AWB Rejected by none other than...

Wrench75 said:
People in this thread have mentioned "keeping the pressure on". It should be kept on wayyyy after we defeat this ban. Our focus should be on getting the "act" of trying to deprive us of our rights declared unconstitutional.... Oh wait it is the Constitution says so... Point being if we can get the act of trying to take our 2a (or any other Const. rights), without amending the Const., to be declared a crime. Then we may be able to force them to rescind the other bans on state and fed. levels. Until the Const. says my gun has to be "this" long or only be semi-auto the whole concept of NFA weapons is bullshit....
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After all these crap bills are behind us we need to go on the legislative offense. Right now we have probably millions of gun owners/2nd supporters fired up hopefully doing their part. We NEED to go on the offensive for a change. I am so sick of constantly playing defense!
 
japollner said:
You are correct. However, the government does not have to force me to pay taxes. I pay them and have no problem with how most of my money is spent. I don't agree with defense spending, bank bail outs and items like that that help big business fat cats.

I also have a problem with allowing those who are the richest of the rich go along and not have to see that money back down the consumer food chain. If they amass huge fortunes and don't spend it in a way that gets filtered back down to the poor, then I feel it's the govt's job to regulate that money and use it on federal welfare systems.

None of what I just said has any bearing on my gun stance. I don't think the govt has any place instituting an AWB.
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Perhaps this is obvious, but if you know that 50% of what you will make will be taken from you and redistributed to those who do nothing, you will quickly find a way to avoid that situation or just not earn the higher amounts that will be taken.

This is America. If you want wealth redistribution goto Europe. Last time I checked, there was no law requiring anyone to spend every dime they made.
 
Dill said:
No he's right. Liberal and Conservative are based on fiscal policy only. The fact that we only have 2 major parties has over shadowed this. But not all registered Democrats want gun control, nor do all conservatives own guns. Just like abortion, weed legislation etc. This is why we need multiple parties, and why nothing is every accomplished in Washington.
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Actually, the liberal vs conservative model is overly simplistic. Political leanings are better displayed with multiple axes, such as on the test here:
The Political Compass - Test
There are others too.

Our current two-party system is a choice of one authoritarianism over another.
 
japollner said:
You are correct. However, the government does not have to force me to pay taxes. I pay them and have no problem with how most of my money is spent. I don't agree with defense spending, bank bail outs and items like that that help big business fat cats.

I also have a problem with allowing those who are the richest of the rich go along and not have to see that money back down the consumer food chain. If they amass huge fortunes and don't spend it in a way that gets filtered back down to the poor, then I feel it's the govt's job to regulate that money and use it on federal welfare systems.

None of what I just said has any bearing on my gun stance. I don't think the govt has any place instituting an AWB.
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[slap]
 
MichaelJR said:
Seriously. This is ridiculous. Any compromise is one more step onto the gallows platform. Morons can't see that they dig their own graves ever single time they compromise an inch.


"Send it" like chinalfr from my can attached to a string from another can in the lair of the dark lord kramdar.
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Yup. I smell an out yourself thread, possibly the 2nd one today. WTF.
 
THESAW249 said:
japollner...you should probably think long and hard about that post...
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Honestly, I am the least political I have ever been in the last year. I could really care less what others think of my political feelings at this point. Neg rep on here doesn't hurt me.

This is a shooting message board. If you have a problem withy fiscally liberal stance, find me on a politics site, and yell at me via that avenue.
 
TLB said:
Actually, the liberal vs conservative model is overly simplistic. Political leanings are better displayed with multiple axes, such as on the test here:
The Political Compass - Test
There are others too.

Our current two-party system is a choice of one authoritarianism over another.
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Interesting link. I took the test and wasn't really surprised with the outcome.
I see less and less difference between the parties everyday.
pcgraphpng.php
 
MichaelJR said:
We need to start running independents and libertarians with an agenda. Pandering to the right and moderates accomplishes nothing in this state. This state votes on social issues....so give them what they want. Nothing is more socially liberal than a libertarian. Nobody is more pro-gun than a libertarian. Nothing is more pro-capitalism than a libertarian.


"Send it" like chinalfr from my can attached to a string from another can in the lair of the dark lord kramdar.
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That's exactly the way I think we need to approach things in this state.

The "conservatives" who continue to want to thump their bible on the abortion issue are non-starters here - and it's screwing all of us.
 
Dill said:
Interesting link. I took the test and wasn't really surprised with the outcome.
I see less and less difference between the parties everyday.
pcgraphpng.php
Click to expand...

Did you notice that Obama and Romney are both in the upper right hand portion of the graph and quite near each other? IMO, many Americans are in the green and purple, but our politicians are not. For the record, I am about 6 squares to the right of you (towards Friedman).
 
Bolio said:
Common sense is starting to kick in?
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No, not at all. These politicos aren't turning down her AWB because they believe in the 2nd Amendment or because they don't believe in her bill. They are turning down her AWB simply because they know they would get hammered at the next election if they voted for it.
 
mattyw said:
I had someone on my fishing forum tell me he is a gun owner and supports the second amendment but he is in favor of an AWB because crazies don't need 30 round mags, and he doesnt care as long as they don't come for his 15 round glock mags
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I just had a conversation with a co-worker today who talked about all his time in the military - how he has been a gun owner for years, his wife was a shooter too - how he "used to" have his license and so did she.

Then he told me how he let the license lapse - as did his wife. But he still has all the guns stored up in the attic. That's when I told him he is in serious violation of MA law and if the police or fire dept ever have to show up at his house - he'd likely get a proctology exam like he'd never seen before.

He also said he doesn't see the need for "assault weapons" - so yeah , they're out there.
 
Common sense might have taken place in Washington......but Not here in the Commonwealth.....nothing to celebrate here.....we're not out of the woods yet.....
 
japollner said:
Would you people stop referring to anti gun folk as "liberals"? Shit!

I am liberal, and also a against a change to gun laws.

And I know conservatives, who are for gun control reform.

So drop the liberal/conservative labels from threads like these. My stance on gun control has no bearing on my fiscal views...
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The problem is that "liberals" are typically the ones leading the charge to more restrictions on gun ownership. There are "conservatives" out there who would like to do the same thing - but they typically get beaten down by people within their own party - whereas the "liberals" typically find copious support for this kind of stuff both within their party and within their voting bloc at large.

So yeah - it IS a "liberal" problem - and we're going to keep blaming them for it.

If you want it to stop - then the Democratic party and "liberals" in general need to stop constantly arguing for more rights infringement.

Good luck with that by the way.
 
japollner said:
You are correct. However, the government does not have to force me to pay taxes. I pay them and have no problem with how most of my money is spent. I don't agree with defense spending, bank bail outs and items like that that help big business fat cats.

I also have a problem with allowing those who are the richest of the rich go along and not have to see that money back down the consumer food chain. If they amass huge fortunes and don't spend it in a way that gets filtered back down to the poor, then I feel it's the govt's job to regulate that money and use it on federal welfare systems.

None of what I just said has any bearing on my gun stance. I don't think the govt has any place instituting an AWB.
Click to expand...

You believe in something that never has been and can never be.
 
japollner said:
You are correct. However, the government does not have to force me to pay taxes. I pay them and have no problem with how most of my money is spent. I don't agree with defense spending, bank bail outs and items like that that help big business fat cats.

I also have a problem with allowing those who are the richest of the rich go along and not have to see that money back down the consumer food chain. If they amass huge fortunes and don't spend it in a way that gets filtered back down to the poor, then I feel it's the govt's job to regulate that money and use it on federal welfare systems.

None of what I just said has any bearing on my gun stance. I don't think the govt has any place instituting an AWB.
Click to expand...

How can a grown person be so stupid? [sad2] I'll never understand why someone would think what one person earns should be given to a 2nd person simply because they want or "need" it.
 
Finalygotabeltfed said:
Then find another way to hold some other sword across their necks. They're all corrupt, its just a matter of finding out how, where and when, then screwing them into the ground.
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This. ^^^. If you follow them around long enough, they're always engaged in some form of corruption. I would love to have the free time to just surveil them.

Sent from my .gov tracking device
 
japollner said:
Honestly, I am the least political I have ever been in the last year. I could really care less what others think of my political feelings at this point. Neg rep on here doesn't hurt me.

This is a shooting message board. If you have a problem withy fiscally liberal stance, find me on a politics site, and yell at me via that avenue.
Click to expand...

Guns and politics - and taxes - are intimately linked.

This is why I said you believe in something that never was and never can be.

I am either the master of my own body, the fruits of my own labor - and my own mind - or I am not. There really is no middle ground.

If I am forced by a government to give up some percentage of the money I earn thru exchange with others - or to surrender legally acquired property - then I am not fully in control of the fruits of my own labor - AM I? For some portion of my life I am essentially a slave. And that slavery is enforced at the barrel of a gun. Because if refuse - I will go to jail. If the enforcement arm of the government finds out that I would like to be fully in control of the fruits of my labor - and I simply refuse to comply and stop sending them money.......

PEOPLE WITH GUNS SHOW UP AND FORCE ME TO COMPLY.

The ability of a person to have a firearm - is a manifestation of political sovereignty. It means that that person DOES HAVE "ultimate power".

Saying that the free ownership of guns - unregulated by the government - and a "liberal" welfare state where people are FORCED to pay into the system - are fully compatible - is a unicorn dream. They are simply not compatible.

This is exactly why the United States were formed the way they were - with the Constitution they had - and with a seriously limited goverment. It's because true liberty - which means gun ownership - and only those taxes which are ABSOLUTELY necessary is only possible with a small government.

All other areas of the human condition - are NOT supposed to be solved by government action - they are to be solved by societal or individual action - and these do NOT have to be dependent on the government at all in a society that practices true liberty.

Your head is all messed up if you think that we can somehow have a society and country where people are taxed to death - and still enjoy free and open gun ownership. It's simply impossible.
 

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