Mass AWB’s days are numbered

Rob Boudrie said:
I checked - there was timely follow-up to the case Sparky claims got no response.

As to the future, I see "due process" as a big attack surface. Prior to Heller/Bruen, an LTC denial was about an administratively issued license, and a denial was not considered punishment or deprivation of a right by the courts. This attitude survived post-Bruen when the courts cited the "minor penalty" discharge within 500ft of a dwelling was a per-se offense, not even considering lifetime PP status as part of the penalty. I know of no other right that a user can be stripped of without the protections of due process being afforded to the accused.

A proper federal case would raise at least some of the following questions:
  • May a finding of not guilty or dropped charges be used as the basis for stripping a person of a constitutional right?
  • Can heresay evidence be used for that purpose?
  • Can an individual be denied their 2A rights because they believe they were abducted by aliens? (yes, this has happened)
  • Does the individual have a right to confront their accuser?
  • Are police reports accepted as fact with the individual having no right to elicit testimony from the author?
  • Can rumor or reputation, not substantiated by sworn testimony be used for such a purpose?
  • Does the individual have a right to know who provided adverse information to the licensing officer, and confront that accuser in court?
  • Does the fact that a case involves deprivation of a constitutional right entitle the subject to a jury trial?
  • Does the prospect of losing a constitutional right entitle one to discovery?
  • Is the standard "reasonable doubt" or "preponderance of the evidence"?
  • Etc, etc.
The rules are different for stripping someone of a constitutional right than handling of an administrative licensing issue. The MA system has not yet caught up to that.
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Rob I respect you very much. Great guy in our community, but you’re wrong. There was no response until called out. I really dont care anymore as I dont donate my money to them anymore. But don’t act like the media and just say things that aren’t true.
This is a close friend of mine I work with every day. What was claimed was that he/ whoever represented COMM2A was out of country and the email got bounced back. My buddy never recieved an email until I made a stink on this site. And when he got a response finally he was told nothing can be done, this stuff takes a long time.
Making a call to the pd was suggested, a simple letter…nope. And in the long ring it was a letter sent from another resident that at least got the process rolling again. Imagine what a message from COMM2A could have done. 🤷‍♂️.
Just can’t stand disinformation
 
PappyM3 said:
The NRA have always been willing to compromise and give up rights. Maybe they’re changing, maybe not. But I can say until they clear out their C-suite, I’m not donating a dime to them.
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I agree on not donating until money shenanigans are addressed. That said, NRA, just like GOAL, focuses on the legislative agenda, not the judicial one.
 
The Second amendmanet foundation and fire arms policy cololition are dropping heat daily and they do a great job of posting case updates in real time.

I still support GOAL, SAF, FPC, GOA maybe not equally all the time but they all need to be around. some need better PR staff IMO.

We need every single voice we can get. Take a lesson from the left fight fight fight never surrender. They do it and sadly it’s worked.
 
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Sparky1911 said:
Rob I respect you very much. Great guy in our community, but you’re wrong. There was no response until called out. I really dont care anymore as I dont donate my money to them anymore. But don’t act like the media and just say things that aren’t true.
This is a close friend of mine I work with every day. What was claimed was that he/ whoever represented COMM2A was out of country and the email got bounced back. My buddy never recieved an email until I made a stink on this site. And when he got a response finally he was told nothing can be done, this stuff takes a long time.
Making a call to the pd was suggested, a simple letter…nope. And in the long ring it was a letter sent from another resident that at least got the process rolling again. Imagine what a message from COMM2A could have done. 🤷‍♂️.
Just can’t stand disinformation
Click to expand...
I did reply. There was a bounce back.

I also asked you for specific wording that would make the PD do what they are required to do in terms of following the law when you did not like the answer of "Doing this by legal systems means will take longer than the delay they are claiming they need"

It does take a long time with regards to legal filings. Nothing moves slower than the legal system.

I will format a message from Comm2A to Framingham PD. If it does nothing to advance the status quo, will you admit you were wrong?
 
Spartan65 said:
The Second amendmanet foundation and fire arms policy Cololition are dropping heat daily and they do a great job of posting case updates in real time.
Click to expand...
We seem to be focusing on things that produce results, even if they are short-term ones. All the non-profits that go to court to fix bad laws seem to be in vogue today. These organizations are modern media savvy and post regular updates, making themselves appear very active. They are, don't get me wrong but they are trying to fix bad laws that's already been voted in.
On the other hand, legislation-focused organizations work to make sure bad laws do not get written or voted in. Their job is much less visible. For example, if GOAL works with MA legislature to make sure that 20 bad laws don't ever get voted in, people here on NES would say "Well, the laws are so bad they would have never get voted in, and therefore GOAL did not do anything". This is of course malarkey. GOAL tries to prevent many laws from getting out. Sometimes they are unable to prevent one let through and a bad law gets voted in. This is where organizations like Comm2A, SAF, or GOA jump in and try to remove the bad law by judicial means.

Here's how I look at GOAL and whether they are effective or not. Ask yourself: have there been any new MA laws that have made things drastically worse for MA gun owners in the past 10 years? The only one I can think of is the red-flag law. Meanwhile, on an annual basis, there are well over a dozen anti-2A laws introduced in the MA legislature EVERY YEAR! Have those laws get voted in by the majority Democrat legislature and signed into law by the Democrat governor?? There have not! This is, in many ways thanks to GOAL.
 
1903Collector said:
Romney was governor in 2016? Did I hear that right? Where the f*** was I?
Click to expand...
And he said something about Healey being AG in the early 2000s ... or made it sound that way.

WTF is this sh*t?

If this guy is going after the State, we are f*cked, the AWB is here to stay. This dude is high AF.
 
Darksideblues42 said:
I did reply. There was a bounce back.

I also asked you for specific wording that would make the PD do what they are required to do in terms of following the law when you did not like the answer of "Doing this by legal systems means will take longer than the delay they are claiming they need"

It does take a long time with regards to legal filings. Nothing moves slower than the legal system.

I will format a message from Comm2A to Framingham PD. If it does nothing to advance the status quo, will you admit you were wrong?
Click to expand...
I personally don’t want you to do anything. I don’t live there. Dont really care anymore. One way or another it opened my eyes to what it would really take to get help from organizations like yourself or goal, who I donate my hard earned money. I respect you, and all you do, I don’t mean to crap on you or your organization…I apologize if I have. What I should say is Im going to donate to organizations who try to help the average Joe. I get you guys do bigger stuff.
 
Sparky1911 said:
I don’t live there. Dont really care anymore.
Click to expand...
The following is not a dig or an insult, just genuine curiosity.

I see a number of folks here on NES that no longer live in the Northeast yet visit NES regularly and post actively. What makes you want to visit and post on NES? Most of the posts here are gripes or questions about AWB or other restrictions. So why would someone, who escaped to a free state, want to continue reading and posting on NES?
 
Darksideblues42 said:
I did reply. There was a bounce back.

I also asked you for specific wording that would make the PD do what they are required to do in terms of following the law when you did not like the answer of "Doing this by legal systems means will take longer than the delay they are claiming they need"

It does take a long time with regards to legal filings. Nothing moves slower than the legal system.

I will format a message from Comm2A to Framingham PD. If it does nothing to advance the status quo, will you admit you were wrong?
Click to expand...
With all due respect, Sir, and I appreciate everything that is being done on the 2A legal front...

Will you admit that stating: 'the legal process involving 2A in this state takes too long, so why bother'; is quite literally the goal of the anti's and you are playing right into it.

If you are willing to write a letter now, then it is not a product of being unwilling to put in the effort. So why aren't we doing it? Why didn't we send Framingham a letter for every resident that is having this issue?

I've seen NESers diagnose unique car issues from a picture of a part on the ground. I'd imagine we could help Framingham residents draft a letter that the lawyers would look over and agree with. Then send the letters written by NES/citizens, to the PD via Comm2A. They use full blown intimidation against us, but we won't even annoy a PD with a handful of letters to possibly convince them to change their ways prior to a legal pursuit?

Like Sparky said, Framingham is still doing this today. A letter 7 months ago may not have helped his friend in a timely fashion, but it would have helped Mr. Plow who lives down the street and applied last week.

Why must we sit and wait while the opponents spew lies and make attempts at limiting our freedoms every chance they get? Oh yeah, the process takes too long.

We joke around that the enemy likes to hang around here. If they do, they are reading this thread with a smile and a drink tonight.
 
MikeyGarand said:
With all due respect, Sir, and I appreciate everything that is being done on the 2A legal front...

Will you admit that stating: 'the legal process involving 2A in this state takes too long, so why bother'; is quite literally the goal of the anti's and you are playing right into it.

If you are willing to write a letter now, then it is not a product of being unwilling to put in the effort. So why aren't we doing it? Why didn't we send Framingham a letter for every resident that is having this issue?

I've seen NESers diagnose unique car issues from a picture of a part on the ground. I'd imagine we could help Framingham residents draft a letter that the lawyers would look over and agree with. Then send the letters written by NES/citizens, to the PD via Comm2A. They use full blown intimidation against us, but we won't even annoy a PD with a handful of letters to possibly convince them to change their ways prior to a legal pursuit?

Like Sparky said, Framingham is still doing this today. A letter 7 months ago may not have helped his friend in a timely fashion, but it would have helped Mr. Plow who lives down the street and applied last week.

Why must we sit and wait while the opponents spew lies and make attempts at limiting our freedoms every chance they get? Oh yeah, the process takes too long.

We joke around that the enemy likes to hang around here. If they do, they are reading this thread with a smile and a drink tonight.
Click to expand...
We (Comm2A) were told that the initial situation was a miscommunication from Framingham on the part of someone who didn't understand that their policies had been updated for Bruen already.

No one mentioned that there were still delay issues with regards to processing applications in the time and manner specified by MGL.

Now that we are aware, I am happy to write a letter.

We simply cannot address issues we don't know are happening.
 
.
Sparky1911 said:
These our our problems. This is all we have here
COMM2A is a complete JOKE
AS IS GOAL
these organizations take our money and get NOTHING DONE!
After I saw the light with COMM2A I stopped donating to them.
And I think goal got my last three year, when that runs up, never again.
GOA maybe. NAGR maybe.
Thanks for nothing COMM2A and goal.
Still have mag bans, still have a. Asualt weapons ban, still have a roster, still have to jump thru hoops just to get a license.
My friend just got his license, applied in January, he just got it two days ago. And that’s after his city shut down issuing any new licenses for 2 months.

Including the 2 months they would issue NO NEW LICENSES TO ANYONE, and the 4 month wait after finally being ALLOWED to get his paperwork in, it took him 6 months to get a LTC. A tax paying law abiding citizen.
DO YOU THINK COMM2A WOULD HELP, NOPE,
We sent emails and messages with no reply. It was only when I called theM Out in this shooters board did they respond. And they said there is nothing they can do. They never even replied to him until called out. THEY ARE A JOKE
that’s why Mass sucks. We have these organizations sucking down our money and lining pockets.
Click to expand...
Come on man, not this again.
 
Sparky1911 said:
Rob I respect you very much. Great guy in our community, but you’re wrong. There was no response until called out. I really dont care anymore as I dont donate my money to them anymore. But don’t act like the media and just say things that aren’t true.
This is a close friend of mine I work with every day. What was claimed was that he/ whoever represented COMM2A was out of country and the email got bounced back. My buddy never recieved an email until I made a stink on this site. And when he got a response finally he was told nothing can be done, this stuff takes a long time.
Making a call to the pd was suggested, a simple letter…nope. And in the long ring it was a letter sent from another resident that at least got the process rolling again. Imagine what a message from COMM2A could have done. 🤷‍♂️.
Just can’t stand disinformation
Click to expand...
My info is second hand as I was not the person handling the response, so I accept that I may have not fully understood the sequence of events.
 
40 Creedmoor fan said:
Simple!
Maura Healy is a political animal. She's also smart and very ambitious. She does not do anything unless it improves her political standing.
She was never interested in "upholding the law" or banning guns. The only reason she made those "proclamations" in 2015 is because she wanted to get the job of the head of the Justice Department in HRC's cabinet, once she became the president. When HRC bombed, instead of going down with the ship "HMS Hillary", Maura regrouped and started positioning herself for the gubernatorial job. Historically, state governors have far better chances of becoming president of the United States than any other position(Bush Jr., Clinton, Reagan, Carter, Nixon, etc.)
The other reason why her office never prosecuted anyone using the "new" interpretation is that it would result in a lawsuit that would overturn MA AWB which would be the mark of death on her political career. No prosecutor wants to have their name be on a case that goes to the SCOTUS and loses.
Click to expand...
Exactly! I've made this point before, Maura is not a crazy Leftist. She's a jock, a lawyer and an ambitious Politician. You don't think she's looking at Kamala and thinking I'm 10x smarter and eloquent than this phony "minority". Maura has her eye on the prize and it's the WH.
 
40 Creedmoor fan said:
Simple!
Maura Healy is a political animal. She's also smart and very ambitious. She does not do anything unless it improves her political standing.
She was never interested in "upholding the law" or banning guns. The only reason she made those "proclamations" in 2015 is because she wanted to get the job of the head of the Justice Department in HRC's cabinet, once she became the president. When HRC bombed, instead of going down with the ship "HMS Hillary", Maura regrouped and started positioning herself for the gubernatorial job. Historically, state governors have far better chances of becoming president of the United States than any other position(Bush Jr., Clinton, Reagan, Carter, Nixon, etc.)
The other reason why her office never prosecuted anyone using the "new" interpretation is that it would result in a lawsuit that would overturn MA AWB which would be the mark of death on her political career. No prosecutor wants to have their name be on a case that goes to the SCOTUS and loses.
Click to expand...
If that twat is elected president I suspect the real insurrection will begin
 
Lank said:
If that twat is elected president I suspect the real insurrection will begin
Click to expand...

I don't believe she wants to be president. I think she'd love to be AG or even Deputy AG or something. High up, but not at the top of the tree.

She's cautious. Shifty. She's not the type to go out on a limb, and presidents have to do that. Some governors do too, but not in MA.
 
Picton said:
Tell that to anyone living in Brookline or another red town. They're now, at last, equal to the rest of the state. That matters.



And don't be dismissive about restrictions. They were a massive issue for many citizens. They encouraged abuse of power, ignored the intent of the LTC background checks, and denied RKBA to people who were fully qualified to exercise it, even under the state's own laws.

Destroying that was huge. Restrictions were the most tyrannical part of the whole regime, because they were unaccountable and could not be effectively challenged.
Click to expand...
No kidding. Target and hunting? F that. T&H is not what the 2nd A protects. The democrats insist otherwise.
 
Lank said:
No kidding. Target and hunting? F that. T&H is not what the 2nd A protects. The democrats insist otherwise.
Click to expand...

"Hey! Congrats. Here's your License To Carry, good citizen! Good luck, and make sure you follow that T&H restriction!"

"...but that restriction doesn't let me carry."

"Don't be bothered by that, good citizen! A License to Carry doesn't really mean you can carry, no matter who you are. Just try carrying in a post office, for example! Amirite?"

"...but why did you impose the restriction?"

"Don't worry your pretty little head, good citizen. Just trust us. You do trust us, don't you?"

"...uh. yes?"

"Good! Awesome. Fantastic! Any other questions, good citizen?"

"...yeah. is there a way to appeal the restriction? or can i get it lifted?"

(scowl) "It's starting to sound like you don't trust us... Might make me question your suitability, citizen."



Worst part of the old system. By far. No due process; just a total circumvention of the state's own law, because the state didn't believe in that law.
 
Picton said:
"Hey! Congrats. Here's your License To Carry, good citizen! Good luck, and make sure you follow that T&H restriction!"

"...but that restriction doesn't let me carry."

"Don't be bothered by that, good citizen! A License to Carry doesn't really mean you can carry, no matter who you are. Just try carrying in a post office, for example! Amirite?"

"...but why did you impose the restriction?"

"Don't worry your pretty little head, good citizen. Just trust us. You do trust us, don't you?"

"...uh. yes?"

"Good! Awesome. Fantastic! Any other questions, good citizen?"

"...yeah. is there a way to appeal the restriction? or can i get it lifted?"

(scowl) "It's starting to sound like you don't trust us... Might make me question your suitability, citizen."



Worst part of the old system. By far. No due process; just a total circumvention of the state's own law, because the state didn't believe in that law.
Click to expand...
All due to the lefts belief that RKBA is only allowed if associated with military service
 
Mountain said:
Wouldn't their recent filing in the 8th Circuit be an example of judicial focus?
Click to expand...
And this is a problem, in my opinion. Their credibility will be nil if they lose the lawsuit from NY AG.
As a general function of NRA: it started as a training org, added a legislative branch in the 1970s and a legal one in the 2000s (NRA-ILA). So, yes, they do have the legal department but it's nowhere near as prolific as the training department or as notorious as the legislative one.
 
Sparky1911 said:
These our our problems. This is all we have here
COMM2A is a complete JOKE
AS IS GOAL
these organizations take our money and get NOTHING DONE!
After I saw the light with COMM2A I stopped donating to them.
And I think goal got my last three year, when that runs up, never again.
GOA maybe. NAGR maybe.
Thanks for nothing COMM2A and goal.
Still have mag bans, still have a. Asualt weapons ban, still have a roster, still have to jump thru hoops just to get a license.
My friend just got his license, applied in January, he just got it two days ago. And that’s after his city shut down issuing any new licenses for 2 months.

Including the 2 months they would issue NO NEW LICENSES TO ANYONE, and the 4 month wait after finally being ALLOWED to get his paperwork in, it took him 6 months to get a LTC. A tax paying law abiding citizen.
DO YOU THINK COMM2A WOULD HELP, NOPE,
We sent emails and messages with no reply. It was only when I called theM Out in this shooters board did they respond. And they said there is nothing they can do. They never even replied to him until called out. THEY ARE A JOKE
that’s why Mass sucks. We have these organizations sucking down our money and lining pockets.
Click to expand...
sour grapes
 

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