Keeping a gun in your vehicle ?

[ateamrob]

I understand its a federal thing and the PO is a federal building and all that but when you really think about it.... why cant you carry in a PO?

are they afraid we are going to flip out and start blasting due to the constand increase in stamps or something??

 

[JimR]

It used to be there was some ambiguity, but not with the new
(although at this point its a few years OLD!) licensing reform.
"Reason for Issuance" is now "Restriction" and there is no more
ambiguity. You can take that to the bank. If your friend
doesn't know about that, I would stop listening to him, LE status
or otherwise. There is a law on the books about "carrying
against restriction" with a penalty of loss of license and a fine.
IIRC it is not a "felony" or anything like that, however... but still
pretty steep nonetheless.

-Mike

I just got my new LTC in July. It has the " Reason for Issueing License" box on it. It clearly states for all lawful purposes. The new License has another box according to him that says Restrictions. He read it to me over the phone and it is definetly a differnet license than mine. Mine was renewed by paper form. His was done on the new computer system in May. Does anyone have a new license like that where they can post of picture of it for all to see? I was not aware of the "Carrying Against Restriction" clause. can someone tell me where to find this? I will also ask him about this. as for a glove box to store your handgun, that is a really bad idea. Do you people store your loaded handgun in your vehicle while you are out of it? Think about what a Judge or Jury would say if your loaded handgun was stolen from your un-occupied vehicle and used to kill someone. Do you think you would walk away free? What about a Civil lawsuit for damages due to your irresponsibility for storing a loaded gun in your vehicle. I'm not trying to start something here. I am surely not anti anything other than against Antis. I am trying to save somebody a lot of aggravation should this ever happen to them.

 

[Mikey]

I just did a search for "glove box" and what do you know all the answer appeared.

Here is one.

http://www.northeastshooters.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=6868

 

[M1911]

I was not aware of the "Carrying Against Restriction" clause. can someone tell me where to find this?

Jim: Mass. General Laws are online. I strongly suggest that you spend a while reading the appropriate parts of Chapter 140. To answer your question, See MGL Ch. 140 S. 131, which reads, in part:

Section 131. All licenses to carry firearms shall be designated Class A or Class B, and the issuance and possession of any such license shall be subject to the following conditions and restrictions:

(a) A Class A license shall entitle a holder thereof to purchase, rent, lease, borrow, possess and carry: (i) firearms, including large capacity firearms, and feeding devices and ammunition therefor, for all lawful purposes, subject to such restrictions relative to the possession, use or carrying of firearms as the licensing authority deems proper; and (ii) rifles and shotguns, including large capacity weapons, and feeding devices and ammunition therefor, for all lawful purposes; provided, however, that the licensing authority may impose such restrictions relative to the possession, use or carrying of large capacity rifles and shotguns as it deems proper. A violation of a restriction imposed by the licensing authority under the provisions of this paragraph shall be cause for suspension or revocation and shall, unless otherwise provided, be punished by a fine of not less than $1,000 nor more than $10,000; provided, however, that the provisions of section 10 of chapter 269 shall not apply to such violation.

Pay particular attention to the portion that I put in bold. The full text of that section can be found here: http://www.mass.gov/legis/laws/mgl/140-131.htm

As you can see, I've given you a pointer to a specific section in Mass General Law. Please ask your police officer friend to do the same.

I will also ask him about this. as for a glove box to store your handgun, that is a really bad idea. Do you people store your loaded handgun in your vehicle while you are out of it?

There is a difference between what is a recommendation (i.e., a "good" idea or a "bad" idea) versus what is legal or illegal. I avoid leaving a gun in my vehicle unattended. But there have been times when it was necessary. Some may argue that it is not a "good" idea, but that does not make it illegal.

Think about what a Judge or Jury would say if your loaded handgun was stolen from your un-occupied vehicle and used to kill someone. Do you think you would walk away free?

What law would I have broken? Please post a citation to the statute.

What about a Civil lawsuit for damages due to your irresponsibility for storing a loaded gun in your vehicle. I'm not trying to start something here. I am surely not anti anything other than against Antis. I am trying to save somebody a lot of aggravation should this ever happen to them.

Sorry, but I don't think of that as being irresponsible. I've got a bunch of knives sitting, unsecured, on the counter of my kitchen. I keep them quite sharp and, in fact, just polished several of them last night. If someone broke in, stole my 10" chef's knife sharpened to a razor's edge, and killed someone with it, the person responsible would be the murderer.

As for what a jury in a civil trial would find, that's another matter.

 

[drgrant]

I just got my new LTC in July. It has the " Reason for Issueing License" box on it. It clearly states for all lawful purposes. The new License has another box according to him that says Restrictions. He read it to me over the phone and it is definetly a differnet license than mine.

FWIW whether or not you have the new or old style license is
meaningless. The law itself has changed on the back end, so
all the IA/Chief has to do is say "that really is a restriction".
Possession of the horseblanket doesn't mean that license flys
under the radar.

I was not aware of the "Carrying Against Restriction" clause.
can someone tell me where to find this?

I think you can find it on something off GOAL's site, or search
around on here a bit. I don't have the URL to chapter and
verse offhand. (Although IIRC I think I posted it less than a
couple of weeks ago!)

(all kinds of other stuff redacted)
What about a Civil lawsuit for damages due to your irresponsibility for storing a loaded gun in your vehicle.

As Vincent says in HEAT, "YOU COULD GET KILLED WALKIN YO
DOGGIE!" We could talk about "what ifs" until were
blue in the face. Civil Suit? Someone could sue you for just
about anything. Negligence is a fun topic, also hashed out
here quite a bit. Vicarious Liability is fun. One thing I know
for certain, is if you "act WITHIN THE LAW" a lot of risk goes
out the window.

I'm not trying to start something here. I am surely not anti anything other than against Antis. I am trying to save somebody a lot of aggravation should this ever happen to them.

I agree with that concept (trying to save people from
trouble) but posting inaccurate/false information
as "this is the LAW" when it really is not, doesn't do anyone any
favors. Again, what is technically, to the letter, "Legal" and
what is "Prudent" are often two different things, and it is very
important to understand the difference between the two. It
sounds like nitpicking, but the last thing we need in MA is people
inventing laws that don't exist.


-Mike

 

[kevin9]

I just got my new LTC in July. It has the " Reason for Issueing License" box on it. It clearly states for all lawful purposes. The new License has another box according to him that says Restrictions. He read it to me over the phone and it is definetly a differnet license than mine. Mine was renewed by paper form. His was done on the new computer system in May. Does anyone have a new license like that where they can post of picture of it for all to see?

My LTC Class A, issued slightly more than a year ago, has a line that says "Restrictions: Target & Hunting" right below the "Issuing City/Town" line. There is no line or entry anywhere on the license that says anything about reason for issuing. The old form I used to apply might have had such a line, but the license does not. The officer typed all the info from my paper form into a form on their computer. What entries it had there I do not know: I thought it would be bad form to stand next to him and peer over his shoulder as he was typing.

I was not aware of the "Carrying Against Restriction" clause. can someone tell me where to find this? I will also ask him about this.

Have you checked out the Goal web site yet? As I indicated above their law chart page has references for the various MA gun laws. 2 clicks and you'll have your answer, MGL chapter and verse straight from the mass.gov web site.

as for a glove box to store your handgun, that is a really bad idea.

And almost certainly illegal.

Do you people store your loaded handgun in your vehicle while you are out of it?

Chill dude. That would be illegal, and I don't think you'll find anyone here who would advocate otherwise.

 

[kevin9]

What law would I have broken? Please post a citation to the statute.

http://www.mass.gov/legis/laws/mgl/140-131c.htm Section c.

 

[M1911]

Chill dude. That would be illegal, and I don't think you'll find anyone here who would advocate otherwise.

I'll advocate otherwise. If your car is locked, unattended, then I suspect the appropriate statute would be that concerning storage, not transport. Here's the full text of MGL section concerning storage:

Chapter 140: Section 131L. Weapons stored or kept by owner; inoperable by any person other than owner or lawfully authorized user; punishment

Section 131L. (a) It shall be unlawful to store or keep any firearm, rifle or shotgun including, but not limited to, large capacity weapons, or machine gun in any place unless such weapon is secured in a locked container or equipped with a tamper-resistant mechanical lock or other safety device, properly engaged so as to render such weapon inoperable by any person other than the owner or other lawfully authorized user. For purposes of this section, such weapon shall not be deemed stored or kept if carried by or under the control of the owner or other lawfully authorized user.

(b) A violation of this section shall be punished, in the case of a firearm, rifle or shotgun that is not a large capacity weapon, by a fine of not less than $500 nor more than $5,000 or by imprisonment for not more than one year, or by both such fine and imprisonment, and in the case of a large capacity weapon or machine gun, by a fine of not less than $1,000 nor more than $10,000 or by imprisonment for not less than one year nor more than ten years, or by both such fine and imprisonment.

(c) A violation of this section shall be punished, in the case of a rifle or shotgun that is not a large capacity weapon and such weapon was stored or kept in a place where a person under the age of 18 who does not possess a valid firearm identification card issued under section 129B may have access without committing an unforeseeable trespass, by a fine of not less than $1,000 nor more than $10,000 or by imprisonment for not less than one year nor more than ten years, or by both such fine and imprisonment.

(d) A violation of this section shall be punished, in the case of a rifle or shotgun that is a large capacity weapon, firearm or machine gun was stored or kept in a place where a person under the age of 18 may have access, without committing an unforeseeable trespass, by a fine of not less than $5,000 nor more than $10,000 or by imprisonment for not less than two and one-half years, nor more than ten years, or by both such fine and imprisonment.

(e) A violation of the provisions of this section shall be evidence of wanton or reckless conduct in any criminal or civil proceeding if a person under the age of 18 who was not a trespasser or was a foreseeable trespasser acquired access to a weapon, unless such person possessed a valid firearm identification card issued under section 129B and was permitted by law to possess such weapon, and such access results in the personal injury to or the death of any person.

(f) This section shall not apply to the storage or keeping of any firearm, rifle or shotgun with matchlock, flintlock, percussion cap or similar type of ignition system manufactured in or prior to the year 1899, or to any replica of any such firearm, rifle or shotgun if such replica is not designed or redesigned for using rimfire or conventional centerfire fixed ammunition.

You can find it here: http://www.mass.gov/legis/laws/mgl/140-131l.htm

There is nothing in this portion of the law that distinguishes between loaded and unloaded. So if you put your loaded gun in a lock box in your car, what would you be violating?

Now if you left the loaded gun in the lock box when you started driving your car, now I agree that the governing statute would be MGL Ch. 140 S131C and then you might have a problem.

Now, whether or not it is wise to leave a loaded gun in an unattended vehicle is a different matter entirely.

Of course, IANAL, this isn't legal advice, and Scrivener regularly tries to disabuse me of my misinterpretations of MA gun laws...

 

[M1911]

http://www.mass.gov/legis/laws/mgl/140-131c.htm Section c.

Let's look at the text in detail:

Section 131C. (a) No person carrying a loaded firearm under a Class A license issued under section 131 or 131F shall carry the same in a vehicle unless such firearm while carried therein is under the direct control of such person. Whoever violates the provisions of this subsection shall be punished by a fine of $500.

If I park my car, put my loaded handgun in a lockbox in my car, lock the car and walk away, I'm not carrying it. So I don't see how this section applies.

(b) No person carrying a firearm under a Class B license issued under section 131 or 131F shall possess the same in a vehicle unless such weapon is unloaded and contained within the locked trunk of such vehicle or in a locked case or other secure container. Whoever violates the provisions of this subsection shall be punished by a fine of $500.

I've got an LTC Class A, so I don't think this section applies.

(c) No person possessing a large capacity rifle or shotgun under a Class A or Class B license issued under section 131 or 131F shall possess the same in a vehicle unless such weapon is unloaded and contained within the locked trunk of such vehicle or in a locked case or other secure container. Whoever violates the provisions of this subsection shall be punished by a fine of not less than $500 nor more than $5,000.

The gun in question is a handgun, so I don't see how this section applies.

As I said, it may not be wise to leave a gun in a car (whether loaded or unloaded). But it isn't clear to me that it is illegal, as some have alleged. Perhaps Scrivener will join this thread and in his usual gentle way point out my misunderstanding.

 

[M1911]

FYI, most of the Massachusetts gun laws are in Chapter 140 of the Massachusetts General Laws, which are available online. You don't have to remember the link to them -- Google is your friend. Simply put one of the following into google:

mgl ch 140
mgl chapter 140
mass general law chapter 140

For any of those variations, the very first search result is the table of contents for Chapter 140 of the Massachusetts General Laws.

 

[JimR]

FYI, most of the Massachusetts gun laws are in Chapter 140 of the Massachusetts General Laws, which are available online. You don't have to remember the link to them -- Google is your friend. Simply put one of the following into google:

mgl ch 140
mgl chapter 140
mass general law chapter 140

For any of those variations, the very first search result is the table of contents for Chapter 140 of the Massachusetts General Laws.

Thanks for all the links, especially the one to the old posting and all the information after that. I will have to sit down when I get time tonight and rad it ALL. I will pass this onto my PO friend also.

One other note I was told by my Chief of Police is that if you are carrying, your gun had better be loaded. Can anyone shed light on that one? Is it true or False. I read in the other post that is is true.

 

[Cross-X]

Thanks for all the links, especially the one to the old posting and all the information after that. I will have to sit down when I get time tonight and rad it ALL. I will pass this onto my PO friend also.

One other note I was told by my Chief of Police is that if you are carrying, your gun had better be loaded. Can anyone shed light on that one? Is it true or False. I read in the other post that is is true.

An unloaded gun is just a very heavy paperweight.

 

[M1911]

One other note I was told by my Chief of Police is that if you are carrying, your gun had better be loaded. Can anyone shed light on that one? Is it true or False. I read in the other post that is is true.

I wonder if the Chief is talking about recommendation versus statute here. I'd argue that it is pretty foolish to carry an unloaded gun on your person, but I don't see anything illegal about it. Ch. 140 S131 is the section that describes LTC. You can find the full text here:

http://www.mass.gov/legis/laws/mgl/140-131.htm

The only place where it discusses concealed carry is to state that you can't carry concealed on an LTC B:

...provided, however, that a Class B license shall not entitle the holder thereof to carry or possess a loaded firearm in a concealed manner in any public way or place; ...

Note that where it describes an LTC Class A, it says you can carry but does not say anything about loaded or unloaded:

(a) A Class A license shall entitle a holder thereof to purchase, rent, lease, borrow, possess and carry: (i) firearms, including large capacity firearms, and feeding devices and ammunition therefor, for all lawful purposes, subject to such restrictions...

The section on carrying in a vehicle (MGL ch 140 s131c) says that if you are carrying it loaded under an LTC A, that it must be under your control.

Section 131C. (a) No person carrying a loaded firearm under a Class A license issued under section 131 or 131F shall carry the same in a vehicle unless such firearm while carried therein is under the direct control of such person. Whoever violates the provisions of this subsection shall be punished by a fine of $500.

But I don't see any prohibition in that section that would prevent an LTC Class A licensee from carrying concealed an unloaded handgun. I think it would be foolish to do so, but that's a different matter entirely.

Note, however, that if a chief finds you doing something he doesn't like, he can revoke your LTC, deeming you to be "unsuitable." But that doesn't have anything to do with doing something illegal.

 

[JimR]

1911 wrote:
(a) A Class A license shall entitle a holder thereof to purchase, rent, lease, borrow, possess and carry: (i) firearms, including large capacity firearms, and feeding devices and ammunition therefor, for all lawful purposes, subject to such restrictions relative to the possession, use or carrying of firearms as the licensing authority deems proper;

I would like to touch on one part of this law as stated above. It is a scary thought too.

According to this Chapter 140. Your Chief LEO can do whatever he pleases to the type of restrictions he can invoke on your gun permit because there is no defined letter of the law stating what type of restriction can be placed on any licensed individual. This in turn leaves this option open to his discretion. Am I correct in stating this?

If so, them he could in fact give you a LTC Class A permit with these following restrictions.

(1) Your handgun(s) shall not be carried by you at any time outside of a fully licensed Gun Club/Shooting Range.

(2) This Gun Club/Shooting Range must have a fully licensed individual on hand at all time of operation.

(3) That your handgun(s) be stored at said Gun Club/Shooting Range at all times when you are not using it in a locked storage compartment under supervision of said club.

Scary thought isn't it?

 

[M1911]

JimR:

I have never seen any such restrictions as the ones that you suggest. I have seen them restricted to "Hunting and Target", "Hunting and Sporting", "Employment", etc. But nothing along the lines of what you have suggested. That doesn't mean it isn't possible, of course...

 

[JimR]

JimR:

I have never seen any such restrictions as the ones that you suggest. I have seen them restricted to "Hunting and Target", "Hunting and Sporting", "Employment", etc. But nothing along the lines of what you have suggested. That doesn't mean it isn't possible, of course...

I never heard of any either. It would be very easy to insert in that space "Per LEO Letter" The law states that it is to the restrictions, etc, etc, etc as per the licensing authority deems proper. To me this leaves it wide open as to anything they want to do to you as far as restrictions go. This is not good.

 

[M1911]

This is not good.

That's my opinion of just about all of MA gun laws. Of course, that (and $3.50) will get me a Granda Mocha Latte.

 

[JimR]

That's my opinion of just about all of MA gun laws. Of course, that (and $3.50) will get me a Granda Mocha Latte.

LOL I'd move the hell out of here if I could talk my wife into it. I'm destined to stay here for many more years. I just wish we could get some smart people in Government and change these stupid laws. Way too many people lost their licenses because of bar brawls and other minor infractions. It is truly a shame. I won't even get into the towns/cities that have Anti gun police chiefs. Although I did hear that there is a gun friendly mayor coming to Quincy very shortly. Seems that he is not too happy about the police chief there and his refusal to give out gun permits.

 

[csharpdev]

My license also says "Restrictions:" but luckily I'm only restricted to "All Lawful Purposes". I guess that means I can't break the law...

 

[kevin9]

I'll advocate otherwise. If your car is locked, unattended, then I suspect the appropriate statute would be that concerning storage, not transport.

If I park my car, put my loaded handgun in a lockbox in my car, lock the car and walk away, I'm not carrying it. So I don't see how this section applies.

I would suggest that because it's still in a vehicle C140 S131C still applies, not 131L. There is nothing in the 131C that says that the vehicle has to be moving, or that you have to be in it. You can argue the definition of "carrying" but given 131Cc also uses the term "carrying" with regard to Class B licenses I think the definition of "carrying" here is more properly defined as "has in". It seems obvious to me that the simplest explanation (Occam's Razor?) applies, that if it's in a vehicle then that is "transporting" not "storing" (TATITL).

Perhaps Scrivener will join this thread and in his usual gentle way point out my misunderstanding.

I do agree that the law is not exactly clear to us laymen here. I too would like to know, particularly if there is case law that has clarified this (or not).

 

[JimR]

I would suggest that because it's still in a vehicle C140 S131C still applies, not 131L. There is nothing in the 131C that says that the vehicle has to be moving, or that you have to be in it. You can argue the definition of "carrying" but given 131Cc also uses the term "carrying" with regard to Class B licenses I think the definition of "carrying" here is more properly defined as "has in". It seems obvious to me that the simplest explanation (Occam's Razor?) applies, that if it's in a vehicle then that is "transporting" not "storing" (TATITL).

I do agree that the law is not exactly clear to us laymen here. I too would like to know, particularly if there is case law that has clarified this (or not).

Has anyone read the complete two volume books on the Ma. Firearm Laws? I started to. It is very confusing to us laymen

 

[M1911]

TATITL?

It seems obvious to me that the simplest explanation (Occam's Razor?)

Sorry, but I have to disagree with this. Law has nothing to do with simplicity and the "obvious" interpretation is quite often incorrect. For example, (as you are probably aware), the word "firearm" in most MA gun laws generally means a handgun.

I would suggest that because it's still in a vehicle C140 S131C still applies, not 131L. There is nothing in the 131C that says that the vehicle has to be moving, or that you have to be in it.

Sorry, but I disagree. If the gun is in your car and you are not, then you are not carrying them.

Consider, for example, the non-large capacity long guns. You can transport such guns in your vehicle and they do not have to be locked up while they are being transported (131c para a and b pertain to handguns, para c pertains to large capacity long guns).

In contrast, all guns must be locked up when stored according to Section 131L. If guns in your car were being "carried" when unattended, then you could leave non-large capacity long guns in your car not locked up.

Searching through the archives, I came upon a post by Cross-X, which seems to indirectly support your position:

Yes, you have got it exactly right. In Massachusetts, if you are going to leave a firearm in your car or truck, you have to put your unloaded firearm (by firearm I mean a handgun) in your choice of a locked in the trunk OR locked in a case OR locked in some other secure container.

http://www.northeastshooters.com/vbulletin/archive/index.php?t-1111.html

That is a paraphrase of the language in 131C. I don't understand his logic, but then there's a lot about laws that I don't understand...

 

[JimR]

TATITL?
Consider, for example, the non-large capacity long guns. You can transport such guns in your vehicle and they do not have to be locked up while they are being transported (131c para a and b pertain to handguns, para c pertains to large capacity long guns).

Fish and Game says that all rifles and shotguns in a vehicle must be unloaded and in a case.

 

[ateamrob]

Fish and Game says that all rifles and shotguns in a vehicle must be unloaded and in a case.

well that cant be.... the homies guns are locked and loaded while in the vehicle.....

 

[JimR]

well that cant be.... the homies guns are locked and loaded while in the vehicle.....

How would you know this? You live out in the safe part of the state.

 

[peterpressure]

As I said, it may not be wise to leave a gun in a car (whether loaded or unloaded). But it isn't clear to me that it is illegal, as some have alleged. Perhaps Scrivener will join this thread and in his usual gentle way point out my misunderstanding.

When I discussed this with a Lawyer, he sort of echoed your sentiments, while maybe not illegal, you'll def lose ur LTC...

 

[JimR]

When I discussed this with a Lawyer, he sort of echoed your sentiments, while maybe not illegal, you'll def lose ur LTC...

As I read the Chapter 140 law. It states that your LTC and restrictions are at the disgression of your local Police. So it only makes sense that they are the ones to decide as to wether or not what you do makes you fit to have a LTC even after the fact of you receiving it. So even if something you do is legal. They may decide it is not as far as they are concerned and you are a risk to have a LTC. This is not good.

 

[pdm]

Ahh the joys of discretionary licensing: 351 separate interpretations of a law crafted by the finest minds on Beacon Hill.

 

[JimR]

Ahh the joys of discretionary licensing: 351 separate interpretations of a law crafted by the finest minds on Beacon Hill.

Not a one of them carrying one ounce of shot for brains.

 

[M1911]

I'm looking at Ron Glidden's "Law Enforcement Guide to Firearms Law". The only copy I have is old (4th Ed., 2002). He addresses this on pgs 72 and 73 in his commentary.

8. Firearms Unattended in a MV: This is the same section which previously prohibited leaving a "firearm" unattended in a motor vehicle. This section was rewritten as part of chapter 180 of the Acts of 1998 and no longer states that firearms must always be under the control of the owner. Therefore, as long as a person meets the current provisions of this section (unloaded and in a locked trunk or locked case unless otherwise exempted) he can continue to leave them in that locked trunk or case even if he leaves the vehicle. For non large capacity rifles and shotguns that are not required normally to be in a locked case under this section, extra measures should be considered when leaving them in a locked vehicle. As such guns might be considered to be stored or kept for the purposes of section 131L, it may be appropriate to lock such rifles and shotguns in a locked case. In doing so such unattended storage in a motor vehicle would still be in compliance with the safe storage requirements of section 131L. Finally, it is suggested that all vehicles to be left unattended with firearms, rifles or shotguns inside should have its doors locked for added security.

It seems to me that Chief Glidden is basically saying there is some uncertainty in the statute that needs to be sorted out by case law, and possibly both 131C and 131L apply.

He goes on to say:

Carrying in a Vehicle versus Storing or Keeping. This section specifically refers to carrying in a motor vehicle. Therefore, anytime firearms, rifles or shotguns are in the vehicle they must so be stored in compliance with the provisions of this section. Some would argue that section 131L would apply if the vehicle was parked and unoccupied. That is a possibility that has yet to be determined by case law. Section 131L currently requires that all firearms, rifles and shotguns that are stored or kept be secured in a locked container or equipped with a tamper-resistant mechanical lock or other safety device. Legal Counsel for the Executive Office of Public Safety and the Massachusetts State Police have stated their beliefs on this issue which include (a) Whenever a gun of any kind is in a vehicle, section 131C should apply exclusively; (b) if Section 131L does apply to a parked unoccupied vehicle, any gun in a "locked" vehicle would be secured in a locked container as secure as many containers in a home; and (c) if a person is in compliance with the provisions of 131C for firearms and large capacity rifles and shotguns, he is automatically in compliance with 131L because the weapons would already be in a locked case or locked trunk. As such, the only concern would be the non-large capacity rifles or shotguns that were not required to be locked pursuant to 131C. Owners may want to consider locking those weapons either in a case or with a trigger lock for the purposes of complying with 131L if they plan to leave such non-large capacity rifles or shotguns in their (locked) unoccupied vehicles.

This comment seems to reiterate that there is some grey area in the law concerning this issue that must be addressed by case law, and probably already has been. If EOPs lawyers are correct that 131C is governing, then that would prohibit leaving a loaded handgun in an unattended vehicle due to paragraph a (loaded handgun must be under your direct control when carried in a vehicle).

Does anyone have an updated version of Chief Glidden's book? If so, does he address this differently now?