Artifact
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Feeling anti-tactical
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#buttholetorn
No kidding. Just from one training class, I realized a few things on my battle belt didn't work and hindered me on the range. I then promptly rectified those issues.
Not sure how I would have noticed any of my gears flaws if I kept them in my drawer until needing to use them.
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dcmdon
NES Member
I'll start by saying I haven't read all 154 posts. So I don't know if this thread has come off the rails and will therefore just respond to the OP.
I don't operate operationally. I'm not a tactically tactical operator.
I'm a dad and an IT guy who likes guns and likes to maintain and expand my proficiency in several different shooting domains.
I carry Glocks, pretty much every day because I know they work. Even if they aren't as "Tactical" as HKs. Its funny but other than the 1911, the Glock is about as old school as it gets. I mean, I got my first one in 1990. TWENTY FIVE years ago.
I despise the term CCW. Simply because it serves no purpose. Carry gun is fewer syllables and is much clearer language. But CCW sounds more tactical. Especially if you turn it into a verb. "I was CCWing". I haven't figured out why you can't just say "I was carrying". Apparently its not tactical enough.
I propose anyone who uses the terms CCW or EDC as a verb (I was EDCing) should have to pay $100 to Comm2A. And if they use the term CCW or EDC as a noun, they need to pay Comm2A $50.
Jargon for jargon's sake is tactical. But its stupid.
I'm also afraid the term Tactical has joined the terms "marine" and "aviation quality" (which means nothing) as ways to simply charge more for the same item.
As far as training, it IS fun to take a carbine class, where you get to run your rifle empty, and then go for your backup handgun. But lets face it. Its nearly useless for most of us. (If you hear a bump in the night, do you put your AR on with a sling and then grab your OWB holster and gun). But it sure is fun. Even still, I've found that with a little effort you can find instructors who are honest to god tough guys. Not some full sleave tatted up poseur douch3 like Cori from Cori and Erica Youtube fame. (He'd have 12 followers if his wife's ass wasn't so spectacular).
I've had great luck wit classes from Sig (NH), Academi (CT and NC), and Weaponcraft (ME). In all cases the instructors has significant resumes with military and LE backgrounds that included work as instructors.
So no. I'll never be a tactical operator, and I never will be. I'm ok with that.
Don
p.s. I had dinner with a cop friend of mine last night. He just got back from an advanced Glock armorers class. He was astonished by two guys at the class who arrived in camo shorts and T shirts with punisher/reaper type logos on them. They sported full sleeves of tats and wore the mandatory hat with something tactical written on them and a set of Oakleys resting on the brim.
My friend is 47. He said these guys were probably late 20s and commented that his chief would never let him go to any event representing the dept without long sleeves if he looked like that. My friend is a good cop. He became a cop to provide for his family after working as a CO. He sincerely enjoys helping people. He lives in the neighborhood he patrols. As a CO, he knows how to bang heads if he has to. But thats not his MO. We talked about how this new group of "Tactical Operator" LEO coming from the military, which is clearly where these guys came from) may not have such noble goals.
dcmdon
NES Member
Which is almost as stupid as LEOs refering to citizens as civilians.
dcmdon
NES Member
Ask anyone whose ever been in combat how much they duckwalked/grouchowalked. Unfortunately after 15 years of war most of us know someone.
All of them will tell you that moving while delivering accurate fire ended with first contact with the enemy. Its either shoot, then RUN, or RUN while firing blindly for suppressive purposes. The key here is that youneed to move as fast as possible.
dcmdon
NES Member
Last year I picked up 4 pairs of Wrangler hiking shorts at Walmart for $13 ea. They are 90% as good as the one pair of 5-11 shorts I won in a raffle.
Also, since they are hiking and not cargo shorts, they are a bit shorter (I'm short and can't stand shorts that hand at my knee, they aren't really shorts) and a bit trimmer, but still with pockets on the thighs.
They've also got a discreet elastic waistband. So that I didn't need to buy them oversized to carry an IWB holster. My only regret is that I didn't buy 20 pairs to last me the next 10 years.
Don
Artifact
NES Member
Spot on on. Urban warfare though does require a little more tactical walks.
Cloverleaf Firearms Group
Instructor
As does moving through a house... but I suspect you would include that in urban warfare. Scanning is also never a bad thing when things are tight and chaotic... but it's the idea of 'looking without seeing' that I think people take issue with.
Ya I like some efficient defense gear, but even being young and following all the channels that spew this crap, I'm not into it. Sure I run around at the range and do my scans after a drill, but like a human looks around, not the spazzy way some of the tacticool instructors teach it.
What gets me is when dudes snap their AR left then right when they run dry. They all say they're visually inspecting the chamber. I say BS. Their mag is on the ground and the new one is half way in before their brain has time to process what they might have seen. There's probably a quadruple feed and they just dumped a 3/4 full mag on the ground, all to do that flashy high speed roll and load.
dcmdon
NES Member
Subieguy,
There is nothing wrong with following it. Out off all that Nut'n Fancy or Cori and Eirca drivel you occasionally find a Tibasaurus Rex. Who manages to be engaging and informative without all the macho chest thumping.
You also occasionally find some great gear. I discovered the Wilderness Outfitters (now called Wilderness Tactical - funny huh) instructor belt back in the late 90s at an IDPA match. Its "tactical" looking, but I wear it with an untucked shirt and its the best belt I own.
Don
p.s. The video of Erica shooting the Serbu .50 prone with her but wiggling after each shot is priceless though.
There is nothing wrong with following it. Out off all that Nut'n Fancy or Cori and Eirca drivel you occasionally find a Tibasaurus Rex. Who manages to be engaging and informative without all the macho chest thumping.
You also occasionally find some great gear. I discovered the Wilderness Outfitters (now called Wilderness Tactical - funny huh) instructor belt back in the late 90s at an IDPA match. Its "tactical" looking, but I wear it with an untucked shirt and its the best belt I own.
Don
p.s. The video of Erica shooting the Serbu .50 prone with her but wiggling after each shot is priceless though.
LOL definitely familiar with that video.
Ya I actually put a lot of stock in a number of the channels that talk about this stuff. Corey is my definition of tactical for looks and tactical sake, as opposed to any purpose. Not saying I'd care to get into a gunfight with him, but he looks ridiculous doing his tacticool moves.
George D
NES Member
A Garand should cure what ails ya...
At the Hora Dolor everyone had AR's at the rifle stage, "pop pop pop, pop pop pop" and then we started drilling the plate with the Garand "BOOM BOOM BOOM", everyone was like, "WTF was that? and where is your scope?"
I hear ya. My club is starting 3 gun shoots soon. A guy asked me if i was going to participate. I told him i enjoy plate shoots trap and friendly competition but.....i spent the better part of three years of my life wearing tactical gear (lbv) in a combat theater laden with ammo slinging a rifle.....praying every day i would NOT have to use it to put holes in people so my idea of a good time is not spending hundreds of dollars on civy tac gear to "shoot move and communicate" on my sunday afternoons at the gun club.
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Isnt it hard being a 30-06 man in a 5.56 world?
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warwickben
bubba Kalashnikov
I think I'm gonna rock my psl (54r ak at the next one) if I can get enough mags lol .
ChevyGuy91
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Sorry I was busy working on the battleworn look on my Glock 19 this weekend, couldn't write back. Funny enough, I was working with some dudes that are not current military that are more operator then most of the .mil dudes I know.
Jesus, this thread is gayer then 2 dudes swapping aids.
SHOCKNAWE
NES Member
Im sure you do, and my post certainly wasnt directed at you or anyone here because I dont personally know anyone in this forum. Im sure some might have taken a teeny bit of offense, but either way you have to agree that the term "Operator" is gay if your not doing opsec in real life or working contractor security in a potential combat zone. I mean lets be real, I think its safe to say that alot of people out there think they are relative to that term because they shoot and gear up in a completely safe enviroment without ever having bullets zip by them in real time.
Just for the record, I used operator ironically.
So we are clear. My middle aged ass hasn't operated its way out of a humvee in 20 years and I have no illusion that I could keep pace with Snacks.
That being said I can still shoot and I have an affinity for gear. Eff all y'all for being jealous of my Spartan Worn LWRC REPR and neck beard!
I totally agree, I like shooting to relax and get away from things, I don't want to spend time around people running around and doing the groucho walk while reloading.
Sent from my C6522N using Tapatalk
Maybe I'm just so out of the loop I have become FUDD but what is the fun meter patch all about.
I read it as FUN has come to a full stop? Would not tacticool be fun?
I'm so confused...... guess I will never get pass a belt,nife and a kerchief.
I'm considering getting wood furniture for the PTR 91. I think it looks nice.
warwickben
bubba Kalashnikov
It's like a iron man and shooting competition mixed. I haven't done the hora dolor yet but I've done the other one, I'm not even gonna try to spell lol.
Don't have to go all tactical just need to carry your ammo some how.
SHOCKNAWE
NES Member
Again Im not reffering to anyone here so we dont need to make anything clear, especially with me. Im a part time gear queer myself and dont give a rats ass what anyones opinion of it is. If someone wants to buy a battleworn looking rifle or an old fashioned Winchester then good for them, I just dont see that as being as retarded as someone who thinks they are Specops because they can clear a room hitting cardboard figures and thinking everyone else is a cub scout.
DarthRevan
NES Member
I've played in one of those "Semi-pro" leagues. I sure as hell knew I'd never be better than that, but I was playing to stay in shape, not to win a contract.
Some kind of sadist to pay to get your ass kicked each week for "bragging rights", lol
I didn't say I wouldn't figure out the proper use of said equipment. Just said I wouldn't wear it to the range like a billy bad ass.
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You sir just defined tacticool.
The whole point to having the equipment is to train with it. Figure out what works and what does not. Filling a drawer with a pile of crap that probably doesn't work and then relying on it in the worst possible situation is lunacy.
You don't need to spend a ton of money on equipment. In fact, much of the best equipment is surplus stuff bc it was designed to be used not to look good. Who cares if it is old? The BDU's we were issued in college were Vietnam era and had huge wing collars from the 70's. We looked like we walked right off the set of "Tour of Duty" but they held up fine. When we did ECW training they gave us 20 year old "Mickey Mouse Boots" that were actually inflatable with a pump.
They were ridiculously big but warmer than anything I've ever worn.
Point is that some of the old surplus stuff is cheap and actually works pretty well.
Can I really be the definition of tacticool when I don't own a single piece of equipment?
Where else would you put time and practice into using your said equipment? In your living room? I have no qualms in saying I've worn my gear to my range before and why not if it's the only place I have available to me to practice using it?
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Then go for it. I never said you guys cant do it. I said Its not for me and I don't see a need for it.
Thats fine by me. But I am kind of curious to find out where does billy bad ass fit in there though? That kind of threw me for a loop.
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