The only thing worse than an ill informed anti gun type is...

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Will Brink

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An ill informed (read ignorant) gun owner! Of course we expect anti 2A/anti freedome/anti gun types to be ignorant of the facts, data, and history. The only thing worse, is a gun owner who is just as ignorant!

On gun forums like this, those types usually get straightened out quickly, but on non gun forums that might have a gun related thread, you find some real idiots.

Ignorant gun owners are really the worst possible combination for all gun owners. For example, I was debating with a gun owner, and he kept making statements such as:

"two things first thing i have a baby desert eagle 9mm. sweet gun sight is a bit off to the right. 17 round mag nice gun a pleasure to shoot. any way on to the next point. i didnt say a ban on assualt rifles. full auto strict ways to get one is my point. sorry that doesnt make alot of since head is a bit spinning today. any way more in the fact i support stricter control. i have no problem filling out paperwork to buy a gun no big. i do have a problem with some ass head selling a full auto in the paper to some punk. please read all my posts before you comment on one. i agree with gun control to a point. i agree that a criminal back ground check is and should be provided. saying what i can or cant buy as a law abiding citizen is completely diffrent. i dont support that in any way. now if charles manson were living down the street from me becouse some how he was released i would have a serious problem with him getting into the paper and saying hey theres a nice sig in the paper. then buying it no problem"

Can you count the number of statements that make this gun owner our own worst enemy? It seems educating existing gun owners might be even more important to the cause of 2A freedoms then educating non gun owners, half of which are hopeless at best anyway!

Rant off! [shocked]
 
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My advice to you ...avoid debates with bipolar morons. The Stupid Gene is a strong one in some elements of the population. Knowing how to spot it can be a great benefit as you can then avoid investing any intellectual effort on the individual - it won't help them at all and just makes you frustrated...

Two psychologist, Krugger and Dunning, wrote what I consider to be one of the best papers on this very subject:

Unskilled and Unaware of It: How Difficulties in Recognizing One's Own Incompetence Lead to Inflated Self-Assessments.

I quote from their paper:

"In 1995, McArthur Wheeler walked into two Pittsburgh banks and robbed them in broad daylight, with no visible attempt at disguise. He was arrested later that night, less than an hour after videotapes of him taken from surveillance cameras were broadcast on the 11 o'clock news. When police later showed him the surveillance tapes, Mr. Wheeler stared in incredulity. "But I wore the juice," he mumbled. Apparently, Mr. Wheeler was under the impression that rubbing one's face with lemon juice rendered it invisible to videotape cameras (Fuocco, 1996)."
 
Is that english? I think my IQ dropped 10 points by the time I got through that garbage.

Somone needs a visit from the grammar police
 
I was talking to a friend the other day and he is VERY pro-gun. He said, "I voted Yes on banning dog racing because even though gambling on dog racing is legal it brings with it a criminal element."

I told him that position is no different than the anit's who want to ban guns because of the criminal element. Sometimes we are our own worst enemies.
 
Just plain wow.
It is scary that this person could be presenting any sort of arguement to people. It is easy for someone to cut, paste and spread this far and wide (as has been done here, obviously).
The arguement is easily made that; "This is the face of gun ownership in America". "Can you believe we would trust this moron with a firearm?" He can't write a complete coherent sentence and he has access to."

I hate to see this kind of thing.

***corrected spelling so as not to appear to be a moron...
 
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Negotiator said:
My advice to you ...avoid debates with bipolar morons. The Stupid Gene is a strong one in some elements of the population. Knowing how to spot it can be a great benefit as you can then avoid investing any intellectual effort on the individual - it won't help them at all and just makes you frustrated...
Click to expand...

Agreed! Just venting! [crying]

Negotiator said:
Two psychologist, Krugger and Dunning, wrote what I consider to be one of the best papers on this very subject:

Unskilled and Unaware of It: How Difficulties in Recognizing One's Own Incompetence Lead to Inflated Self-Assessments.

I quote from their paper:

"In 1995, McArthur Wheeler walked into two Pittsburgh banks and robbed them in broad daylight, with no visible attempt at disguise. He was arrested later that night, less than an hour after videotapes of him taken from surveillance cameras were broadcast on the 11 o'clock news. When police later showed him the surveillance tapes, Mr. Wheeler stared in incredulity. "But I wore the juice," he mumbled. Apparently, Mr. Wheeler was under the impression that rubbing one's face with lemon juice rendered it invisible to videotape cameras (Fuocco, 1996)."
Click to expand...

Funny, I have read that paper and use it often. It's a classic!
 
seanc said:
Just plain wow.
I is scary that this person could be presenting any sort of arguement to people. It is easy for someone to cut, paste and spread this far and wide (as has been done here, obviously).
The arguement is easily made that; "This is the face of gun ownership in America". "Can you believe we woudl trust this moron with a fire arm?" He can't write a complete coheraent sentence and he has access to."

I hate to see this kind of thing.
Click to expand...

As do I. They make all gun owner look like complete morons. Yet, he probably thinks that babble is defending gun owners rights! Doh!
 
stoneypete said:
I was talking to a friend the other day and he is VERY pro-gun. He said, "I voted Yes on banning dog racing because even though gambling on dog racing is legal it brings with it a criminal element."

I told him that position is no different than the anit's who want to ban guns because of the criminal element. Sometimes we are our own worst enemies.
Click to expand...

Everything can bring a criminal element with it. Wherever humans exist there will be a sh*t head portion of the population that will try to take advantage of something or someone the should not. Humanitarian aid in third world countries brings a criminal element in to steal and horde food/supplies. Does that mean all humanitarian aid should stop or someone should squash the sh*theads? I don't think any of us are against severe penalties for gun crimes. But who really gets punished for them? Only those obeying the law to begin with of course. People shoplift and stores build that cost into their prices, in essence the same thing. The law abiding suffer at the hands of the stupid.......
 
Negotiator said:
My advice to you ...avoid debates with bipolar morons.
"
Click to expand...
Other people might be reading that thread and correcting the moron with a well thought out post might be beneficial to them. If more gun owners took the time to educate the anti's and non gun owners we'd have more voters on our side when we needed them the most. I for one never pass on an opportunity to educate someone who needs to learn what the 2nd really is. [cheers]
 
ArmedMainer said:
Other people might be reading that thread and correcting the moron with a well thought out post might be beneficial to them. If more gun owners took the time to educate the anti's and non gun owners we'd have more voters on our side when we needed them the most. I for one never pass on an opportunity to educate someone who needs to learn what the 2nd really is. [cheers]
Click to expand...

While I respect and applaud your most laudable approach, I have to disagree because of a couple of factors. Psychologically, people with very entrenched viewpoints are really hard to turn around. This is even more of a problem when dealing with, err, umm, less than bright folks... It just doesn't penetrate. I find it more frustrating than motivating dealing with such shuttered mentalities...life is too short. [wink]
 
Negotiator said:
While I respect and applaud your most laudable approach, I have to disagree because of a couple of factors. Psychologically, people with very entrenched viewpoints are really hard to turn around. This is even more of a problem when dealing with, err, umm, less than bright folks... It just doesn't penetrate. I find it more frustrating than motivating dealing with such shuttered mentalities...life is too short. [wink]
Click to expand...
My brother who is very bright fits into your description of someone who has a very entrenched viewpoint. I'll never turn him around but I've been lucky with a few other people. I'm glad I took the time with them but I clearly see your point too.[cheers]
 
Fortunately the only people with whom I get into firearm related debates are:
A) Friends who are arguing the pros and cons of bluing vs plating *sigh* and the like…
B) People who are pro-gun and pro AWB but totally clueless as to exactly what an “assault weapon” really is

I try to stay out of the big debates because it is, most of the time, a losing battle unless you have flow charts, graphs of gun violence vs legal ownership, etc at your fingertips. You’ll never be able to convince a Sarah Brady that guns don’t kill people, people kill people.
 
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i read that quote 3 times and still couldn't tell you what it said. I hate people like that. I have no tolerance for people who are so stupid that they can't even form a coherent sentence. I'm no grammar natzi and I think the web is a place where some grammatical laziness should be perfectly acceptable, but shit like that drives me shithouse. I wouldn't even bother arguing with someone like that. My 9 year old neice could write more cleary than that asshat.

to be honest, i wouldnt have a problem with a background check if thats where it stopped AND if the only disqualifier was a VIOLENT felony in your past. But, we all know it never does stop there.

Yes, it's true that background checks still violate the spirit of the second, but if the scope of such checks was truly limited to keeping guns away from convicted violent felons, i'd be willing to make that concession. Maybe in the case of people like the idiot in the OPs quote, and IQ test would even be "reasonable gun control" measure....[rolleyes]

It reminds me of a guy in my hunter's safety class years ago that couldn't read. I overheard him talking about having a ccw but he was taking the class because he never hunted before and wanted to get a license. I almost shit a brick thinking about this illiterate POS having a ccw. IMO, if you can't read, you don't need a gun. An yup, i mean that. Some will say even the illiterate have the right to defend themselves. f*** that. If you can't read, do the world a favor and don't reproduce and kill yourself asap. The world doesn't need you and certainly doesn't want to support your lazy ass.
 
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Negotiator said:
My advice to you ...avoid debates with bipolar morons. The Stupid Gene is a strong one in some elements of the population. Knowing how to spot it can be a great benefit as you can then avoid investing any intellectual effort on the individual - it won't help them at all and just makes you frustrated...

Two psychologist, Krugger and Dunning, wrote what I consider to be one of the best papers on this very subject:

Unskilled and Unaware of It: How Difficulties in Recognizing One's Own Incompetence Lead to Inflated Self-Assessments.

I quote from their paper:

"In 1995, McArthur Wheeler walked into two Pittsburgh banks and robbed them in broad daylight, with no visible attempt at disguise. He was arrested later that night, less than an hour after videotapes of him taken from surveillance cameras were broadcast on the 11 o'clock news. When police later showed him the surveillance tapes, Mr. Wheeler stared in incredulity. "But I wore the juice," he mumbled. Apparently, Mr. Wheeler was under the impression that rubbing one's face with lemon juice rendered it invisible to videotape cameras (Fuocco, 1996)."
Click to expand...

Saw a video poll relating to "How Obama Got Elected". It dealt with definite Obama voters. Folks were asked very general questions about our govt., names in leadership, who did what, etc.etc. Results were (to me) absolutely astounding. The polled voters knew absolutely nothing about the people currently in control of Congress, but stated, with any sort of negative question, "McCain or Palin". People who had no idea of who Reid or Pelosi are...(never heard of them) could tell the pollster that Palin had a pregnant daughter. These are voters???
 
Ray-500 said:
Saw a video poll relating to "How Obama Got Elected". It dealt with definite Obama voters. Folks were asked very general questions about our govt., names in leadership, who did what, etc.etc. Results were (to me) absolutely astounding. The polled voters knew absolutely nothing about the people currently in control of Congress, but stated, with any sort of negative question, "McCain or Palin". People who had no idea of who Reid or Pelosi are...(never heard of them) could tell the pollster that Palin had a pregnant daughter. These are voters???
Click to expand...

Well, believe it or not, they are voters and , more to the point, human beings who are subject to the same psychological biases and errors that you and I and everyone on this website are subject to - we can't help it, it's the way we are wired. When you "believe" something you will look for "facts" that support your belief or hypothesis, and disregard or rubbish "facts" that are contrary to your point of view. The principle of cognitive dissonance is alive and well and dwelling in all of us - the need to be consistent with our inner belief system. Festinger stated that to hold more than one view on a subject was to "flirt with absurdity" - we all believe we are good people and do the right thing, therefore we all rationalise our action to be consistent with that self image...

As a psychologist, I am more than aware of this phenomenon than most, but I still catch myself doing it at times...which scares the wotsit out of me.[thinking]
 
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Negotiator said:
Well, believe it or not, they are voters and , more to the point, human beings who are subject to the same psychological biases and errors that you and I and everyone on this website are subject to - we can't help it, it's the way we are wired. When you "believe" something you will look for "facts" that support your belief or hypothesis, and disregard or rubbish "facts" that are contrary to your point of view. The principle of cognitive dissonance is alive and well and dwelling in all of us - the need to be consistent with our inner belief system. Festinger stated that to hold more than one view on a subject was to "flirt with absurdity" - we all believe we are good people and do the right thing, therefore we all rationalise our action to be consistent with that self image...

As a psychologist, I am more than aware of this phenomenon than most, but I still catch myself doing it at times...which scares the wotsit out of me.[thinking]
Click to expand...

Grin, am not a psychologist, but the stupidity of what I saw scares the hell out of me. These folks had no clue about what they were voting for other than it was supposed to be "change". It reminded me of the flick "Stepford Wives" and the brainless following it involved. How can a person logically vote if they know nothing of which they are voting?
 
EddieCoyle said:
Or as my friend Jerry says, "Never argue with stupid people because they don't know how stupid they are."
Click to expand...

I guess that's something I still have to learn....and I'm not a young pup. I keep trying to use logic and common sense and facts....but its getting more difficult. Grin....talking to a stone wall? [rofl]
 
Scrivener has been given a vacation, the reasons for which are between the admins and Scrivener. Let's leave it at that.
 

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