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What is "Surplus Good" condition

EddieCoyle

EddieCoyle

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I bought a FEG pistol (PPK clone) in .32 ACP from an online vendor that advertised the pistols as being in "Surplus Good" condition. When I got it, I was pretty disappointed.

I asked to send it back because I didn't think they were honest, and they came back and basically said, "F**K you".

What do you all think? Am I justified in being pissed off?

Here are some pics:

FEG4.jpg

FEG1.jpg

FEG2.jpg

FEG3.jpg


The bore is a sewer pipe, and that big dent on the crown pretty much guarantees that the bullets won't go where I point it.
 
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Unless it is supposed to be 'surplus good paperweight ' , I'd be pissed too. Crown, barrel, and feed ramp are FUBAR.

If ever a vendor deserved outing, it's this one.
 
I would not even put that at close to fair, never mind good.

NRA MODERN GUN CONDITION STANDARDS:

NEW: Not previously sold at retail, in same condition as current factory production.
PERFECT: In New condition in every respect. (Jim's note - in my experience, many collectors & dealers use "As New" to describe this condition).
EXCELLENT: New condition, used but little, no noticeable marring of wood or metal, bluing perfect, (except at muzzle or sharp edges).
VERY GOOD: In perfect working condition, no appreciable wear on working surfaces, no corrosion or pitting, only minor surface dents or scratches.
GOOD: In safe working condition, minor wear on working surfaces, no broken parts, no corrosion or pitting that will interfere with proper functioning.
FAIR: In safe working condition but well worn, perhaps requiring replacement of minor parts or adjustments which should be indicated in advertisement, no rust, but may have corrosion pits which do not render article unsafe or inoperable.
 
From NRA Museum website:

NRA MODERN GUN CONDITION STANDARDS:

  • NEW: Not previously sold at retail, in same condition as current factory production.
  • PERFECT: In New condition in every respect. (Jim's note - in my experience, many collectors & dealers use "As New" to describe this condition).
  • EXCELLENT: New condition, used but little, no noticeable marring of wood or metal, bluing perfect, (except at muzzle or sharp edges).
  • VERY GOOD: In perfect working condition, no appreciable wear on working surfaces, no corrosion or pitting, only minor surface dents or scratches.
  • GOOD: In safe working condition, minor wear on working surfaces, no broken parts, no corrosion or pitting that will interfere with proper functioning.
  • FAIR: In safe working condition but well worn, perhaps requiring replacement of minor parts or adjustments which should be indicated in advertisement, no rust, but may have corrosion pits which do not render article unsafe or inoperable.

NRA ANTIQUE FIREARM CONDITIONS STANDARDS:

  • FACTORY NEW: All original parts; 100% original finish; in perfect condition in every respect, inside and out.
  • EXCELLENT: All original parts; over 80% original finish; sharp lettering, numerals and design on metal and wood; unmarred wood; fine bore.
  • FINE: All original parts; over 30% original finish; sharp lettering, numerals and design on metal and wood; minor marks in wood; good bore.
  • VERY GOOD: All original parts; none to 30% original finish; original metal surfaces smooth with all edges sharp; clear lettering, numerals and design on metal; wood slightly scratched or bruised; bore disregarded for collectors firearms.
  • GOOD: Some minor replacement parts; metal smoothly rusted or lightly pitted in places, cleaned or re-blued; principal letters, numerals and design on metal legible; wood refinished, scratched bruised or minor cracks repaired; in good working order.
  • FAIR: Some major parts replaced; minor replacement parts may be required; metal rusted, may be lightly pitted all over, vigorously cleaned or re-blued; rounded edges of metal and wood; principal lettering, numerals and design on metal partly obliterated; wood scratched, bruised, cracked or repaired where broken; in fair working order or can be easily repaired and placed in working order.
  • POOR: Major and minor parts replaced; major replacement parts required and extensive restoration needed; metal deeply pitted; principal lettering, numerals and design obliterated, wood badly scratched, bruised, cracked or broken; mechanically inoperative; generally undesirable as a collector's firearm.

--

not sure if that would constitute modern or antique (probably modern) but i would say the condition is not acceptable. i agree you have a reason to be unhappy with it. was the purchase via gunbroker? did the seller have a rating? and if so what was it?
 
I don't see any type of good condition in those photos. You're justified in being pissed off.
 
Yeah, that is no kind of good.

I had bought a rifle once from one of these guys, and they raved about how this was 'the nicest batch of rifles they had ever seen'. I got it, and it was in pretty rough shape, but definitely shootable. I sent them some pics complaining about their over-promising the condition. They agreed and offered a refund, but I kept it because I knew that surplus rifles are a gamble.

The one in your case, though, deserves a refund.
 
That’s pretty lame. I’d be contacting the sales manager.

Just curious what made you purchase one of those in the first place? Not knocking FEG they make some decent surplus type guns but these in particular, the .380’s and .32’s are kinda junky in the first place. I had the .380 version years ago that would not run reliably with any ammo.
 
I’d be pissed as well. Looks like they threw it on the pavement a few times before shipping.
 
Only needed to see the first pic. That is not "Good" condition. I think "Fair" would be a stretch.

If you captured the original listing, post that along with who they are. Then everyone can make their own decision if they want to trust them.
 
never heard of a "surplus" condition grade. if there is one, it's obviously different than the nra and nra antique grading.
 
45collector said:
That’s pretty lame. I’d be contacting the sales manager.

Just curious what made you purchase one of those in the first place? Not knocking FEG they make some decent surplus type guns but these in particular, the .380’s and .32’s are kinda junky in the first place. I had the .380 version years ago that would not run reliably with any ammo.
Click to expand...



It was an impulse buy. I've purchased stuff from these guys before, it was never great, but it was never this bad.

This is them:

https://www.classicfirearms.com/feg-ap-765-sa-pistol-blue-ortwo-tone

I would advise you all to avoid them. I mean, anybody can make a mistake, but I sent them the same photos and they came back and told me (apparently with a straight face) that the pistol is in Good Surplus Condition.
 
Sorry to hear, I'm usually pretty forgiving of these companies as I'm much harder on grading firearms in my own retail business, but I wouldn't even call that fair, and would likely refuse to buy it as a dealer due to the aggravation. For $50-60 maybe, but I doubt that is what they listed these for....
 
EddieCoyle said:
It was an impulse buy. I've purchased stuff from these guys before, it was never great, but it was never this bad.

This is them:

https://www.classicfirearms.com/feg-ap-765-sa-pistol-blue-ortwo-tone

I would advise you all to avoid them. I mean, anybody can make a mistake, but I sent them the same photos and they came back and told me (apparently with a straight face) that the pistol is in Good Surplus Condition.
Click to expand...

I just took a look at their website, 98% of the C&R listings are "Out of stock".

It's annoying when sites do that, like why even bother keeping them listed?
 
Did you pay with a credit card?

If so, I'd file a complaint against them, the product they sold is *nothing* like the description or pictures.
 
and make sure to write a review on their site. "muzzle distorted, not safe to fire, looks like it got run over by a truck and dragged on the concrete, then used as a hammer. One star, but only because zero stars isn't an option"
 
I don't know how people can live with themselves when they screw others, but that's just me. I don't do a lot of gun business, but every used gun that I've ever sold was inspected personally by the buyer. Jack.
 
Looks like something one would expect to see posted on BPD News...


aEV7MRu.jpg



milktree said:
Did you pay with a credit card?

If so, I'd file a complaint against them, the product they sold is *nothing* like the description or pictures.
Click to expand...

If OP gets no satisfaction there, he can always turn it in at the next local gun buyback program. [wink]
 
I've been doing business with Classic for near 20 years. Has to be 3 owners ago. Back when they were JUST a C&R shop.

This is too bad. Gonna see if this shakes out OK in the next day or two and then take my name off their email list. I can't believe they wouldn't make good on that.
 
Surplus from what? Maybe they meant "gun buyback surplus good." A little friction tape on the grip and that thing would be right at home at a buyback.
 
Hello James,

I reviewed your pictures with the customer service manager and this does fit the surplus good condition standards. I am sorry you were not satisfied.
Click to expand...

We have very different standards.
 

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