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Re-application for LTC A

SiameseRat

SiameseRat

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I can't find any information on this online and don't know anybody who has encountered this before:

I was issued a Class A LTC, Sporting and Target "restriction."

My current license does not expire until 2010. I have moved to a town that openly admits that they issue ALP as a rule, not an exception, unlike so many other towns.

One officer I spoke with has now said that I am more than welcome to drop off an application, but since I have a current LTC there is basically no chance the Chief will "override" the last decision on an unexpired license.

Does anybody here know if there is any legal reason why I would NOT be issued a new license, or is it a hopeless case and I should save my $100? I (naively, I guess) assumed that it is possible to reapply at any given time in any town you live in, for any reason.

Do any of you lawyers on the board have any suggestions or experience with a case like this?

Thanks- Jen
 
One of my friends suggested that, but it would be awfully, suspicious, since I've already spoken with the PD about it and they know I'm coming down. [cry]
 
Jen,

Talk with the chief! You have nothing to lose. Ask him outright if he'll do it or not. That way you only spend the $100 if you are going to get "results".

Since you already have a valid LTC, he's under no obligation to issue a new one (new expiration date). Chiefs typically like to stick together, so he might feel that he's "over-ruling your old chief" and refuse.

If you lose your LTC, there is a new procedure in place, you end up with a replacement LTC with the date and all info staying the same as the original. So, that won't work!

I find that honesty pays off, just level with the guy and see what he says, you could be surprised.
 
When I moved I did exactly that. When they asked why I was renewing my license so early I told them I wanted to "upgrade" to a nonrestricted ALP. They didn't seem to care one way or another but thought I was strange to pay the money for a new license when I didn't need it....
 
SR, there is hope, but do follow Len's suggestion and talk with the chief before filing. I hate to have you waste $100 that you could better put toward a new gun or more ammunition if the info the cop gave you is an accurate reflection of the chief's policy.

Good luck and do let us know how it turns out.

Ken
 
KMaurer said:
SR, there is hope, but do follow Len's suggestion and talk with the chief before filing. I hate to have you waste $100 that you could better put toward a new gun or more ammunition if the info the cop gave you is an accurate reflection of the chief's policy.

Good luck and do let us know how it turns out.

Ken
Click to expand...

+2
 
Lynne said:
KMaurer said:
SR, there is hope, but do follow Len's suggestion and talk with the chief before filing. I hate to have you waste $100 that you could better put toward a new gun or more ammunition if the info the cop gave you is an accurate reflection of the chief's policy.

Good luck and do let us know how it turns out.

Ken
Click to expand...

+2
Click to expand...

+4 :D
 
Re: What town are you in?

jcohen said:
What town are you in?

You may want to send a letter to the chief outlining 1. Your suitability for the license. 2. Your proper purpose. 3. Why no restrictions should be imposed. Make the letter very genuine and respectful. You may want to put it in the form of a new application and spend the $100. You may also wish to include some thorough letters of recommendation, not one liners, but sincere letters from people who really know you.

The above may show the chief that you are a sensible person who would appreciate an unrestricted LTC. If you don't come off like a whack-job in the chief's opinion, you will probably get good results in a reasonable town.
Click to expand...


Jesse's approach was what finally turned the tide for me in Somerville. Granted it was the time for my renewal, but i'm convinced the time I spent with Jesse was the difference between walking out the door with an ALP (Finally!) vs a restricted LTC.

Welcome back Jesse!

Bugie
 
I suggest that when you go visit the Chief, you make extra sure you're polite and well dressed. This sounds stupid and demeaning to say, but some people blow this first point. I'd also recommend having your recommendation letters with you, in case the Chief asks why.

Believe it or not, I went through a not totally different situation when applying for my NH CCW Permit. Being from VT, and the fact that we don't need or have CCW Permits, I had to get a letter from my local Chief LEO. In my case, that's the County Sheriff. I spoke to him for several minutes, and he was balking at giving me a letter, since he didn't personally know me. I got out of that since I pointed out that NH wanted to know "to the best of his knowledge". I did get the letter in the end.
 
Re: What town are you in?

jcohen said:
What town are you in?

You may want to send a letter to the chief outlining 1. Your suitability for the license. 2. Your proper purpose. 3. Why no restrictions should be imposed. Make the letter very genuine and respectful. You may want to put it in the form of a new application and spend the $100. You may also wish to include some thorough letters of recommendation, not one liners, but sincere letters from people who really know you.

The above may show the chief that you are a sensible person who would appreciate an unrestricted LTC. If you don't come off like a whack-job in the chief's opinion, you will probably get good results in a reasonable town.
Click to expand...

Hi Jesse- sorry didn't notice I'd gotten more posts on this. I'm in Melrose right now. Everyone besides the Lt in charge has said that Melrose issues ALP because that's just the way it should be (amen).
The Lt said that I should send a short note to him to review with the Chief regarding why I would want an ALP. I did so and did not hear back from him. I waited about 6 weeks (didn't want to seem pesky) and then called him. He said that the Chief probably wouldn't even review my license because he wouldn't want to go against the last issuing officer since the LTC A Sporting and Target is "what was agreed upon."

As an aside, my short note said only that I am an NRA/MSP cert'd firearms instructor and that I wanted an ALP because of the security and clarity of the designation.

(I mean, if you think about it, can I prove that instructing is a sporting or target event? If not, then am I breaking the law when I handle firearms in front of a class...?)
So should I try to meet with the chief and leave the middle man out, or just send in my app with the knowledge that the Lt may never even pass it on to the Chief?
 
SR,
The situation only illustrates yet another example of the "Blue Wall". The chief doesn't want to supersede another cop's judgement. What is so funny is that law enforcement is so local. Every department has its pettty jealousies, and cops have notorious turf wars, but they will band together in situations involving civilians aka "fc's".

Nickel, you are a member of the State Military Forces of Vermont, that Sheriff was a real smart-ass saying he didn't know you well enough. Sure he gave you a letter in the end, but he had to bust your chops a little beforehand...so typical. Perhaps the day will come when Vermont is under martial law, and you can put him in his own jail without a writ of habeaus corpus. It isn't likely that will ever happen, but at least one can dream about it. :)

Mark
 
Hey Jesse? Since SR is a certified instructor, and most likely carries guns locked up to the range for class....could she use that for a reason to ask for a Class A? Or would that create a more slippery slope?
 
You'd be better off schmoozing a politician in town, and have them talk to the chief. Is Melrose still a dry town other than that one restaurant?
 
Just talked to Sgt Moran (gun officer in Marlboro) who told me that I was thinking of applying for my renewal WAAYYY too soon. My b'day is the first week of May, he said to come on down the first week of April.

Apparently, Marlboro does have the on-line licensing. Stay tune, shooting fans... we'll see how this goes.

Ross
 
We're online too Ross. Mine expires in April. The clerk who does them wanted me to do it last week but she got tied up. She says we have a 6-8 week wait right now.
 
JonJ said:
We're online too Ross. Mine expires in April. The clerk who does them wanted me to do it last week but she got tied up. She says we have a 6-8 week wait right now.
Click to expand...
Oh, lovely. Well, I'll post my experiences and we'll see how it goes. [roll]
 
I forgot to go see her today. It'll be the 1st thing I do tomorrow AM after roll-call. I think I'll make Barb's appt at the same time. There's probably a 2-3 week wait for that too.
 
Misinformation


"I just talked to Sgt Moran (gun officer in Marlboro) who told me that I was thinking of applying for my renewal WAAYYY too soon. My b'day is the first week of May, he said to come on down the first week of April"


Typical cop crap. Walpole "refuses" to take apps more than 2 months in advance, despite the facts that:

1. The state is required by law to send renewals at least 90 days in advance; and

2. Said renewal directs the licensee to file it immediately.

Note also that there is NO restriction as to how far in advance you can file and no authorization for a PD to refuse a duly submitted app.

Read how many people are waiting MONTHS for licenses and you will see why this is an issue.
 
Renewal

I applied in a town which is solidly green, and introduces no delays beyond "all paperwork on licenses in mailed out every Friday."

Submitted 12/1/05, received 1/26/06 - just under two months.

And that's with a department which does not give LTC-A/ALP applicants any grief and does not impose any optional requirements.
 
Scrivener said:
Misinformation


"I just talked to Sgt Moran (gun officer in Marlboro) who told me that I was thinking of applying for my renewal WAAYYY too soon. My b'day is the first week of May, he said to come on down the first week of April"


Typical cop crap. Walpole "refuses" to take apps more than 2 months in advance, despite the facts that:

1. The state is required by law to send renewals at least 90 days in advance
Click to expand...

I've attached a copy of the CHSB's letter to me (and may I say that I RESENT that I'm receiving mail from something called the Criminal History Systems Board! I'm NOT a criminal, dammit!). But if Marlboro won't let me apply for renewal before April, is there anything I can do other than document when I was told to not come in until then and by who?


CHSB_letter.jpg
 
I see that CHSB has changed the letter to address MIRCS applications. The langugage about filing the app immediately appears to have been dropped.

However, the delays are what they are and there is no statutory basis for a department refusing to accept one.

Aren't you glad GOAL got the 90-day grace period restored? Note, however, that it requires the app be filed BEFORE the expiration date. Amazing how many people think they can wait until AFTER their birthdays to file. [roll]
 
SR,

I would agree with all of Jesse's recommendations, and would also encorage you to document all of the additional firearms training you have completed since your current LTC was issued to you.

Additionally, it might be persuasive to note how many firearms classes you teach, and gently point out that your prominence in your community may well make you a target for someone who knows you have guns and might use lethal force to take them away from you.

I don't know that, standing alone, the notion that you are a MA State Police certified firearms instructor properly addresses the "reason to fear injury" requirment of MGL Ch. 140, S. 131. As I mentioned above, you should jazz it up a little, and not just rest on your teaching credentials alone.

If you haven't yet taken the GOAL Foundation Art of Concealed Carry course, I think it might be a good idea to do so before you reapply for an ALP LTC. Sign up early for this seminar, spots in the class are in very short supply. Upon completing the four hour course, Jon Green will give you a training certificate and letter to your police chief describing the topics in the course. This class carries considerable weight with many chiefs.

One final insider's tip: the thicker your ALP LTC application, the greater your chance of success.

Darius Arbabi
 

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