You are referring, I assume, to ATF Rul. 80-21. Yes, it seems pretty clear that ATF has said they allow this definition of dual residency. Whether the courts themselves would agree with this interpretation, however, is unknown.
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How to get a new Glock in MA?
- Thread starter ItalianBostonian
- Start date
You are referring, I assume, to ATF Rul. 80-21. Yes, it seems pretty clear that ATF has said they allow this definition of dual residency. Whether the courts themselves would agree with this interpretation, however, is unknown.
What I wrote was correct. I did NOT write that buying one would be illegal. What I wrote was:
You won't find a dealer in MA who will sell you a new one unless you are a LEO.
There is one other perfectly legal way to obtain as many new Glocks as your heart desires as a "subject" of MA!
Join a police force!
True, but not the best reason to risk your life however.
There is your court argument. If it is good enough for the police then it is good enough for me to own. When are you people in Ma. going to start standing up for your rights?
Or heaven forbid support a Mass co. like Smith and Wesson. Glocks are crap anyway. How much of the cost to a civilian goes to cover the DEEP discount given to leos. By the way thats probably why they BUY em. Think about it.
![[laugh2]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/014.gif "Laugh at above [laugh2]")
Already tried and failed. A group of dealers and an industry association (NSSF?) sued and lost. Due to a mix-up, they failed to file an appeal in time, and can no longer appeal. IIRC, GOAL tried to file suit, but were ruled not to have standing to do so.
The AG is powerless to harass individual buyers, as they are not "handgun purveyors". This part of the law is crystal clear, IMHO. Remember, these are CS regs, so you're going to tell me, that the AG is going to harass the "victim"? That would be kinda funny, actually, because it would expose the true nature of the regulations. (eg, anti gun as opposed to the BS notional of "consumer protection". ) Remember, we're victims of an "unfair trade practice. "
![[wink]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/002.gif "Wink [wink]")
The AG can put the dealer in a world of hurt though, that much is known, or at least make a lot of noise about it.
-Mike
There is nothing that the AG could do, directly, to the buyer. I suppose the AG could call up the police chief in the buyer's town and try to convince the police chief to pull the buyer's LTC. I've got no idea how likely such a scenario would be.
More than likely the AG wouldn't even know who to harass.
IIRC, the last time the AG ran "stings" on MA dealers and wanted FA-10 copies CHSB would not give them full FA-10s, just the gun and seller info, with buyer info redacted. From what I heard, a pissing match between the AG and EOPS/CHSB ensued, or somesuch, and the end result was that the AG was only allowed to poll relevant info. )
-Mike
I would have loved to heard that exchange. I can just imagine the response from the AG's flunkie when EOPS/CHSB told them to go pound sand.
Was the EOPS/CHSB working in our interest or just giving the AG trouble?
You know the saying, the favorite sport in MA politics is revenge...
rep308
NES Member
You could buy a Glock style frame from:
http://www.ccfraceframes.com/options.php
and get it built up.
http://www.ccfraceframes.com/options.php
and get it built up.
I think the issue EOPS may have taken with it, is that even though the AGs office has the authority to enforce these regulations, since the regulations are only binding against the dealers, the AG literally has no business in knowing who the buyers actually are.
There might be a lot of built in contempt, too. EG, I'm sure the AG's office ties up other MA agencies with a lot of meaningless crap- for example, are the AG's regs really relevant to public safety? No. EOPS likely views the AG's inquiries about such issues much in the way a police department dislikes the old biddy that keeps calling 911 5 times a day because her neighbors dog barks once in awhile- barely relevant to what they do, and highly
annoying.
To put it another way... if CHSB has a choice of priorities..... for example, tracking a sex offender, or helping a LEO track down a gun used in a crime, etc, vs dirt digging for the AG's nanny crap regs, what do you think they're gonna choose to spend time/manpower on?
![[laugh]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/012.gif "Laugh [laugh]")
For as much contempt as I have for most MA state government orgs in general, some are clearly less obnoxious than others are. Even if EOPS does/enforces things we disagree with, they're still less obnoxious than the AG's
office is.
There might also a sort of built in turf battle WRT handgun compliance- eg, to EOPS, the fact that the AG had to make his/her "own" regs instead of just using or enforcing the ones already existing (eg, EOPS handgun testing requirements) in general reeks of redundancy and obnoxiousness, and it's also a sort of a slap in the face to EOPS. Additionally, the AG's BS regs also draw a lot of fire to EOPS from the public... I bet a lot of people have called up EOPS saying "this handgun is on your damned list why can't I buy it in MA?!?!?!?!?" so they end up being the target of at least some misplaced blame. Given that, I'd wager there's a fair amount of informal resentment between EOPS and the AG.
-Mike
I agree. EOPS/CHSB seem to do a good job of simply enforcing the regulations in place, without any regard for BS attempts at gun-grabbing. Every time I've called them to ask something, they've always been professional and courteous. I doubt the same would be true with the AG's office.
technically it would be a straw purchase, but if only you and that LEO knew about it and the LEO bought the weapon and waited a while before selling it to you I doubt you'd get caught. The leo could keep the gun NIB for several months and then do a FTF sale. Anyone asks questions, LEO says I didn't like the gun, I sold it. End of story.
It might start looking suspicious if it became a regular thing.
If somebody wants to break the law, that's between them and their conscience; but we shouldn't make suggestions about breaking the law here on NES.
Glock has SKUs for new guns with 10-round magazines. That's what they sell in states like CA.
Not true. jdubois knows this guy Mack Daddy T in Fitchburg, he'll hook you up, homes. Free dimebag with every Jennings purchased.
![[smile]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/001.gif "Smile [smile]")
And just because the gun is new doesn't mean the mags are. Someone could dump their post-bans out of state before moving in and get pre-bans for it, then sell it. I have a very new Glock with pre-ban mags...it's not rocket science to change magazines.
wheelgun
NES Member
I agree with you that it's preferable to support a Mass. or other U.S. based company. However, your statement that "Glocks are crap" only demonstrates your ignorance of them.
I purchased a Glock years ago because at the time S&W had nothing comparable to offer. I had no prior knowledge of them, but I quickly came to appreciate their wonderfully simple and elegant design. They are so easy to detail strip and have very few parts. And their loose tolerances help produce one of the most reliable autos in the world. To be honest, if I had to buy again today, I might still pick Glock over S&W for these reasons alone, in spite of being a loyal S&W customer.
Oh, and by the way, most polymer guns on the market today are knock offs of the Glock design. So if Glocks are crap, why did S&W and the rest of the world emulate them?
.
My favorite way to get a new Glock in MA. Its just a little complex, but...
Have your local friendly FFL/SOT buy the new Glock of your dreams.
Have them pop a aftermarket barrel in it.
Have them pop on a forward pistol grip, and register it as an AOW.
Have them engrave their manufacturers info on the barrel hood.
Transfer this new AOW to you.
Remove the forward pistol grip.
Write a letter to ATF NFA Branch to remove the AOW from the registry.
Replace the aftermarket barrel with the factory one.
TADA. Brand new, legal, Glock! Might take a few months tho...
--EasyD
Have your local friendly FFL/SOT buy the new Glock of your dreams.
Have them pop a aftermarket barrel in it.
Have them pop on a forward pistol grip, and register it as an AOW.
Have them engrave their manufacturers info on the barrel hood.
Transfer this new AOW to you.
Remove the forward pistol grip.
Write a letter to ATF NFA Branch to remove the AOW from the registry.
Replace the aftermarket barrel with the factory one.
TADA. Brand new, legal, Glock! Might take a few months tho...
--EasyD
TADA. Brand new, legal, Glock! Might take a few months tho...
And I thought the 'buy one from an FFL out-of-state and have them ship just the frame to an in-state FFL' route was clever, but you win
I fixed it for you! Legally they can replace the frame and ship it back to the original owner (owner does FA-10, registration). Glock Legal Dept has decided NOT to do this, even though the law allows it to be done. Both Rob Boudrie and I have had this conversation with the top Glock USA legal beagle and it got us nowhere.
Actually they will replace it with a pre-1998 frame ONLY.
It was another org, not NSSF . . . it was the American Shooting Sports Council, which was an org fading into the sunset (going defunct) at the time. Not certain but the MA gun retailers assn may have also been involved in this suit.
As for the AG and EOPS, lets just say that they haven't had a real successful working relationship for a lot of years. I think that Mike is probably correct.
It is not as easy as going down to the dealer and picking one up - like you could with any MA legal handgun - but you can find Glocks in new - or like new condition if you are persistent and keep looking.
Do you want a "new" Glock because you want third gen? Or do you just want a new gun?
Check out the classifieds here on NES - and you will probably find what you are looking for eventually.
So far I have picked up a third gen Glock 19, a third gen Glock 21, a third gen Glock 22 - and a third gen Glock 30, all from the classifieds here on NES. Two of them were bought directly from police officers - the other two were private sales. But they probably originally entered the pipeline by being sold by cops. I also got a third gen Glock 23 from Four Seasons , this gun is definitely not "new" - but Glock does have a refurb service too that will clean up a Glock for something like $40.00 and refresh it.
My first handgun was a 1st gen Glock 22 - bought from Four Seasons - that for all intents and purposes looks new to me. It was police turn in at some point - and was refurbed to like new condition by Glock.
If you have friends who are cops - you might be able to pick up one that way. I have a friend who recently bought a new in the box - never fired - Glock 30 - thru a contact his brother made with it's original owner - a cop - who told the brother he wanted to sell it. The brother didn't have an interest - but my friend did. So he got a new Glock 30 - for a free state price.
Lessons: make friends at the range, and keep watching the classifieds.
Do you want a "new" Glock because you want third gen? Or do you just want a new gun?
Check out the classifieds here on NES - and you will probably find what you are looking for eventually.
So far I have picked up a third gen Glock 19, a third gen Glock 21, a third gen Glock 22 - and a third gen Glock 30, all from the classifieds here on NES. Two of them were bought directly from police officers - the other two were private sales. But they probably originally entered the pipeline by being sold by cops. I also got a third gen Glock 23 from Four Seasons , this gun is definitely not "new" - but Glock does have a refurb service too that will clean up a Glock for something like $40.00 and refresh it.
My first handgun was a 1st gen Glock 22 - bought from Four Seasons - that for all intents and purposes looks new to me. It was police turn in at some point - and was refurbed to like new condition by Glock.
If you have friends who are cops - you might be able to pick up one that way. I have a friend who recently bought a new in the box - never fired - Glock 30 - thru a contact his brother made with it's original owner - a cop - who told the brother he wanted to sell it. The brother didn't have an interest - but my friend did. So he got a new Glock 30 - for a free state price.
Lessons: make friends at the range, and keep watching the classifieds.
Thanks for the correction. I knew it wasn't a manufacturer's association, but couldn't remember which one, that's why I put the ? after the name.
