rough with my guns so I need some protection. I did the ala harry square up and ready to crown

UPDATE: I pulled a Doh!
Seems I decided to weigh my A2 with out bolt and charge handle. When I reweighed my rifle after cutting and swapping hand Guards I gained weight!! WTF
Ok so now I say to myself "do I really have a A2 barrel like I was led to believe when I bought it. I should have known the minute I pulled the hand guards off. There is no taper on this barrel. A quick call to RRA and the fine lady said if its not tapered its a "Hbar" style barrel. with the brake and 1" of barrel lopped off im still over 3 lbs.

So now the fun part: MAC's custom barrels. They will be the perfect 17 47/64" long Custom saw mark crown and odd ball fluting!

I figure I can cut another chunk of barrel off and loose 2oz. Then take off some metal under the handguards!

mac1911 · Feb 28, 2019

If you guys want to push some buttons up VT I have a few UMM rifles you can bring, they look the part and UMM is any cal up to 8mm

View: https://imgur.com/a/OnSzFF0

Mountain · Feb 28, 2019

mac1911 said:
If you guys want to push some buttons up VT I have a few UMM rifles you can bring, they look the part and UMM is any cal up to 8mm

View: https://imgur.com/a/OnSzFF0

Hey, I think we are inventing a new CMP competition category that requires no ammo: it's called piss off the inspector. Points scored by number of curse words. Usually the inspectors are from 'Bama, and it's extra difficult to get a Southerner to curse in public. I forecast that the winning score will be in the single digits and require inspection of at least 3 'iffy' MM rifles. Of course you only shoot one of them- the others are for inspection sport.

So now there's an unwritten rule that barrels must be tapered? Dis gonna be good...

mac1911 · Feb 28, 2019

I will be shooting that AR at pembroke at least once!

mac1911 · Mar 2, 2019

here another one that will raise some eyebro'
After shooting UMM can shoot sporter rimfire !!!!!

mac1911 · Mar 6, 2019

View: https://imgur.com/a/Itk4wY8

Lost 12.8oz

mac1911 · Mar 7, 2019

chopped another feww inches of the end and re crowned it, almost ready...going into the paint shop next

mac1911 · Mar 7, 2019

whooHoo made weight

mac1911 · Mar 15, 2019

Not bad for granddads rifle! , you have wrongringitis just like me.

mac1911 · Apr 11, 2019

Well the AR made weight
The M1a is still 3oz fat, was thinking of chopping the flash hider back to the muzzle but dont think thats 3 oz ? I will try the other stock and see if thats lighter.

Mountain · Apr 20, 2019

Cool that you figured out how to make weight, but again- SHAME on CMP for putting people through the wringer to meet their IDIOTIC rules changes. Unless someone happened to be showing up with a carbine or pencil barreled rifle, I bet there were few who would be able to meet the new rules criteria without either buying a pencil barrel, installing a carbine barrel and related parts, or modifying existing barrel as you have done. Otherwise the option is to go as light weight as po$$ible with multiple components in order to be competitive and make weight.

mac1911 · Apr 20, 2019

Mountain said:
Cool that you figured out how to make weight, but again- SHAME on CMP for putting people through the wringer to meet their IDIOTIC rules changes. Unless someone happened to be showing up with a carbine or pencil barreled rifle, I bet there were few who would be able to meet the new rules criteria without either buying a pencil barrel, installing a carbine barrel and related parts, or modifying existing barrel as you have done. Otherwise the option is to go as light weight as po$$ible with multiple components in order to be competitive and make weight.

I have to say I think CMP did little in the way of seeing what "the Market" offered. Maybe they should have split the groups into carbine and rifle length?
Well if I do get to VT ( about 1%, thats up from 0% last year) I will be ready. I hope my new walnut stock makes weight As much as I like the looks of my red stock its loose and ill fitted. Still can hold the 10 ring if I do, which I did not do so well past sunday

Mountain · Apr 20, 2019

You could always do a little work on that red stock. Oh, that would also push you into UMM.

Maybe I should start a campaign to allow wooden stock bedding. I'd guess the supply of tight fitting, affordable stocks is going to dry up or they will only be available on a limited basis and will still not be affordable because they will be hoarded.

mac1911 · Apr 20, 2019

Mountain said:
You could always do a little work on that red stock. Oh, that would also push you into UMM.

Maybe I should start a campaign to allow wooden stock bedding. I'd guess the supply of tight fitting, affordable stocks is going to dry up or they will only be available on a limited basis and will still not be affordable because they will be hoarded.

no it wont ! you make weight your good! well thats how the rules read to me.
Show me where it says you cant have a bedded rifle or match barrel in class B modern military ?
Remember you have CMP games "As Issued" matches and then you have
CMP" Special Military Rifle Match Rules"

Oh sure toss in that "spirit and intent" thing

But "MM" is rules 5.2.3 and 5.2.4
basically now if it "looks like X , weighs Y and has "iron sights" your good to go.

I would like to see where CMP makes it clear that a M1a that makes weight can not be bedded. Heck they allow any type of stock now. So if your chasis stocked M1a could make weight your in.
You have a M1a in 6.5 or 35 whelen ius good to go!

Mountain · Apr 21, 2019

mac1911 said:
no it wont ! you make weight your good! well thats how the rules read to me.
Show me where it says you cant have a bedded rifle or match barrel in class B modern military ?
Remember you have CMP games "As Issued" matches and then you have
CMP" Special Military Rifle Match Rules"

Oh sure toss in that "spirit and intent" thing

But "MM" is rules 5.2.3 and 5.2.4
basically now if it "looks like X , weighs Y and has "iron sights" your good to go.

I would like to see where CMP makes it clear that a M1a that makes weight can not be bedded. Heck they allow any type of stock now. So if your chasis stocked M1a could make weight your in.
You have a M1a in 6.5 or 35 whelen ius good to go!

You sure about that?

So if I put iron sights on my .458 and it makes weight, it's GTG for MM at Pembroke? Added bonus is I won't have any trouble seeing shots in the black and the target puller will sure as hell know when one hits paper. LOL no way in hell will it make weight.

Butner is coming up in a few days. I bet MM inspection is a real shite show. It's gonna be fun to see what type and how many clarifications are made between now and Vermont.

You really need to work on that hall pass for Vermont. Beautiful setting, a great time, and I bet you will grow the ranks of trinket grabbing Ma**h***s. There's a bunch of us already, in fact I don't think any of us who shoot at Pembroke went home without a decent medal and a few grabbed some overall plaques. This year I plan to shoot 4 games matches and probably vintage sniper. I'll probably skip highpower this time in favor of sniper.

Rich shot sniper with another guy named Richard, so their team name was '2 Dicks' or something like that. At awards, I think they were called '2 Richards' LOL.

mac1911 · Apr 21, 2019

Mountain said:
You sure about that?

So if I put iron sights on my .458 and it makes weight, it's GTG for MM at Pembroke? Added bonus is I won't have any trouble seeing shots in the black and the target puller will sure as hell know when one hits paper. LOL no way in hell will it make weight.

Butner is coming up in a few days. I bet MM inspection is a real shite show. It's gonna be fun to see what type and how many clarifications are made between now and Vermont.

You really need to work on that hall pass for Vermont. Beautiful setting, a great time, and I bet you will grow the ranks of trinket grabbing Ma**h***s. There's a bunch of us already, in fact I don't think any of us who shoot at Pembroke went home without a decent medal and a few grabbed some overall plaques. This year I plan to shoot 4 games matches and probably vintage sniper. I'll probably skip highpower this time in favor of sniper.

Rich shot sniper with another guy named Richard, so their team name was '2 Dicks' or something like that. At awards, I think they were called '2 Richards' LOL.

Well pembroke maybe ok but you are above and beyoundbey the 556/233 for AR based platform...also exceeds the 8mm max for Modern Military.
I could be wrong but I think at any CMP event/match shot in compittion maxes out at Cal 8mm be it games, EIC, service rifle.

So you bring up a good point. If you run a AR platform rifle can you run in "Modern Mil Class B" if you have other than "Class A 223/556"
OR are you instantly banned to UMM Class A, does UMM class a have the same cal restriction of 223/556?

strange things going on for sure.
So basically you have 3 groups for modern military
Class A = AR platform= weight,Trigger, Metallic sights 223/556 only
Class B= Any other type of semi auto based rifle that may have been issued some where in the world. If you have rifle not listed in the rules you can argue its " in service status" it then needs to make weight which will be dictated by what ever info is available for its in service weight.
Then it just has to look like or be simular to the "issued platform.= Make weight,Trigger , Metallic sights , max cal of 8mm

Then you have the Unlimited Classes
Class A Unlimited any AR based rifle that does not meet Class A/
Class B Unlimited= any other semi auto rifle that does not meet Class B
Oh and lets not forget
Unlimited Garand which is any M1 Garand that does not apply to "M1 As Issued" or MM class B ---HOLD ON NOW
Will the M1 automatically be put into UMM just for the cal change to 308?
Fun stuff. Ft Butner eastern games is coming up we will see what happens with the rule.

mac1911 · Apr 21, 2019

Mountain said:
You sure about that?

So if I put iron sights on my .458 and it makes weight, it's GTG for MM at Pembroke? Added bonus is I won't have any trouble seeing shots in the black and the target puller will sure as hell know when one hits paper. LOL no way in hell will it make weight.

Butner is coming up in a few days. I bet MM inspection is a real shite show. It's gonna be fun to see what type and how many clarifications are made between now and Vermont.

You really need to work on that hall pass for Vermont. Beautiful setting, a great time, and I bet you will grow the ranks of trinket grabbing Ma**h***s. There's a bunch of us already, in fact I don't think any of us who shoot at Pembroke went home without a decent medal and a few grabbed some overall plaques. This year I plan to shoot 4 games matches and probably vintage sniper. I'll probably skip highpower this time in favor of sniper.

Rich shot sniper with another guy named Richard, so their team name was '2 Dicks' or something like that. At awards, I think they were called '2 Richards' LOL.

Its to bad they had zero humor for that team name. ? Thats such a "bad joke" it would be over the heads of the young, funny for 13 year olds and just monte python-ish

Nudge Nudge wink wink 2 shooting dicks, knowatimean

CMP Releases 2019 Rulebooks....

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