Worcester buy back program

EddieCoyle said:
Let me see if I can convince you that those types of ideas are bad...

I think we can all agree that these buybacks do nothing to make the streets safer. Their main purpose is to make it look like there is a 'gun problem', and to make it look like the police and concerned entities are doing something about it.

Let me repeat part of that: One of the main purposes of these buybacks is to make it appear to the sheep that there is, in fact a 'gun problem'. Do you know how they do that?

Here's how: By taking in a lot of guns.

Picture this... You sell 'back' a rusty worthless non-functioning single shot shotgun that hasn't been fired since the Nixon administration. On the way out with your Wegmans card, you tell a reporter that you're going to buy ammo with it. At Wegmans.

Later on, during the news story they show the Worcester chief of police holding up your shotgun and saying, "This weapon can cut a child in half with one shot and we took it off the street today."

Then they show you saying that you're going to buy ammo with the card you got. At Wegmans.

Have you helped? Are you glad your gun is off the street? Because you let them be able to say that.

Do you still think it's a good idea for us to line up and turn in 100s of guns?
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I was pretty neutral on this topic when I started reading the thread. I was turned before I got to this post but its the most complete and simple explanation of why buybacks are a problem.

I think we have to keep in mind that because the media, in general, is anti gun they are quite adept at spinning the stats of a gun buyback anyway they can. As a result, the only way to combat the message is to do anything we can to decrease the number of guns that come in. Has a news story EVER commented on how many of the guns taken in were non functioning, black powder, or BB guns? Have they ever mentioned that most come from scared old ladies that didn't realize they had them in their attic? Have they ever talked about the number of participants that clearly scrounged up a useless gun so they could get a food card? I'll help you, the answer is no. All you hear is how many guns they took in and lines about "killing machines" and "assault rifles" with menacing shots of a table full of guns.

To those that offer a rush on a buyback might bankrupt them I would ask what you think the headline would be the next day. It would not be about how they can't have another buyback because the money is gone.
 
edmorseiii said:
I don't understand why this is so hard to understand for some people.
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a few reasons:

1. Being financially thrifty: person values money, so "screwing" the bad guys on a raw end of a deal means great amounts of good things to a financially responsible individual. Also, people like good deals and this causes moral confusion if the individual is hardcore about financial responsibility. Rust junk for $20??? It blinds them from the other consequences.

2. Having partaken in a previous gun "buy back:" eating crow and processing that yes, you contradicted your own beliefs - beliefs that you feel so strongly about that you even preach them- with your own actions is a devil of a thing to deal with.

3. Ignorance: I was this before reading this thread. I never have, or wanted to support a gun buy back- but I never blamed those who sold rust junk for low coin. Now I am informed, though. And would never support such a thing or those who partake in them.
 
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Very good info. As a noob, I never think deeper about these buyback programs. This thread make me realized a lot of misguided thinking or info.
 
you all have your beliefs i have mine. id do it again tomorrow if i had the chance. you don't like it too f'n bad its my choice to do what i want with my firearms. my choice my right!!! its ok if someone says im not American or their enemy i wasn't looking for a pat on the back or a new friend. i have a safe full of functioning firearms and don't care what anyone thinks about the junk i got rid of. if people here have such a hard on about buy backs pull money out of your own wallets and start your own and put a twist on it your way. just don't start jumping around like a complete psychos talking about people out to get you and your guns its silly.
 
To begin, I would lke to quote myself from the first page of this thread
In God We Trust said:
All the guy did was sell some rifles. Who cares who the buyer is? It's not like he had them confiscated.
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Having never given this subject much thought, that was my take on it. After giving it some thought and reading the posts, yeah I guess it is all about politics, smoke and mirrors. I have never participated in one and I give my word here and now that I never will. Thanks for the articulate posts on the issue.
 
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Finalygotabeltfed said:
You suck and you're a F'ing traitor if you support or participate in government gun buy programs.

You are not at all part of the "gun culture" and you are furthuring the agenda of very same people who will eventually kill you to take your guns. If you support or participate in any government gun buy program, you are not my ally nor my fellow American, you are my enemy and I wish all the ill will this world can muster against you.
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Little anger managment needed I think bud!.....[dance] Chill have a beer go to the range and shot a few hundred rounds.....[mg]
 
QUOTE=richc;2146103]Finalygotabeltfed was one of the first guys I met at the gun club. He's as stand-up a guy as you'll meet.

He took the time to educate my son and I on firearms usage. He is very knowledgeable about firearms. He's smart and articulate, and he's passionate. He cares deeply.

And Atilla is absolutely right, Finalygotabeltfed is the guy you'd want on your side, or having your back, anyplace, anytime.

And IMHO he is absolutely right in this argument.[/QUOTE]



Blah, Blah, Blah!!!




[offtopic]
 
I definitely learned a lot from reading this thread. As a result, I will never support any .gov 'gun buy' programs.
 
dmdivris said:
I junked 4 crappppy rusty boat anchors of rifles and walked out with gift cards, the only problem its to a over hyped market for people that drive hybrids and like to pay more for food. No deals there and you have to fight to get down isles.
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Finalygotabeltfed said:
You suck and you're a F'ing traitor if you support or participate in government gun buy programs.

You are not at all part of the "gun culture" and you are furthuring the agenda of very same people who will eventually kill you to take your guns. If you support or participate in any government gun buy program, you are not my ally nor my fellow American, you are my enemy and I wish all the ill will this world can muster against you.
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chinalfr said:
Very good info. As a noob, I never think deeper about these buyback programs. This thread make me realized a lot of misguided thinking or info.
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The above quote validates this whole thread and illustrates the value of this forum

dmdivris said:
you all have your beliefs i have mine. id do it again tomorrow if i had the chance. you don't like it too f'n bad its my choice to do what i want with my firearms. my choice my right!!! its ok if someone says im not American or their enemy i wasn't looking for a pat on the back or a new friend. i have a safe full of functioning firearms and don't care what anyone thinks about the junk i got rid of. if people here have such a hard on about buy backs pull money out of your own wallets and start your own and put a twist on it your way. just don't start jumping around like a complete psychos talking about people out to get you and your guns its silly.
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dmdivris, I know that the responses you got probably surprised you and it is human nature to respond with aggression when met with aggression. Try to look past that at the big picture. Please re-read the posts from Eddie Coyle and really give it some thought. He really did a good job of explaining why buy backs are not good for the gun community

Try to take this as constructive critisism. Believe it or not, there really are people out there that are out to get you and your guns, especially in Mass. The members of this forum share your love of freedom and obviously, firearms. And although you kinda took a beating that you did not see coming, the information that we all got from your experience and this thread, is invaluable
 
Sometimes the message can be right on, and the delivery can piss you off.

Whenever I find myself agreeing with Belt Fed, he then goes a step further than I am willing to go.

Oh well, that's life. On the internet. In a gun forum. Where all of us are experts. *S*
 
i originally posted on this thread because i wished i had known about the buyback for an old rusty i'd like to dispose of and figured i'd make a buck off it. after reading many of these well written reasonable posts, i too will not support one of these gun buys.
i would only do it if i could make beltfed watch me to see the look of a man "wishing all the ill will this world can muster against me" because i am no longer his countryman in his eyes! hahahaha... relax man, there are way better things to hate on... merry christmas brother
 
chinalfr said:
Very good info. As a noob, I never think deeper about these buyback programs. This thread make me realized a lot of misguided thinking or info.
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Seconded. I've never given these a second though other than how people selling for such a cheap price are getting screwed, and that it was highly unethical.
 
dmdivris said:
you all have your beliefs i have mine. id do it again tomorrow if i had the chance. you don't like it too f'n bad its my choice to do what i want with my firearms. my choice my right!!! its ok if someone says im not American or their enemy i wasn't looking for a pat on the back or a new friend. i have a safe full of functioning firearms and don't care what anyone thinks about the junk i got rid of. if people here have such a hard on about buy backs pull money out of your own wallets and start your own and put a twist on it your way. just don't start jumping around like a complete psychos talking about people out to get you and your guns its silly.
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Silly? Its not so silly when you've been around for 50+ years watching the step by step progression. Their is unquestionably an agenda within Massachusetts to "get your guns". Go compare some volumes of law books from the 60's to some volumes from this or last year and tell me again how silly it is.

Once again, its the perception that those pushing their agenda are doing something useful and beneficial when in fact they are doing nothing but further erroding the rights of citizens under a false guise.
 
dmdivris said:
you all have your beliefs i have mine. id do it again tomorrow if i had the chance. you don't like it too f'n bad its my choice to do what i want with my firearms. my choice my right!!! its ok if someone says im not American or their enemy i wasn't looking for a pat on the back or a new friend. i have a safe full of functioning firearms and don't care what anyone thinks about the junk i got rid of. if people here have such a hard on about buy backs pull money out of your own wallets and start your own and put a twist on it your way. just don't start jumping around like a complete psychos talking about people out to get you and your guns its silly.
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I know of someone on this board right now that has had their right to own a firearm suspended (forever using their interpretation) based on the state's incorrect assessment of an incident that happened over two decades ago.

This person has spent thousands of dollars defending their right to keep and bear arms based on the whim of an administrator who has not interpreted a judgment statement that was available when this permit was suspended after having it for over 10 years (and being mentioned every time he went to renew the permit).

It is a mentality in my opinion that people with an anti-gun agenda in positions that allow them to take gun rights away are emboldened when they see or hear instances of gun buybacks where people approve of the actions of "getting guns off of the street".

I haven't seen any mention in this thread that ALL of us can loose our gun rights with the INTERPRETATION of one person.

I don't know how other people interpret that, but I call it tyranny.
 
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Timber said:
The Constitution and Bill of Rights weren't established to "give" me rights. They were written to make sure those who tried to steal those rights later on hds some sort of legal document enumerating them to have thrown in their faces if they were civil enough to end up in a court of law after the fact.

I don't lose my rights. To anyone, anywhere. Ever.
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I agree completely, but we currently live in a state where some of its citizens condone and approve of taking our RIGHTS away. There should be no gun permits it is a right not a privilege to own a weapon.

When non-firearms owners see gun owners turning in weapons they might get the impression that the silent majority of gun owners approve of getting guns off the street.

"Look, respectable citizen and businessman Mr Samuel Adams turned in a gun maybe all gun owners think like him". "One less gun is good, all guns gone is better" (This is an analogy on my part and what I believe).
 
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Finalygotabeltfed said:
Silly? Its not so silly when you've been around for 50+ years watching the step by step progression. Their is unquestionably an agenda within Massachusetts to "get your guns". Go compare some volumes of law books from the 60's to some volumes from this or last year and tell me again how silly it is.

Once again, its the perception that those pushing their agenda are doing something useful and beneficial when in fact they are doing nothing but further erroding the rights of citizens under a false guise.
Click to expand...

People need to read this several times and understand we're not pissed off about a little program. We're pissed off about a systematic long term erosion of your God given rights by tyrants.
 
ScottS said:
Unless you can show a direct link where a gun "buyback" has led to legislation, it's all just armchair speculation and posturing, which is another word for bullshit.
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You don't get it . Every little action against us is like the boiling of the frog . If it's done gradually the frog never knows it . If you'd open your eyes and take a deep breathe in you'd see and smell the BS for yourself .
 
Friday said:
Yes, very scary; but I thought painting horrible doom and gloom hypothetical scenarios was the exclusive domain of the liberals, who use such mechanisms to justify their cause.....
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You mean trying to anticipate the likely consequences of your actions? Put yourself inside the head of one of the 90% of people that don't own (or know anything about) guns and read your earlier post quoted below.

Friday said:
Sure, turn in 1000's.
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If a buyback program ever netted 1000 guns, it would be hailed by the anti-gun left as the biggest success in history. You would never hear the end of it. Far from making them stop, they'd have one every weekend. Everywhere.

The newspapers (you know, the ones that call two guns a 'cache' and four guns an 'arsenal') would pick this story up and run with it. No good could possibly come of it. There would be all kinds of stories in major newspapers around the world about the 'new found severity' of the 'gun problem'. The likely outcome would be a bunch of newly frightened Sally-Soccer-Moms screaming that 'something needs to be done' about the gun problem, and there is nothing the state loves more than scared sheep.


Friday said:
And be sure to get word out that the police/sponsors are morons
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Again, how? Through who? Do you really think the press would be sympathetic and pro-gun? For every one positive story on an obscure 2A blog, there would be 10 hurtful ones in major newspapers.


Friday said:
for giving away tax dollars
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Did you read the article? They gave a way gift cards donated by a private business so that they could look like a 'responsible merchant' and play up to their target audience (suburban soccer Moms). If by 'tax dollars' you mean the time the police spent on it, it's minimal. If you took a poll of the general population of Mass, most of them would say that this is a better use of the police's time because they're 'preventing' crime.


Friday said:
for perfectly useless firearms that are only slightly more dangeerous than a baseball bat
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Yup. You and I know that, but 90+% of the population of this state knows nothing about guns. They've been conditioned to think that any semi-auto is an 'assault rifle', anything with a scope is a 'sniper rifle', and handguns are only good for killing people. To them, every gun is dangerous, and they're scared to death of them.

Friday said:
It can be used both ways. I see only one possibility being repeately expressed as the only possibility.
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I've been pretty civil here and you felt the need to liken me to a liberal and accuse me of 'painting horrible doom and gloom hypothetical scenarios'.

Your post above reads like something written by a child-like Occupier living in a dream world that makes decisions based on emotion rather than logic, with no regard to the likely consequences of his actions.

I tell you what, if my scenario is unrealistically pessimistic, paint me one where 1000 guns get turned in and and things turn out well for gun owners. I mean in the real world. Seriously.

ETA: If this is just a case of you digging in your heels because you got caught on the bad side of an argument, then just stop before it gets worse. It's OK. It happens to all of us sometimes.
 
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In view of the well-documented societal benefits of gun ownership and participation in shooting sports--reduced crime, enhanced public safety, recreational enjoyment, competitive opportunities to mention a few--on an equal opportunity basis for women and men, ages youth through adults--we look forward to enlightened and civic-minded organizations like Wegman's announcing their new Gun Donation Program, which will find homes for guns with people who aren't yet involved with shooting and will facilitate their obtaining licenses and training.
 
Timber said:
FTR- I agree with Finalygotabeltfed's assessment.
I think it might have a lot to do with the terminology of such programs, though. "Buy back" suggests that they're paying me for something I got from them in the first place. As in suggesting that I can carry firearms only through the "by your leave" of the elected officials that view themselves as my betters.
I mean if some dude, group, whatever, came up and offered "Gift cards for Old, Crappy Guns," without a political agenda, then who cares? I traded a pistol for a bunch of wood working tools when I first bought my house. Right thing to do at the time. No agenda involved. If advertised in the paper, I might consider that kind of thing again given that I've got a bunch of junk I never touch hanging around.
Supporting or taking part in a "buy back" program has moral and political implications that simply aren't compatible with a free man's mindset.
So even if he was a little blunt, Finalygotabeltfed is correct.
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But, that's how Massachusetts does it NOW. These douchebags in office, Devil Patrick, Marsha, Olver, McGovern, Sonia Dirty-Sanchez, etc, think they are better than their peons, you and me.


davemata said:
Found this link interesting, consider the directions this thread has taken.
http://constitutionalistnc.tripod.com/hitler-leftist/id14.html
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Just replace "Jew" with "law-abiding citizen" and it becomes clear what states like Mass, Cali, NY, NJ, DC, Hawaii, Illinois, Maryland (....did I miss any?) are trying to do to us now.


davemata said:
Naw, that would make it into some well meaning LEO's safe, I'm sure.
There aren't third parties auditing the intake, so "loss" can occur.
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Remember, internal investigations are legitimate [puke2]
 
joeendris said:
But, that's how Massachusetts does it NOW. These douchebags in office, Devil Patrick, Marsha, Olver, McGovern, Sonia Dirty-Sanchez, etc, think they are better than their peons, you and me.
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Timber lives in NH. If this is really something that bothers you, make a plan to change it, or keep licking the boot on your throat and beg some more.
 

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