Boston PD Renewals -- range test?

[M1911]

Folks:

A woman I know has moved into Boston. She has an unrestricted LTC from her previous town but now has to renew in Boston. I know that Boston requires new applicants to do the range test at Moon Island. Do they also require applicants who are renewing to do the range test?

 

[blindndead]

Folks:

A woman I know has moved into Boston. She has an unrestricted LTC from her previous town but now has to renew in Boston. I know that Boston requires new applicants to do the range test at Moon Island. Do they also require applicants who are renewing to do the range test?

What the hell is the Moon Island test???

 

[Scrivener]

Yes, they do. Every single time you renew there you have to start all over. This means that she will have to fill out all the paperwork, bring all the documentation they require and take the moon island test.

Eminently debatable. As the Brookline District Court has found the "range test" an unlawful requirement in the face of the safety certification statute and its implementing regulation, a refusal to take that asinine test would likely succeed.

Note also that a similar abuse, "recertification," has also been challenged in court. A decision is pending.

This is how things are done in Boston. It's corrupt to the core and gun owners are treated like dirt. She would be well advised to move out of there before her LTC expires.

Got THAT right - for so many reasons.

 

[Palladin]

My father was BPD, instructed at Moon Island for his first 5 & last 10 yrs on the job..retired in 1990. On the fun side, I got to try out the new Glock when BPD first went to them !

After he retired he'd still go to see his buddys there, but told me of instances where the new instructors would hand a LTC testee a loaded firearm, if they accepted it they failed the test. They had to ask the instructor to open the weapon, make sure it was unloaded before accepting it. They were getting serious pressure to fail LTC testees. All the good guys have retired.

 

[Scrivener]

The "test" requires applicants to fire a beat-up, old revolver (probably a Model 10), single-handed.

1. A Mod. 10 is hardly the Weapon of Choice for concealed carry, which is what anyone going for an LTC/A is likely to want;

2. The one-handed crap goes back to Civil War cavalry tactics, if not before. The other hand holds your horse's bridle.

3. Many people prefer semi-autos, thus making the mandated use of a revolver wholly inappropriate; and

4. The requirement of a full-size revolver shot double-action, single-handed is likely (and quite possibly intended) to prevent women, Asians, Latinos and the elderly or otherwise arthritic from passing.

To put the Boston (and Brookline and Newton) BS in perspective, compare it to the RI test.

 

[M1911]

Last I heard, the test used a Ruger revolver (Security Six?). They are said to be worn, but accurate and have a good trigger.

The test itself is described here in detail:

http://www.northeastshooters.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=1069

 

[Lugnut]

To put the Boston (and Brookline and Newton) BS in perspective, compare it to the RI test.

OK... so I'm lazy tonight and you put out out the bait. What does RI require?

 

[M1911]

25 yards, 3 strings of 10 rounds, 10 minutes per string, at the Army L target (which is huge). You can shoot it any way you want (one-handed or two). The caliber that you qualify with is the largest caliber you can carry. And you use your own gun and do the range test with any NRA certified instructor.

In summary, the RI test is much easier.

 

[Scrivener]

25 yards, 3 strings of 10 rounds, 10 minutes per string, at the Army L target (which is huge). You can shoot it any way you want (one-handed or two). The caliber that you qualify with is the largest caliber you can carry. And you use your own gun and do the range test with any NRA certified instructor.

In summary, the RI test is much easier.

FAR more importantly, the RI test is a far more fair and accurate assessment of what a given applicant will actually achieve with the gun he/she will actually carry.

 

[Lugnut]

25 yards, 3 strings of 10 rounds, 10 minutes per string, at the Army L target (which is huge). You can shoot it any way you want (one-handed or two). The caliber that you qualify with is the largest caliber you can carry. And you use your own gun and do the range test with any NRA certified instructor.

In summary, the RI test is much easier.

It's all kind of funny when you think about the absurdity of these requirements- especially for CCW... which wouldn't require anything near a 25 yd shot for any defensive situation I can think of.

 

[M1911]

FAR more importantly, the RI test is a far more fair and accurate assessment of what a given applicant will actually achieve with the gun he/she will actually carry.

Agreed. Of course, that, and $3.50 will get you latte.

It's all kind of funny when you think about the absurdity of these requirements- especially for CCW... which wouldn't require anything near a 25 yd shot for any defensive situation I can think of.

While a 25 yard shot is unlikely, I don't think it is impossible. Is it a reasonable test of the kind of marksmanship required for a defensive encounter -- 1 shot per minute at 25 yards certainly is not the kind of test I would design. Unfortunately, the RI AG isn't likely to listen to my opinion.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

...a refusal to take that asinine test would likely succeed.

At $250 per hour

 

[Scrivener]

At $250 per hour

For YOU - $225!

 

[dwarven1]

Not a real smart move on their part since I'm a productive person and I added value to their city and to the state in general. But they simply don't care and that was that.

See, that was your problem, Jim - you weren't adding to the welfare rolls! (in more ways than one! )

 

[vellnueve]

It's a Ruger Speed Six (?).

Test is easy. Frankly, the fact that they're giving me a gun and free ammo to shoot at a target in a laughably easy range test doesn't bother me all that much except it means I have to wait a few more days.

 

[M1911]

It is easy for you. I suspect it would be easy for me as well.

But it is not easy for many. I think many people are easily intimidated by the officers. For some of the older women I have taught, they would have a have a hard time holding a revolver at arms length with one hand and shooting accurately in double action.

In addition, I think the grip of the gun is probably too large for Mrs. M1911 (who has very small hands) to comfortably shoot in double action.

 

[Scrivener]

It's a Ruger Speed Six (?).

Test is easy. Frankly, the fact that they're giving me a gun and free ammo to shoot at a target in a laughably easy range test doesn't bother me all that much except it means I have to wait a few more days.

Your ready compliance with an abuse of authority speaks volumes.

 

[kevin9]

Your ready compliance with an abuse of authority speaks volumes.

+1
Testing to gain access to a right is illogical, regardless of the ease of the test.

 

[dwarven1]

Your ready compliance with an abuse of authority speaks volumes.

Sort of like the other MA gun owners who keep inventing new "laws".

 

[vellnueve]

Also, for the record, when I took the test, the officers involved said they didn't care whether we fired DA or SA even with the one hand hold.

 

[Scrivener]

Also, for the record, when I took the test, the officers involved said they didn't care whether we fired DA or SA even with the one hand hold.

Oh, well; that makes all the difference........

 

[GSG]

Every time I go to Boston, I carry some kind of a gun, and when I can conceal it I make it a full sized Glock with an extra (pre-ban) mag or two.

They're crazy in that city.

 

[vellnueve]

Well, Scrivener, if you would like to challenge that in court, please go right ahead. I have neither the time nor the money nor the willingness to be declared unsuitable by challenging the PD on that, nor do I intend to stay long enough to need to renew in Boston (graduate in 2011 and plan to clear out of this city by then, if not sooner)

But, if you don't want to, then please stop your shameless attempts to create new clients.

 

[dwarven1]

Oh, please, Scrivener... Allow me!

What you tolerate, you validate;
What you put up with - YOU DESERVE!

 

[kevin9]

And a test is still a test no matter how easy.

 

[vellnueve]

Easy for you guys to say living in relatively friendly towns.

 

[dwarven1]

I never knew that it was possible to hire a lawyer to help apply for your LTC, or I'd have done so when I lived in Hudson. Just gotta want it bad enough.

 

[vellnueve]

Again, easy for you to say when you have more money and a stable job. I'm a grad student living on a relatively small monthly military stipend along with a small amount of money from working weekends. Already have to sacrifice a bit in other areas to pursue my M1 carbine interests, certainly not enough to hire a lawyer.

Not everyone is fortunate enough to have the stable job and ability to move around to find the ideal LTC-A ALP town or hire a lawyer to fight for them. I'm sick and f***ing tired of people like Scrivener, you, and Jim who sit in the comfort of friendly towns and continually ridicule those who don't have that flexibility at thi time.

Maybe in a few years, if, God forbid, I'm still stuck in this Godforsaken city and start pulling insix figures, then I'll try the above. But for me, and many others, it is simply not practical to fight it or move.

 

[Scrivener]

Well, Scrivener, if you would like to challenge that in court, please go right ahead.

I have. As those actually following gun law in this state on this forum know.

I have neither the time nor the money nor the willingness to be declared unsuitable by challenging the PD on that, nor do I intend to stay long enough to need to renew in Boston (graduate in 2011 and plan to clear out of this city by then, if not sooner)

Not to mention certain other deficiencies...

But, if you don't want to, then please stop your shameless attempts to create new clients.

I don't need "to create new clients," this state's gun laws do that for me.

You, however, may need to "create" some apparently missing appendages.

 

[Len-2A Training]

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