Do you engage an active shooter?

Roland Deschain said:
Short answer for me: Yes.

I can't run around making the argument that a good guy with a gun stops a bad guy with a gun, without planning on some level to approach it just like that if something bad happened. On or off duty. I can make up 100 scenarios where I probably wouldn't do anything because of how the incident was unfolding, but my default answer is 'try to stop the killing'. Then after that, try to stop the dying.
Click to expand...

You're the only one to address the elephant in the room. We all talk about good guys with guns and soft targets but the vast majority of the good guys appear to be headed to the exits at the first sign of trouble. Bra-freakin-vo, gents. Let those ladies and their children fend for themselves, so long as you and your's are safe. I'm no hero but if I'm carrying and can position myself to end and or distract a threat, then I'm doing it. Sometimes, even minimal returned fire is enough to induce suicide or scare an attacker. They expect to be doing the shooting, not getting shot at. Situational awareness is of course key and being reckless does no one any good. Also, I'd venture to say that the 30 second response time in Dayton is the exception, not the rule.
 
Tinkermatic said:
Sometimes, even minimal returned fire is enough to induce suicide or scare an attacker. They expect to be doing the shooting, not getting shot at.
Click to expand...

Yep. Make 'em suck their muzzle...
 
Tinkermatic said:
You're the only one to address the elephant in the room. We all talk about good guys with guns and soft targets but the vast majority of the good guys appear to be headed to the exits at the first sign of trouble. Bra-freakin-vo, gents. Let those ladies and their children fend for themselves, so long as you and your's are safe. .
Click to expand...

So, i am supposed to feel sorry for the same people who are actively trying to take my guns away, invalidate the 2nd amendment, take away my high capacity magazines so i might have a chance against an active shooter???

Here in MA, we would be five to one more likely to have the people you saved want YOU to be arrested for taking "the law into your own hands".
 
Spanz said:
So, i am supposed to feel sorry for the same people who are actively trying to take my guns away, invalidate the 2nd amendment, take away my high capacity magazines so i might have a chance against an active shooter???
Click to expand...

The short answer is... Yes.
 
enbloc said:
The short answer is... Yes.
Click to expand...

Not a clear cut yes. You could argue both ways.
Lets say you shot some perp, then his family sues you for wrongful death, and some loony massachusetts jury awards them a 5 million dollar payout...at your expense?

a police officer would be somewhat indemnified from such a lawsuit....but you or I...we would be on our own
 
Tinkermatic said:
Also, I'd venture to say that the 30 second response time in Dayton is the exception, not the rule.
Click to expand...

lets look at reality too! Perp in Dayton had a 100 round drum magazine with a semiauto rifle. You are going to have have, what, at most a 13 round mag in a handgun?

Unless that drum jams, and you have a clean shot...it is probably not going to go well for you, despite your hopes of becoming Rambo for a day
 
Spanz said:
Not a clear cut yes. You could argue both ways.
Lets say you shot some perp, then his family sues you for wrongful death, and some loony massachusetts jury awards them a 5 million dollar payout...at your expense?

a police officer would be somewhat indemnified from such a lawsuit....but you or I...we would be on our own
Click to expand...

I refuse to put a dollar-value on life. While I don't like liberals and their thinking (and actions, for that matter) I would not want to see a single one of them killed in the way we have recently seen. Besides, if they are all dead, who will we argue with...?
 
Spanz said:
So, i am supposed to feel sorry for the same people who are actively trying to take my guns away, invalidate the 2nd amendment, take away my high capacity magazines so i might have a chance against an active shooter???

Here in MA, we would be five to one more likely to have the people you saved want YOU to be arrested for taking "the law into your own hands".
Click to expand...

I admit, it’s a tough pill to swallow and one I’d be happy to never encounter in my lifetime. However, I’m not about to interview the intended victims (myself included in the aforementioned scenario) to determine wether or not they’re worthy of sticking my neck out for. No one gets off this rock alive. To put it probably altogether too bluntly, you’re either a statistic or you die trying.
 
The only way I, with a little CC handgun, am going to engage somebody with a long gun is via ambush so that I can pop him at close range. Whether I would try to set that up or not, I don't know. A man's got to know his limitations. However, I am a really slow runner and a relatively big target. If I don't try to run away, it may not have anything to do with courage.
 
i agree, if you can get the drop on the guy, get an honest three or so shots off before he knew what hit him...then that is a definitely different story. the odds are more in your favor, and there is also a risk of trying to run away out the back door of him seeing and shooting you, or an accomplice waiting at the back door for you unseen.
 
Spanz said:
i agree, if you can get the drop on the guy, get an honest three or so shots off before he knew what hit him...then that is a definitely different story. the odds are more in your favor, and there is also a risk of trying to run away out the back door of him seeing and shooting you, or an accomplice waiting at the back door for you unseen.
Click to expand...

One must beat the Kobayashi Maru...
 
swatgig said:
Here's my problem: I hear shooting and the ensuing screaming. I duck for cover, then I see the perp right in front of me shooting. I take him out only to find that I just killed the good guy with the gun who was shooting at the real perp.
Click to expand...

No one said this would be ...easy.
 
There is an excellent class at Mass Firearms in Holliston called "Judgmental Tactics". It is taught by Robert MacQuarrie (SWAT) from the Franklin Police Department. He advised students caught in an active shooter situation to keep a concealed handgun concealed (unless/until it is absolutely necessary to draw), because based on what he has seen as a law enforcement instructor there is a good chance that anybody holding a gun who isn't a cop is going to get shot by responding officers.

Link to class:

Judgmental Tactics | Firearms School near South Shore

The class uses shoot/no shoot video simulation and a laser-pistol, so you have to process information and make decisions in real time. The scenarios include muggings, kidnappings, carjackings, various robberies as both victim and as eyewitness, witness to deadly assaults. The experience is a real eye-opener for most people--it certainly was for me. Mass Firearms discounts the class 50% on their Black Friday sales. Well worth the effort to attend.
 
Last edited:
Depends. My priorities are mine, then me, then others. I'm not an LEO with a sworn duty, but I like to think that if engaging protects others, at minimal risk to me, and none to my family, then I'd do so.

Then again; "Paging Jose. Topic call for Jose." [grin]
 
With my family, I'm getting them out do or die (that's my primary job as Dad). If I'm alone I don't know. If there were kids there it would be hard not to do something even if not armed. I don't think I could live with myself.

Don't really know unless it happens.
 
Last edited:
There is no right answer to this and there should be no argument. Its a personal decision. That decision also can go a full 180 from state to state as well as to what I would do. Because what would make you a hero in one state, could make you a jailbird, or media outcast, in another for doing the same action. Its retarded.

1) With today's anti gun society, the villification, lawsuit, media circus, etc, you are not a coward if you beat feet outta there. Or would just use your CC to protect yourself/family only on the way out if it came to it.

2) Nor are you wrong to engage and try to stop it realizing your actions could have negative consequences for the rest of your life, but you don't give a flying fxck because saving somebody is worth it.

In a perfect world there would be no situation #1, or no negative for situation#2, but politicians and the media, enable and create fear, anguish, probable loss of rights, and possible incarceration for self help/helping others in the majority of liberal states, therefore it's not your fault, its society's fault. I'll not feel a twinge of guilt because of what was created by these a**h***s, not one second. I know the difference between right and wrong, what should happen and what shouldn't, but in today's world, all that is in cloud of media shxtstorm dust, and foggy laws that you are leaving to chance your whole life on.

We all know having a CC and trying to defend against a bonafide active shooter to try and save lives, should be covered under that good faith samaratin law, no matter what the outcome, and no matter if a mistake is made in the heat of the moment. It isn't, so therefore, its as much of a personal decision as any other life altering circumstance should be.

Police and first responders are for the most part are highly insulated from stupidity and if in a vehemently anti gun state......running away and letting the police do what we taxpayers pay them to do is nothing to feel guilty about, even though in most cases....they are late to the party.
 
Last edited:
Warm_Garand said:
There is an excellent class at Mass Firearms in Holliston called "Judgmental Tactics". It is taught by Robert MacQuarrie (SWAT) from the Franklin Police Department. He advised students caught in an active shooter situation to keep a concealed handgun concealed (unless/until it is absolutely necessary to draw), because based on what he has seen as a law enforcement instructor there is a good chance that anybody holding a gun who isn't a cop is going to get shot by responding officers.

Link to class:

Judgmental Tactics | Firearms School near South Shore

The class uses shoot/no shoot video simulation and a laser-pistol, so you have to process information and make decisions in real time. The scenarios include muggings, kidnappings, carjackings, various robberies as both victim and as eyewitness, witness to deadly assaults. The experience is a real eye-opener for most people--it certainly was for me. Mass Firearms discounts the class 50% on their Black Friday sales. Well worth the effort to attend.
Click to expand...

So the next evolution by would be mass shooters will be to half ass dress up in some type of blue uniform( fake badge and all) that 99.99+ % of the public under the duress and chaos of the situation wouldn't be able to tell the difference, and they would gain time to conduct their shooting spree because most people ( even cops) wouldn't draw down on someone they thought was a uniformed cop.

Proximity and a direct close up view of the initial shots fired by the shooter and reliable opportunity to intervene are going to be the determining factors that will stop a shooter. If you don't have those three things minimum, you will be hanging your ass in the breeze for either future criminal prosecution or civil suit........or worse.....being shot by a late responding cop who doesnt know shit about the situation at hand other than hearing gun shots.
 
I will engage the active shooter if they are between me, my wife and the exit. my responsibility is to my family and does not extend to others, they have the same right as i do to protect their loved ones. In an active shooter situation we will take cover, find the exit and get the f*** out. Then we go get a stiff drink.
 
Last edited:
v37v said:
Just to stir the pot...
Click to expand...
v37v said:
Burning building,child hanging out of window,what do you do?
Click to expand...
What floor is the child on? Can the child talk, old enough to follow commands? Are there others to help?
A wet towel will turn water to dangerous steam right quick. I would do everything I could. I can not imagine burning to death.

v37v said:
Young woman caught in an apparent riptide,what do you do?
Click to expand...
Again, communication is key. Direct someone to call 911. Salt water in the lungs is dangerous and warrants a drs care.
DO NOT go in the water. Voice or visual commands try to get the swimmer to swim parallel to the shore. Enter the water when there is help or proper equipment.

v37v said:
Elderly man being mauled by a large dog,what do you do?
Click to expand...
This one is different. Something with a thought process is attacking. I would do anything and everything I could.

Matt
 
situation dictates. is the shooter armed w/a pistol or rifle? If I'm alone and the shooter is randomly shooting people I would use cover and concealment to try to move into position for a shot. If not try to pin him down until the Cavalry arrives to stop the shooting. I only have 20rds so I must conserve ammo.
 
fencer said:
My first thought was " Nah.. Imma grab the biggest wide screen in da sto. Use dat chit for cover and git my white trash ass outta there"

Then I thought, no, I have that Roland kids cell number.. I am gonna call his ass. " Hey Clover kid... it's fencer.. I am at the Walmart and some dude with a mini gun is tearing the place up! Come quick! No, I am not at the ammo case... I am at the plus sized lingerie..don't judge me. It's purely a comfort thing"
And then Stu comes tactical rolling into view.. and pew pew. Double taps the angry shooter in the forehead.

Truth is, I really would have a hard time watching innocent people get shot. And although I tell myself I wouldn't, have posted that I wouldn't and you shouldn't, I just would hate looking at myself in the mirror everyday if had to live with knowing I could have prevented a death.
As Dr. Grant says, it all depends on the circumstances.
There is a huge difference between running towards the sound of gunfire, and watching people getting shot right in front of you. And admittedly, I am sure all of us have some split second ranking system they would apply. Mother with three kids? Engage. Fat kid with a man bun and a Bernie Tshirt? [thinking]

I think that all of us are smart enough to know we probably shouldn't, but even those that have posted " Nope, no way. Ain't happening", would have a hard time watching the local high school girls softball team be killed.
Let's hope none of us ever finds out what we would do.
Click to expand...

I'm fairly sure you'd be ALL SET. Funny story though... I'm in active shooter training, and we did that EXACT scenario. Lol
 
With all the tax money I pay, I should have free access to Active Shooter Training w/ certification from the Commonwealth...
 

Similar threads

SWAT team responding to Arkansas shopping mall, police ask public to avoid the area: Officials called it “an incident that is active"
Replies
5
Views
231
TJ4
T
What not to do with your new gun.
2
Replies
42
Views
1K
Coyote33
Coyote33
Things you didn't know you needed
Replies
14
Views
495
greencobra
greencobra
Do I need to get an AK now? Yes, yes I do! But…
6 7 8
Replies
213
Views
5K
Yotacrawler
Yotacrawler
what do you all think about plastering your vehicle with pro-gun stickers?
2 3 4
Replies
109
Views
2K
Sterg
Sterg
Back
Top Bottom