Beginner Red Dot Questions

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mtnbiker26

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Scopes and iron sights are the only experience I have so far and I'd like to try a red dot on my Victory .22 to start. I know nothing about red dots other than some online articles I've read. Currently leaning towards a Vortex Venom. I've noticed that sometimes they're mounted back where the rear sight would normally be and sometimes they're much further forward. Outside of the obvious things like holstering, is this just a near-sighted, far-sighted thing?

I'm still confused about the different external styles/shapes of red dots. Is the micro-dot style like a Vortex Venom the same as the "tube" style like a Vortex Sparc/Crossfire just in a different form-factor for pistols vs rifles? Thanks.
 
The closer to your eye it is, the more field of view you'll have. It has nothing to do with near/far sightedness. Generally you want it as close to your eye as you can get it. Some guns don't have mount points near the breech. It'll work just as well (but with a smaller field of view) if you mount it near the muzzle. I wouldn't recommend doing that though.

You should keep both eyes open, and focus on the target, the red dot will float over the impact point.

Tube style are just reflex style, inside a tube.
 
Micros work fine on pistols, or mounted as auxiliary sight on scoped rifles. Check with member Edmorseiii, he runs a very nice Vortex Viper/Trijicon RMR combo in a Larue mount on his SPR. Micro reds like the Aimpoint T2 are a great compromise between those "Windows" like venom or RMR, and full size red dots like the COMPor PRO models from Aimpoint. Try a cheap knock off from primary or Bushnell to see if it's for you, and move up from there.
 
With a red dot mounted scope, you put the red dot on the thing you’re going to destroy and gently squeeze the trigger.

Assuming you’ve sighted the red dot scope properly at the distance you’re shooting, bullet should go to the red dot.

I’m not familiar with using a red dot on a pistol. I have red dots on my shot gun and green dots on a few ARs.

Red dot is excellent for shooting deer. I’m guessing the green dots on the ars will be good for shooting non deer.

I got one would never bother with a red dot on a pistol. I think it makes it unwieldy, difficult to carry, danger of knocking the scope making it ineffective and essentially useless.

I think red dots are good for fast target acquisition, for things like hunting.

Now , green lasers powered for 100 yards, that my old eyes can’t see anyway, those are pretty cool for shooting from the hip with an ar. And probably any other long gun.

Just my opinion. Happy to learn more for others and their experience.
 
The Venom is a nice sight but I find it more suited to a pistol than a rifle. I had the Venom on my Tavor for a while and replaced it with a different sight (Meprolight). If you are just getting into them and are looking for an economical red dot that gets good reviews check out the Primary Arms Micro. Decent enough sight and cheap enough that if you don't like it you aren't out the money you would have been if you bought an Aimpoint. With my eye's failing the way they are as I get older I find I like shooting with scopes and dots much more than open sights these days.
 
I was in your boat and picked up a Vortex Strikefire II on sale around the holidays. I haven’t had a chance to sight it in yet, but plan to when it gets warmer. It’s currently atop my .223 and I picked that one because it can change from red to green dot, the price, and the reviews.
 
For a S&W Victory without a moving slide, you can get away with a fake RMR for ~$30 from AliExpress. See if you like it before committing. Not a fan of putting a Sparc/Crossfire on a 22lr; avoid the weight/size and smaller window. The Venom is 1.1 oz with a 26.5 mm obj lens. The Sparc/Crossfiire weighs like 5 ozs more with a smaller 21mm lens.
 
Most red dots are placed where it’s easier to mount, “pistol” red dots often have a mounting base that utilizes the rear sight dove tail.
Then it’s a matter of expectations , end use and personal preference, color , size style. I have a inexpensive Hawke brand red/green multi reticle dot sight that lived on a 1911 for a long time. I liked the various reticle but like most things the more it does the more there is to go wrong. I still have my old school Tasco ProPoint too. I would say try as many as you can
 
mtnbiker26 said:
Scopes and iron sights are the only experience I have so far and I'd like to try a red dot on my Victory .22 to start. I know nothing about red dots other than some online articles I've read. Currently leaning towards a Vortex Venom. I've noticed that sometimes they're mounted back where the rear sight would normally be and sometimes they're much further forward. Outside of the obvious things like holstering, is this just a near-sighted, far-sighted thing?

I'm still confused about the different external styles/shapes of red dots. Is the micro-dot style like a Vortex Venom the same as the "tube" style like a Vortex Sparc/Crossfire just in a different form-factor for pistols vs rifles? Thanks.
Click to expand...
What do you want to do with the pistol once you get a dot on it? Hunting? General plinking? Bullseye pistol? They each may use a different kind of electronic sight.
When I read "Victory 22" my mind immediately thinks "bullseye pistol", but they may not be the case. If it were, Ultradot.
 
you can't go wrong with the venom on a pistol . they use the same bases as the burris fastfire and docktor sights so you should have no problem finding a base . i have 4 on 1911's and 2 on cz's . best bang for the buck .

the farther rear the better in my experience .
 
There are a lot of nice red dots out there. I’ve had them on rifles but never a pistol. The bushnell trs25 is nice if you’re wanting to save some dough. If I wanted something higher quality I may do the venom and have also heard the cmore sights are good for pistols like that.
 
As PatMcD said. Its going to depend on what kind of shooting you are planning on doing. Slow fire/ precision/ plinking, tube style work well for that. But they have too narrow a window for fast pistol shooting without putting a huge tube on. You end up losing the dot in the window, especially if it mounted to the slide. I really like the C-more slide ride. You can get different dot sizes, it is fairly rugged but the adjustments aren't very precise.

Where you mount it is personal preference. field of view isn't affected because you are shooting both eyes open, so it won't change. What will change is the screen will seem bigger if it is closer to your eye, but so will the whole sight. So find a distance that allows you to find and track the dot well but also doesn't obstruct your view
 
PatMcD said:
What do you want to do with the pistol once you get a dot on it? Hunting? General plinking? Bullseye pistol? They each may use a different kind of electronic sight.
When I read "Victory 22" my mind immediately thinks "bullseye pistol", but they may not be the case. If it were, Ultradot.
Click to expand...

Oh, just plinking at the indoor range. I installed the Tandemkross race gun kit (lighter trigger, extended mag release, Halo charging ring, bigger mag floorplates) and I'm really liking the Victory. I'm discovering that the light recoil makes it pretty fun to shoot fairly quickly and accurately but beyond 15 yards the target becomes fuzzy once I focus on my front sight. I have still have good eyesight but I'm thinking that a red dot might help because I can look through it and keep the bullseye in focus.
 
I wanted to try give the red dot on a pistol a try so I bought a Sig with one factory installed.
At first I shot about as well with it as the iron sights, but I was slow and had to work on my presentation so I didnt have to hunt for the dot.
After a bit I got better at it and the dot now appears every time.
Standing still, shooting at paper, I didnt see much advantage other than being able to focus on the target instead of the front sight.
I think the real advantage to a red dot comes if you are moving or the target is moving, or both are moving.
I think there is a real advantage to having one on the two way range.
 
With the minis the actual dot ends up lower, closer to the bore. In a "Bullseye" situation this may not be a big deal as your shooting at a fixed distance, but once you start having some targets at 3 feet and some at 35 yards you get a fairly significant aiming error with a sight that is mounted relatively high over the bore.


Another thing to keep in mind about red dots.....many claim they are an advantage, some claim an unfair advantage....the reality is no matter what type of sight your using, it's much much more about putting whatever it is where it needs to be and keeping it there while you fire the gun.
 
I've got a primary arms micro and a vortex venom. I haven't run them in the rain yet. How bad does it affect them and are different types better than others?
 
Supermoto said:
Try focusing on the target while using your iron sights.
Click to expand...
I can’t see how this works for shooting small groups in the X ring?
When shooting at torso silhouette size targets I do more of a eyes on target type shooting but there is no way I can hit the 5.5” bull at 25 yards with out front sight focus and putting the clear front sight in the middle of the blur down range

In the end you do what works best for you
 
mac1911 said:
I can’t see how this works for shooting small groups in the X ring?
When shooting at torso silhouette size targets I do more of a eyes on target type shooting but there is no way I can hit the 5.5” bull at 25 yards with out front sight focus and putting the clear front sight in the middle of the blur down range

In the end you do what works best for you
Click to expand...

It works great for small targets at distance

 
Supermoto said:
It works great for small targets at distance

Click to expand...

Maybe I’m wrong but shot looked high left to me and no ding?
Anyway if it works for you that all that matters. Been about 8 years since I shot at anything but steel . I am getting a semi wad cutter mold for my 45 soon and will be trying to get back at it.
 
mac1911 said:
Maybe I’m wrong but shot looked high left to me and no ding?
Anyway if it works for you that all that matters. Been about 8 years since I shot at anything but steel . I am getting a semi wad cutter mold for my 45 soon and will be trying to get back at it.
Click to expand...

He's shooting the spent shotgun shell on top of the steel
 
sevenMMmag said:
He's shooting the spent shotgun shell on top of the steel
Click to expand...
Hahahah , I thought that was part of the pole holding the plate up! Hey if you can see a shotgun hull at 25 yards good enough to shoot it , bravo! Those days have passed for my eyes
 
I see you are going to do indoor plinking. Any red dot works there. The smaller (3 MOA) dots better for bullseye, but you will pick up the large 6 MOA faster for multiple targets.
If you shoot outdoors, the option to switch from the red to a green dot really makes a huge difference. In low light, the green doesn't blind you from seeing the target as clearly
The Bushnell Trophy is an inexpensive tube type with red/green and 4 selectable reticles. Natchez (natchezss.) carries them at a great price. Have one on each of my Ruger revolvers (.44 and .22/.22 Mag) and my daughter has another on her Walther P22
Good for plinking, targets and hunting. For speed shooting plates or self defense, the tube type sight will be slower UNLESS you keep shooting often enough to keep that muscle memory tuned in. Then the sight comes up on target no matter what kind of sight it is
 
I opted for a Holosun Green Dot 2MOA. Decent prices on O.P.....
if you search around on the net you can usually find a 10% discount code for O.P.
Free shipping too... on orders $49.99 & up...

Also tandemkross has great accessories for the Victory Pistol

IMG_1183.JPG
 
One thing to consider is if you have any eye issues. I have dual astigmatisms and my strong side eye has the worse of the two. My eyes will see different red dots differently, for example, aim points are one of the worst for my eyes. I don't know why but I have tried several models and any aimpoint is more of a / than a dot
 
jron said:
One thing to consider is if you have any eye issues. I have dual astigmatisms and my strong side eye has the worse of the two. My eyes will see different red dots differently, for example, aim points are one of the worst for my eyes. I don't know why but I have tried several models and any aimpoint is more of a / than a dot
Click to expand...

Yep, pretty common. I do a lot of indoor bullseye, had the same problem, and last year got prescription shooting glasses and now the dot is back to being nice and round.

P
 
Salyeica said:
Has anyone taken a look at this optic from PA?

Primary Arms SLx1 Compact 1x20 Prism Scope - ACSS-Cyclops Reticle PAC1X-ACSS-CYCLOPS

I have an astigmatism and cataracts (congenital), so I need something with an etched reticle rather than a standard dot. ARF.com reviews are good, wondering if anyone here has firsthand knowledge of it. Thanks!
Click to expand...

This thread is mostly about red dot sights for pistols. The sight above won't work on a pistol, since the web page states it has a 3.7" eye relief. You are correct in thinking that a prism scope with an etched reticle will give a much better visual picture with some types of astigmatism. But the tradeoff is that all prism optics have a set amount of eye relief, even if they have no magnification. Traditional red dot sights with no magnification have "unlimited" eye relief, and they really do work fine on a traditional rifle mount, or a scout mount, or at arms length on a pistol.

I have not used the sight above, but I have used other prism scopes on rifles, and they work quite well. For people with certain vision problems, they are probably the best choice. However, I am not aware of any prism optics with the extended eye relief that would be necessary on a handgun.
 

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