Shooters Outpost going into Amherst NH (old Sportsmans Trading) Status

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drgrant said:
I can name drop several shops but I'm not that kind of a cretin, lets just say they are shops that are well liked by many. One of them refused to sell my friend an MA legal wasr. (this was years ago long before healeyban). Ironically he got it at SO a month later with no issues. One of my favorite NH shops won't sell me certain rifles which I know are 100% legal here. I don't care, shop's gotta cover its ass, I get it. It's not enough to make me not patronize any of them. Pretending that you can undo the brain damage baked into these shop policies is just a waste of time. So I just visit a few different dealers and save my angst for more important things.
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A NH shop choosing not to sell a firearm that is questionably on the mAss naughty list is a whole other ball of wax because it clearly is an item thats highly regulated at the FED and State levels....do I agree with it? No, do I understand it? Yes......does doing so provide a very real/meaningful protection from legal consequences? Absolutely

This is fundamentally different from ammo/mags
 
jpk said:
A NH shop choosing not to sell a firearm that is questionably on the mAss naughty list is a whole other ball of wax because it clearly is an item thats highly regulated at the FED and State levels....do I agree with it? No, do I understand it? Yes......does doing so provide a very real/meaningful protection from legal consequences? Absolutely

This is fundamentally different from ammo/mags
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No, it's not. There was nothing questionable. The MA awb, at least at that time, was well vetted (it's virtually an exact mirror of the fed awb, which most dealers are still familiar with) and not rocket science. This is a store policy issue not fundamentally different from ammo or magazines. In each case the sale is perfectly legal but the dealers ascribe their own policy to regulating it. (which is fine, if it's a problem, I just go somewhere else... )

-Mike
 
drgrant said:
No, it's not. There was nothing questionable. The MA awb, at least at that time, was well vetted (it's virtually an exact mirror of the fed awb, which most dealers are still familiar with) and not rocket science. This is a store policy issue not fundamentally different from ammo or magazines. In each case the sale is perfectly legal but the dealers ascribe their own policy to regulating it. (which is fine, if it's a problem, I just go somewhere else... )

-Mike
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I agree on the "I choose to go somewhere else/support vendors that I agree with practices of"

But from a regulatory/legal point there's no comparison between Firearms and ammunition/mags

The former is serialized/highly regulated and the latter is not
 
jpk said:
I agree on the "I choose to go somewhere else/support vendors that I agree with practices of"

But from a regulatory/legal point there's no comparison between Firearms and ammunition/mags

The former is serialized/highly regulated and the latter is not
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legal is legal... it's that simple. how much is regulated is irrelevant in the vein of the whining being levied in this thread. Sure one is regulated by law more than the other, but the crux of the complaints here are the same- which is that SO and others have store policies not perfectly concordant with the actual laws. The "but guns are special" argument invalidates the entire premise of the whining.

-Mike
 
drgrant said:
legal is legal... it's that simple. how much is regulated is irrelevant in the vein of the whining being levied in this thread. Sure one is regulated by law more than the other, but the crux of the complaints here are the same- which is that SO and others have store policies not perfectly concordant with the actual laws. The "but guns are special" argument invalidates the entire premise of the whining.
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If it were only true that "Legal is legal" we wouldnt see half of the people charged for a raft of crimes we currently see on a regular basis........

Guns according to law ARE special otherwise there wouldnt be a metric buttload of laws surrounding manufacture, distribution, ownership and transfer that has been steadily built upon at a redonculous pace since the early 1900's

At the same time there's little if any regulation surrounding ammunition and even less wrt mags.

When ammunition and mags are serialized let me know......until then your argument doesnt hold water.....to be clear I'm not defending or supporting ANY of these retarded laws.......but the simple fact of the matter remains.....the ATF WILL shut down a gun shop for not following laws regarding xfer of firearms while the same doesnt hold true for sales on non regulated items
 
jpk said:
If it were only true that "Legal is legal" we wouldnt see half of the people charged for a raft of crimes we currently see on a regular basis........

Guns according to law ARE special otherwise there wouldnt be a metric buttload of laws surrounding manufacture, distribution, ownership and transfer that has been steadily built upon at a redonculous pace since the early 1900's

At the same time there's little if any regulation surrounding ammunition and even less wrt mags.

When ammunition and mags are serialized let me know......until then your argument doesnt hold water.....to be clear I'm not defending or supporting ANY of these retarded laws.......but the simple fact of the matter remains.....the ATF WILL shut down a gun shop for not following laws regarding xfer of firearms while the same doesnt hold true for sales on non regulated items
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It holds a tanker truck of water in the context of most of the whining about SO, etc. The "guns are special" thing is a cop out so the virtue signaling rkba crew on NES can double down on their butthurt against a gun shop... Not even saying YOU are doing this btw, I think we're talking about the same thing in two different contexts. I'm done with this extension cord mess, I think people are going to do what they want. And the gun shops are also going to do what they want... [laugh]
 
jpk said:
You just illustrated my own and others points so please stop trying to twist the argument around and suggest that people said something they didnt actually say

Shooters is asking its customers to comply with some set of rules they crafted that is far above and beyond state and federal law.

These rules are well understood to provide shooters with no additional protection under the law should they come under scrutiny of ATF or state of NH.....

Mass or ANY state outside of NH has no standing to bring suit against shooters unless shooters is doing mail order to out of state customers......NH AG has set the bar many times on mAss's attempts to collect taxes/regulate NH businesses that have mass customers that come to NH to do business.

At the same time they've provided no information on how they are retaining customer required information, how they are protecting it or who they may/may not share it with under <insert conditions/circumstances>

There are a plethora of small/quality shops inside of a 60 min drive of shooters that dont put its customers though the same "enhanced screening" nor do they collect/retain/share information on their customers beyond whats required by law.

His business/His Rules
My dollars/My choice

I dont think its too much to ask that shooters explain/post how they are retaining customer required information, how they are protecting it or who they may/may not share it with under <insert conditions/circumstances>
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You seem to just love being the "fly in the ointment" You don't shop at my store, you shouldn't be butthurt by anything I do. Is your life so miserable that you feel like you should share your misery with everyone else?
Time to enjoy yourself jpk - head to the range and have some fun this weekend.
BTW: My information is protected. 4473's are only available for #1. Inspection for errors. #2. A search warrant. At no time during a ATF Inspection do I allow any photocopying of any of them. As far as anything else goes: It's none of your business. If you continue to spread the BS about us sharing customer information - A different & expensive conversation will be in your future. Don't take my kindness for weakness.
 
jpk said:
Yep....anyone thats ever shopped there for ammo/mags has been required to provide them with ID which they then type info info from your ID into their computer systems.

It is not nor has it ever been a simple "Are you over 18/21" check
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I dont recall them ever typing my NH drivers license info into a computer. When did this start happening?
 
Been reading this thread and I find it odd, that you Mass people must show and LTC to buy ammo in Massachusetts yet you are offended that a NH dealer, who must answer to ATF asks for it in NH to simply show that you are elgible to buy said ammo. They dont write it down, they just look at it. They do it for everyone. I had family visiting from another state and they showed their drivers license and bought tax free ammo at Shooters. Its really not a big deal. But it would be if they wrote down the info on the license. As for magazines, you cant have them in Mass. If you really own a home in NH and truly want them just buy online and have them shipped. Youre life as gun owners is not good. We all know this. But a legitimate business, whose prices are more than fair wants to prevent against getting sued by your anti gun AG. Sure, he might go to court and get it dismissed, but at what cost? $10,000, $20,000, $30,000? For what, a $300 case of ammo?

I support Shooters as a customer and agree with their policy. If you dont like it than work in your state to change the laws. You can start by pushing GOAL to be more like NHFC. They dont seem to fight very hard. I heard they asked for last years red flag bill.
 
Shooters-Hooksett said:
Before we open is the plan. Thanks for bringing the shrimp... yum. NES Exclusive
Click to expand...

enbloc said:
How many lbs? [smile]
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I think it will have to be low capacity shrimp to be legal for MA residents. [laugh]

jpk said:
If Shooters is going to go above and beyond the law then I also believe they have a responsibility to their customers to explain/guarantee how their going to collect/retain/protect/share the personal information that they are requiring their customers to provide to them......
Click to expand...
This is not the first thread on this topic. I remember Jim stating a long time ago in a similar thread that he does not collect the info, just that his clerks look at the LTC/FID and proceed with the sale. I see below where he has also stated this in the current thread.

ScottS said:
I can understand Jim’s reasons for the policies he has in place, but I’m not sure they provide the protection he seeks.

When the Indians come scalp-hunting, it doesn’t matter if your hair is combed or not.
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This is so very true!

Shooters-Hooksett said:
It never has!
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And again Jim has stated that his company does not keep any data from our LTC/FID on ammo/mag purchases.
 
granitestater said:
Been reading this thread and I find it odd, that you Mass people must show and LTC to buy ammo in Massachusetts yet you are offended that a NH dealer, who must answer to ATF asks for it in NH to simply show that you are elgible to buy said ammo. They dont write it down, they just look at it. They do it for everyone. I had family visiting from another state and they showed their drivers license and bought tax free ammo at Shooters. Its really not a big deal. But it would be if they wrote down the info on the license. As for magazines, you cant have them in Mass. If you really own a home in NH and truly want them just buy online and have them shipped. Youre life as gun owners is not good. We all know this. But a legitimate business, whose prices are more than fair wants to prevent against getting sued by your anti gun AG. Sure, he might go to court and get it dismissed, but at what cost? $10,000, $20,000, $30,000? For what, a $300 case of ammo?

I support Shooters as a customer and agree with their policy. If you dont like it than work in your state to change the laws. You can start by pushing GOAL to be more like NHFC. They dont seem to fight very hard. I heard they asked for last years red flag bill.
Click to expand...

again, glad your statism/elitism is showing again. I'm glad you you think it's OK to treat NH property owners like second class citizens. EABOD

....and GOAL 'asking for last year's Red Flag bill' is a steaming pile of bullshit even bigger than your earlier statism.
 
jpk said:
Yep....anyone thats ever shopped there for ammo/mags has been required to provide them with ID which they then type info info from your ID into their computer systems.

It is not nor has it ever been a simple "Are you over 18/21" check
Click to expand...

A few weeks back I bought a mag for my SIG 2022 from SO (which by the way, was not behind a counter. It was in the SIG display area hanging on a display hook). When I finally made my way to the checkout (I was carrying it the whole time in my grubby mitts), the guy behind the counter asked to see my ID. In a perfect world that would've rubbed me the wrong way but we live in an incredibly litigious society where you never know if you are being setup to fall. I showed the guy my NH DL and all was good...no numbers taken, nothing. I paid the man in cash the outrageous price that SIG demands (not SO's fault) and walked out.

I have worked in retail and there really is a reason why many of the smaller items are kept behind the counter...it's called theft. Too much of it impacts prices directly. Even with theft control in place, stuff still walks. You may be shocked at the lengths some a-holes go to rip off a store and some of the stuff they manage to walk out with. After working for 8+ years in our local ham radio store during the 90's, and seeing some of the stuff I've seen, I am no longer surprised.
 
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JayMcB said:
again, glad your statism/elitism is showing again. I'm glad you you think it's OK to treat NH property owners like second class citizens. EABOD

....and GOAL 'asking for last year's Red Flag bill' is a steaming pile of bullshit even bigger than your earlier statism.
Click to expand...
Why do you live in MA again?
 
JayMcB said:
again, glad your statism/elitism is showing again. I'm glad you you think it's OK to treat NH property owners like second class citizens. EABOD

....and GOAL 'asking for last year's Red Flag bill' is a steaming pile of bullshit even bigger than your earlier statism.
Click to expand...
It’s time to move on JayMcB. We know how you feel, nothing will ever change your mind, and we all know that you “own land” in NH. Like jpk , you seem to thrive on stalking any thread about SO. Time to move on and enjoy life my friend. I do invite you to sit down and discuss any of these issues face to face. I’m old schooled -and prefer to look someone in the eye while having a discussion. If you feel that so strongly about this, stop in and talk to me. You never know, maybe you could leave as a friend.
 
out of 9800 posts here, less than .1% are related to shooter's. So the 'thrive on' seems a bit condescending, but whatever gets you through the night. I don't like the scumbags at Gun Parlor either, but I don't 'thrive on' posts on them either.

Good luck with your new store(s).

Also, it's not 'land', (nice inference) it's a house. Tucked up in the white mountains. Literally in 2 towns. Here is the view. The white strip is an 1100 foot driveway. There's enough 'land' that I shoot off my front porch.

upload_2019-4-28_7-4-34.png
 
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