OK, now I want to know why you guys are hating on the .40 cal?

Quinn800x

Quinn800x

Joined
Apr 15, 2010
Messages
265
Likes
26
Location
Southern NH
Feedback: 0 / 0 / 0
When I bought my G27 from MFLR I was actually looking for a G30 but they did not have one in stock. Hell bent on leaving there with a gun (cause it was my first) I started to ask about other sub compacts.

Then with the discussion about .40 it was explained to me that after about 25-30' the .40 actually had more knock down power than the than it big brother the .45. Being a newb this quickly changed my interest. Beside the .40 being a little more snappier why do they "suck" so much?
 
I have the S&W M&P in .40 and the Sig 239 in .40 and they are both great guns. The S&W has great long range accuracyl, my only complaint is the trigger pull is a bit heavy.
 
Quinn800x said:
Then with the discussion about .40 it was explained to me that after about 25-30' the .40 actually had more knock down power than the than it big brother the .45. Being a newb this quickly changed my interest.
Click to expand...

Most non-LEO defensive shootings occur under 10', so more "knock down power" at three times that distance doesn't seem useful. Did the guy you were talking to quantify what "knock down power" is defined as? Some think its energy transferred to the target, some think its the size of the cavity and some think its just the kinetic energy of the projectile. All three are equally valid ways of expressing power but each of them depends on different characteristics of the projectile and target. Millions of dollars were spent by the FBI testing performance of various calibers through various media and ranges, you may be able to find some results on google.

And the .40 doesn't suck so to say. A .40 will kill you just as fast as a 9mm. It's bigger and has more energy than the 9mm, but smaller and has less energy than a .45. There is no reason I can see to go with something between 9mm and .45 when there are plenty of 9mm and .45 options out there. The .40 ammo can also be a little difficult to find depending where you go.
 
Bob P said:
Because the .40 S&W has all the disadvantages of a 9mm without any of the good points.
Click to expand...

Like?

Nevermind the post above took care of it. And yes I agree most defensive shooting take place at 10' or less.
But i defianlty think I would rather have a .40 than a 9mm
 
Last edited:
It was developed because FBI agents complained about the recoil of the 10mm.

Developers heard these complaints and thought:

"Well, how bout we just make it wimpier?"


And the 40 S&W was born. That said, I own a pistol in .40 S&W.
 
Quinn800x said:
Like?
Click to expand...


Well, if you're an advocate of the big bullet going slow school, the .40 is small and fast and if you're an advocate of the small and fast school the 9 is faster.

Plus the 9mm is cheaper, easier to get and allows for more in the mag as the round is smaller. Using a 147gr +p load there's not a whole lot of difference between the 2.
 
Quinn800x said:
it was explained to me that after about 25-30' the .40 actually had more knock down power than the than it big brother the .45.
Click to expand...
There is no such thing as knockdown power.

That is a meaningless term bandied about by those who know nothing about terminal ballistics of handgun bullets.

It is also used by gunshop employees to sucker newbies into buying what the shop has vs what you really wanted but the shop does not have in stock.

Now that you paid for the first lesson, you can have this one for free: http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=19887
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Another reason why people hate on the .40 is for the same reason people often hate on glocks: It's funny to watch the fanboys get pissed off when you make fun of it
 
One advantage for us non-free-staters is that the .40 has more power than a 9mm, and if all you get is a 10-round mag you can fit 10 of either, so why not? If the choice is between 18 rounds of 9mm +P and 14 or so rounds of .40 S&W, there's more to consider. And while .40 S&W can get scarce, try finding cheap stocks of 10mm FMJ for target practice ...

Personally, I'm sympathetic to the "wussy 10mm" perspective, but I figure that every cartridge deserves to be judged on its own merits, and compared to what else is out there, the .40 S&W is at least as good as the 9mm, with only a slight price premium.
 
Alchemist17 said:
One advantage for us non-free-staters is that the .40 has more power than a 9mm, and if all you get is a 10-round mag you can fit 10 of either, so why not?
Click to expand...

My P229R in 9mm works fine with the 13 round prebans (easily modified to hold 15). I'd rather have 15 rounds of 9mm 147gr JHP than the 12 or so .40 rounds you can fit in the prebans.
 
Jose said:
There is no such thing as knockdown power.

That is a meaningless term bandied about by those who know nothing about terminal ballistics of handgun bullets.

It is also used by gunshop employees to sucker newbies into buying what the shop has vs what you really wanted but the shop does not have in stock.

Now that you paid for the first lesson, you can have this one for free: http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=19887
Click to expand...

I defiantly a newb compared to all you OLD guys, but that's OK I wouldn't trade my youth for it for I will be there someday!(hopefully)[wink] As for suckering me into buying it I think not, he recommended that I come back to get what i want several times but I didn't take his advice because I do not have the patience and wanted to leave with a gun.

"Knock down power" may have not been the term he used but I'm sure he knows his share on guns and calibers. My next hand gun I purchase will a 10mm, so I can join the big boy gun club with the rest .45 fanatics. And yes I know 10mm is hard to find but I do do some reloading the "sucky" .40 cal so I will be able to manage.

Thanks for the free lesson though Jose, its a pretty cool link! But I didn't see any 10mm in there.[laugh]
 
women like 9mm because they can wrap their small hands around the gun and it fits nicely in their purse
Metrosexuals like .40 because they aren't quite women, they aren't quite men. and it fits nicely in their "European carry all"
Men like 45. because they don't need extra rounds, they kill shit the first shot.
 
Supermoto said:
women like 9mm because they can wrap their small hands around the gun and it fits nicely in their purse
Metrosexuals like .40 because they aren't quite women, they aren't quite men. and it fits nicely in their "European carry all"
Men like 45. because they don't need extra rounds, they kill shit the first shot.
Click to expand...

Win.
 
Supermoto said:
women like 9mm because they can wrap their small hands around the gun and it fits nicely in their purse
Metrosexuals like .40 because they aren't quite women, they aren't quite men. and it fits nicely in their "European carry all"
Men like 45. because they don't need extra rounds, they kill shit the first shot.
Click to expand...

It's called a sachel. Indiana Jones used one.
 
The "hate" mainly comes from the fact that .40 S+W is an intentionally neutered cartridge. You can't goose it up, etc, as a result. It's an intentionally crippled 10mm. 10mm fans are pissed because it basically forced deprecation of the 10mm, which is the "real" .40. [laugh]

As far as "knock down power" is concerned, you might want to look at wound ballistics. a little bit. The energy levels between 9mm, .40, and .45 are not huge orders of magnitude different from one another. It's all mostly user preference, really. Choose a good quality JHP in any of the above calibers and be done with it.

One reason I dislike the .40 is because idiots recommend it to newbs all the time, and that's about the dumbest piece of advice anyone can dispense. It's not that its really hard to shoot, but the awkward recoil impulse of many .40 S+W handguns takes some getting used to... and exposing a noob to that right off the bat makes it that much harder for a new person to learn how to shoot. This is part of the reason you see a large number of used .40 S+W handguns for sale at gun stores... people buy them, and because they lack training, etc, they end up not being able to hit the broad side of a barn with it, then they get frustrated and sell the gun. The same can happen with any gun, but I think the recoil of the .40 plays into flinching, etc, pretty hard with newbs.

The only good things going for the .40 right now is the ammo price and it keeps the grip circumference of the gun small... but even then, both of those goals are met pretty well by 9mm.

At one point I had 5 handguns chambered in .40 S+W.... but over time the caliber lost its usefulness to me and I sold them all. I might get another one someday but I have no immediate plans to.... It's too small for bowling pins, and too big (or I should say, overkill) for steel plates.... so the only use for it is really as a defensive caliber... and I have a bunch of other guns in .45 and 9mm that will do that just as well.... so having .40s around is "redundancy of the redundancy department" kind of stuff.

-Mike
 
Last edited:

Similar threads

i was that guy...you know, the one we all hate
2
Replies
46
Views
1K
Broc
Broc
Want to know who has a monopoly of force in America?
2 3 4
Replies
111
Views
2K
fencer
fencer
Things you didn't know you needed
Replies
14
Views
502
greencobra
greencobra
Can you guys tell me what this is?
Replies
7
Views
514
LittleCalm
L
If you want more proof that we need good guys with guns, go ask the Fort Worth highway driver who—along with his children—is alive today
Replies
3
Views
250
Dennis in MA
Dennis in MA
Back
Top Bottom