Non-Standard licensing requirements -> Non-Statutory licensing requirements

[ochmude]

You forgot #3, which is a PD that isn't really aware of the legal difference between a "reason for issuance" was and a "restriction" is.

I've seen MIRCS licenses that say "Restrictions: All Lawful Purposes" on it, for example. A lot of PDs were doing that kind of thing, and probably are still doing it now, either because they're willfully ignorant or they generally don't care.

-Mike

I just noticed that mine issued by Holyoke in March of '06 says Restrictions: All Lawful Purposes. That's not a problem, though. I only carry while I am involved in the commission of a crime or while a fugitive from justice.

 

[terraformer]

Reading requires two letters of recommendation which must specifically state that they are written for the purpose of application for LTC.

Added. And thanks for bringing it up, it reminded me that H2Otown does the same thing.

 

[GSG]

I only carry while I am involved in the commission of a crime or while a fugitive from justice.

 

[terraformer]

Bumping this because I have been updating it with info gleaned from other threads.

 

[Goomba]

has anyone here every been pulled over in a city/town like N. Andover will carrying, and if so, what happened?

 

[terraformer]

has anyone here every been pulled over in a city/town like N. Andover will carrying, and if so, what happened?

Is this a general question or one specifically about a particular policy?

 

[SecondAmdFirst]

Medford has been impossible in the past but may become easier in the near future.

New Chief Jesse?

 

[SecondAmdFirst]

Question for you guys. What are your thoughts on the USCCA (United States Concealed Carry Association)? There was an advertisement in my latest NRA magazine and I was wondering if this is a worthwhile cause for donations and involvement. Thanks in advance for any information.

 

[Scrivener]

Question for you guys. What are your thoughts on the USCCA (United States Concealed Carry Association)? There was an advertisement in my latest NRA magazine and I was wondering if this is a worthwhile cause for donations and involvement. Thanks in advance for any information.

Just below mall ninjas on the evolutionary ladder.

 

[GSG]

has anyone here every been pulled over in a city/town like N. Andover will carrying, and if so, what happened?

I got in a car accident in a very red town, and when the cop arrived I pulled him aside, then handed him my driver's license and LTC and told him I was carrying. He glanced at the LTC, said "I don't need this" and handed it back, never ran it or mentioned anything gun related.

Keep in mind that most of these licensing policies have nothing to do with the RKBA feelings of the everyday beat cops.

 

[Scrivener]

Keep in mind that most of these licensing policies have nothing to do with the RKBA feelings of the everyday beat cops.

And even less to do with the United States Concealed Carry Association, which was the express issue in the OP.

 

[GSG]

And even less to do with the United States Concealed Carry Association, which was the express issue in the OP.

Huh? The OP in this thread?

 

[Pomeraniac]

I got in a car accident in a very red town, and when the cop arrived I pulled him aside, then handed him my driver's license and LTC and told him I was carrying. He glanced at the LTC, said "I don't need this" and handed it back, never ran it or mentioned anything gun related.

You weren't driving your Ferrari while wearing your BC Alumni sweatshirt with your hot, blonde wife in the passenger seat , were you?

 

[terraformer]

Huh? The OP in this thread?

Yeah, and that would apparently be post #102 in this thread. Everything prior was just useless fluff...

 

[Scrivener]

Huh? The OP in this thread?

Sorry - my bad.

I was at the top of the PAGE - doh!

That's what happens when it gets late....

 

[GSG]

You weren't driving your Ferrari while wearing your BC Alumni sweatshirt with your hot, blonde wife in the passenger seat , were you?

Not that time.

That's what happens when it gets late....

Gotcha.

 

[terraformer]

http://tenring.blogspot.com/2005/01/on-being-gun-nut-part-iv.html

Here is a story of one texan's move from Texas to MA and her travails through the gun laws here. Good read. Especially about her interactions with her boss who was very anti gun but from whom she needed a reference letter.

 

[terraformer]

Updated the OP with information on sharon from this thread
http://www.northeastshooters.com/vb...91882-trying-to-get-my-Class-A-but-I-am-stuck

 

[terraformer]

Newton requires a letter from your last PD if you have moved in between renewals...
http://www.northeastshooters.com/vb...g-Procedures?p=1306596&viewfull=1#post1306596

 

[GSG]

Newton requires a letter from your last PD if you have moved in between renewals...
http://www.northeastshooters.com/vb...g-Procedures?p=1306596&viewfull=1#post1306596

Interestingly, Newton doesn't require a permit if you're a hitman contract-killing someone for $10,000, they'll just charge you with murder and leave out the pesky gun charge.

 

[terraformer]

Edited the OP with this info from braintree

 

[GSG]

This isn't firsthand knowledge of any kind, but it's taken from the Holden PD website. They require two letters for new LTC applications from "responsible non-family members," and I can't tell exactly what they're saying WRT the safety courses.

Some interesting snippets from http://www.holdenpd.com/firearms.htm

HPD recommends that all qualified applicants apply for a Class A License to Carry rather than a Class B LTC or an FID card. If you are issued a lesser license and then wish to own a handgun in the future, you would need to reapply for the Class A including an additional $100 fee.

That sounds good, but it goes downhill from there.

— Expect 8 weeks or more to process your application through the state. Plan accordingly. The fall season is particulary busy for the FRB, so don't wait until September to apply or renew for hunting season. HPD highly recommends taking the class at least 3 months before your permit is due to expire.

From this it looks like they make you take a new safety class for each renewal!?!

There's more in their Application Instructions page

http://www.holdenpd.com/firearms checklist.pdf

New applicants for Class A or B License to Carry must bring 2 letters of recommendation.
Letters must be on letterhead from a responsible non-family member, stating how long they have known you
and that they feel you are a fit person to be licensed to carry firearms.
Letters should contain the word “firearm”.

Then later:

Applicants for Class A or B LTC or Class C FID must bring a certificate of completion for the state–
approved Basic Handgun Safety Course or Hunter Safety Course, completed anywhere in Massachusetts
within the past 1 (one) year. (Not required for Class D FID card applicants).

They also might want to include in their website that it's illegal to have mace/OC on school grounds without permission.

04/08/2009 College-bound high school seniors planning to obtain a Class D (Mace Only) permit - do not wait until August to apply! Start the process as soon as possible by calling for an appointment @ (508)829-4444. More info.
09/01/2005 Read all instructions carefully. Procedures have changed significantly because of new State system.

But at the bottom it says:

Website designed, researched and maintained by
Johannah Adams
Computer Project Coordinator
Holden Police Department

 

[GSG]

Also, might I suggest that the thread title of the OP be edited to something along the lines of "Illegal Non-Standard Licensing Practices" or something similar? Whether it's well intentioned or just ignorant of state law, all of this stuff is illegal for them to require.

 

[Len-2A Training]

Also, might I suggest that the thread title of the OP be edited to something along the lines of "Illegal Non-Standard Licensing Practices" or something similar? Whether it's well intentioned or just ignorant of state law, all of this stuff is illegal for them to require.

Please point out in MGLs exactly where it states that ANYTHING more than required on the form is ILLEGAL for a chief/LO to demand to determine "suitability"????

I hate it as much as you, but MGLs allows a determination of "suitability" and does NOT LIMIT what a chief/LO can mandate to determine this. That is the whole reason why H2559 was filed.

 

[terraformer]

From this it looks like they make you take a new safety class for each renewal!?!

That's probably the correct interpretation. This is a common enough misconception of the laws. The problem is in some cases it has been upheld under suitability, in others it has been thrown out. I don't believe any court cases have been fought high enough to have any precedence.

ETA: Thanks for digging that up. Holden is the only other town I have confirmed for safety course on renewal.

 

[Scrivener]

There is NO statutory time limit or expiration on a safety course.

By both statute and regulation, NO additional safety certificate is required once one has been licensed post-Chapter 180 or if one was licensed at the time of its enactment.

CoP's demanding same are doing so claiming it an exercise of their "wide latitude and broad discretion;" i.e. an abuse of authority in derogation of a quite specific law.

 

[terraformer]

There is NO statutory time limit or expiration on a safety course.

By both statute and regulation, NO additional safety certificate is required once one has been licensed post-Chapter 180 or if one was licensed at the time of its enactment.

CoP's demanding same are doing so claiming it an exercise of their "wide latitude and broad discretion;" i.e. an abuse of authority in derogation of a quite specific law.

But you lost a case where the gentleman ultimately had to take the course over again and to add insult to injury, they treated him like a new applicant correct? And didn't they charge him full price when he was eligible for senior renewals too?

 

[GSG]

Please point out in MGLs exactly where it states that ANYTHING more than required on the form is ILLEGAL for a chief/LO to demand to determine "suitability"????

I hate it as much as you, but MGLs allows a determination of "suitability" and does NOT LIMIT what a chief/LO can mandate to determine this. That is the whole reason why H2559 was filed.

Sorry! I might be guilty of repeating what I've heard (similar to "I was in a gunshop and I heard...") regarding these policies, or maybe I'm just confused about the difference between not issuing a license in the correct timeframe and requiring extra stuff.

If I'm wrong correct me, but oh how I wish I was right.

ETA: Thanks for digging that up. Holden is the only other town I have confirmed for safety course on renewal.

I was digging around for another link and stumbled across it accidentally, no problem.

 

[Len-2A Training]

GSG, regrettably you were wrong. See the second line in what you quoted of mine. That answers your question.

 

[GSG]

Ashburnham PD requires proof of residency via other state issued ID.

http://www.ashburnhampd.com/doc/pdf/Firearms_Licensing_Instructions.pdf

What You Will Need:
1. A completed application. All information on the application must be accurate, so please read all questions carefully and answer them completely and accurately.
2. Fees can only be paid by Check or Money Order. Please make checks payable to the Town of Ashburnham. Cash will not be accepted.
3. For first time LTC requests, a copy of a certificate of completion of a State approved basic firearms safety course or a certificate of completion of a hunter education course issued by the Massachusetts Division of Fisheries and Wildlife is required.
4. Proof of residency (Driver’s license or Massachusetts I.D.)
5. For renewals you must have your current LTC.
Once your application is processed and approved, you will be contacted by this department to pickup your LTC.