N.H. teenager arrested in Leominster mall for carrying loaded handgun

Sparkey said:
Why would,you come from tax free NH to shop in Mass
Kid sounds like a idiot thug
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Towns in nh like Mason, Greenville, New Ipswich are actually closer to Leoninster and Fitchburg malls than nashua or keene. Food snd clothing is tax free in ma. Im sure if he was buying a $1000 TV hed go to nashua. He was from Swanzey, which is near Keene, but Im not sure whats over there to shop at.
 
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snax said:
Towns in nh like Mason, Greenville, New Ipswich are actually closer to Leoninster and Fitchburg malls than nashua or keene. Food snd clothing is tax free in ma. Im sure if he was stealing a $1000 TV hed go to nashua. He was from Swanzey, which is near Keene, but Im not sure whats over there to shop at.
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Fixed it for you.
 
There's a mall that has a Walmart in Keene, but it's been a few years since I've been there, so I don't remember what else there might have been.

All of that aside, I would think possession of a stolen firearm is the overriding issue here. He might weasel out of some of the other charges, but that one doesn't seem to have a lot of wiggle room. I also wonder how well known he might be to the local to him police departments?

snax said:
Towns in nh like Mason, Greenville, New Ipswich are actually closer to Leoninster and Fitchburg malls than nashua or keene. Food snd clothing is tax free in ma. Im sure if he was buying a $1000 TV hed go to nashua. He was from Swanzey, which is near Keene, but Im not sure whats over there to shop at.
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Garys said:
There's a mall that has a Walmart in Keene, but it's been a few years since I've been there, so I don't remember what else there might have been.

All of that aside, I would think possession of a stolen firearm is the overriding issue here. He might weasel out of some of the other charges, but that one doesn't seem to have a lot of wiggle room. I also wonder how well known he might be to the local to him police departments?
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Kid is one of two things:
An ignorant idiot (not knowing he can't carry, didn't know it was stolen)
A stupid thug (17, carry a gun, thinks he's badass)

I'd say a little bit of both
Probably thinks he's badass carrying a gun, probably an ignorant idiot thinking he won't get caught and not knowing the laws, especially here in MA. Probably a lesser charge in NH, but since he's probably white, from NH, they will throw the book at him. Meanwhile, probably the same day in Fitchburg court, some gangbanger will walk with a similar charge because he is just getting his life back on track as an aspiring rapper/dj/producer/multiple baby daddy
 
bigblue said:
Sounds to me like the young lad opened his yapper and talked to the coppers a bit too much.
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After smoking a cigar with a BPD guy who is about to retire, I discovered that this doesn't really matter much- at least with regards to the whole "does the guy have a permit?" thing. He explained that he's not in the business of rustling people merely carrying guns (he's pretty pro 2A himself) but that if he wanted to get someone to produce a permit whom "he suspected of having a gun that wasn't supposed to" there is basically a way he can socially engineer people into doing it without violating the procedurals- "there are creative ways that you can ask to see their permit without acctually coming right out and asking them or demanding it from them". Not to mention even if the PD pulls a bogus search 9 out of 10 times it will escape scrutiny because of some other excuse. To get a court to block something because of a full blown 4A violation it has to be blatant- and you have to have an attorney that actually cares enough to harp on it.

-Mike
 
drgrant said:
After smoking a cigar with a BPD guy who is about to retire, I discovered that this doesn't really matter much- at least with regards to the whole "does the guy have a permit?" thing. He explained that he's not in the business of rustling people merely carrying guns (he's pretty pro 2A himself) but that if he wanted to get someone to produce a permit whom "he suspected of having a gun that wasn't supposed to" there is basically a way he can socially engineer people into doing it without violating the procedurals- "there are creative ways that you can ask to see their permit without acctually coming right out and asking them or demanding it from them". Not to mention even if the PD pulls a bogus search 9 out of 10 times it will escape scrutiny because of some other excuse. To get a court to block something because of a full blown 4A violation it has to be blatant- and you have to have an attorney that actually cares enough to harp on it.

-Mike
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Valid points Mike.
 
Garys said:
If it was YOUR stolen gun he had, you'd be calling for the death penalty. In your pro 2A haste, you seem to have missed the obvious. He had a STOLEN gun.
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Yes, I missed it. [sad2] That's what I get for doing this at work. [rofl]
 
Garys said:
If it was YOUR stolen gun he had, you'd be calling for the death penalty. In your pro 2A haste, you seem to have missed the obvious. He had a STOLEN gun.
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While I agree the gun needs to go back to whoever owns it (Unlikely now that mass police have it) we don;t have enough info to hang this kid yet. The only way to get a handgun legally at his age is private sale, there is a chance he simply bought a gun and the guy he bought it from stole it or got it from someone who did. I don't know how you would even be able to look it up, I doubt the cops are going to run checks for you on any gun you want to check out.
 
Garys said:
If it was YOUR stolen gun he had, you'd be calling for the death penalty. In your pro 2A haste, you seem to have missed the obvious. He had a STOLEN gun.
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Careful that you don't fall into an "ends justify the means" type of argument. Not saying that this is the case here, but just because it was stolen doesn't mean you can violate rights to discover that. See namedpipes below.

namedpipes said:
It's Schrodinger's Gun!

Until it is lawfully discovered it is neither stolen nor owned.
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___________________________________________________________________________________



firestorm said:
The only way to get a handgun legally at his age is private sale, there is a chance he simply bought a gun and the guy he bought it from stole it or got it from someone who did.
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I think you have some misunderstandings of the law. It said he was 17. You can legally purchase a handgun through a private sale at 18, and FFL at 21. You cannot purchase a handgun under 18. That doesn't mean you cannot carry a handgun legally in NH at 17, because under certain conditions, you can.


(x)(1) It shall be unlawful for a person to sell, deliver, or otherwise transfer to a person who the transferor knows or has reasonable cause to believe is a juvenile—


(A) a handgun; or
(B) ammunition that is suitable for use only in a handgun.


(2) It shall be unlawful for any person who is a juvenile to knowingly possess—
(A) a handgun; or
(B) ammunition that is suitable for use only in a handgun.


(3) This subsection does not apply to—


(A) a temporary transfer of a handgun or ammunition to a juvenile or to the possession or use of a handgun or ammunition by a juvenile if the handgun and ammunition are possessed and used by the juvenile—
(i) in the course of employment, in the course of ranching or farming related to activities at the residence of the juvenile (or on property used for ranching or farming at which the juvenile, with the permission of the property owner or lessee, is performing activities related to the operation of the farm or ranch), target practice, hunting, or a course of instruction in the safe and lawful use of a handgun;
(ii) with the prior written consent of the juvenile’s parent or guardian who is not prohibited by Federal, State, or local law from possessing a firearm, except—
(I) during transportation by the juvenile of an unloaded handgun in a locked container directly from the place of transfer to a place at which an activity described in clause (i) is to take place and transportation by the juvenile of that handgun, unloaded and in a locked container, directly from the place at which such an activity took place to the transferor; or
(II) with respect to ranching or farming activities as described in clause (i), a juvenile may possess and use a handgun or ammunition with the prior written approval of the juvenile’s parent or legal guardian and at the direction of an adult who is not prohibited by Federal, State or local law from possessing a firearm;
(iii) the juvenile has the prior written consent in the juvenile’s possession at all times when a handgun is in the possession of the juvenile; and
(iv) in accordance with State and local law;


(B) a juvenile who is a member of the Armed Forces of the United States or the National Guard who possesses or is armed with a handgun in the line of duty;


(C) a transfer by inheritance of title (but not possession) of a handgun or ammunition to a juvenile; or


(D) the possession of a handgun or ammunition by a juvenile taken in defense of the juvenile or other persons against an intruder into the residence of the juvenile or a residence in which the juvenile is an invited guest.
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Bonesinium said:
Careful that you don't fall into an "ends justify the means" type of argument. Not saying that this is the case here, but just because it was stolen doesn't mean you can violate rights to discover that. See namedpipes below.





___________________________________________________________________________________





I think you have some misunderstandings of the law. It said he was 17. You can legally purchase a handgun through a private sale at 18, and FFL at 21. You cannot purchase a handgun under 18. That doesn't mean you cannot carry a handgun legally in NH at 17, because under certain conditions, you can.
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I want to know how you know what this kid's wants are from post 21.
 
Not to mention even if the PD pulls a bogus search 9 out of 10 times it will escape scrutiny because of some other excuse. To get a court to block something because of a full blown 4A violation it has to be blatant- and you have to have an attorney that actually cares enough to harp on it.
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And a judge that will listen. I am aware of one case where a warrant was issued for a search based on evidence of legal activity (possession of a gun in a car not on the known LTC holder's person). The judge started out with "counsel, I don't want to hear any arguments about the warrant."
 

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