Divorce

[Buck F]

True, but not enough find out like my examples below did!
They really find out once a man starts to play games with child support or they need something fixed around the house they stole! It doesn't take long for them to sell the house they stole and move into a condo with fees they just barely can afford to pay for.
I knew of a guy who kept changing jobs every six months. Each new job paid less than the previous. His kids still HAD ALL THEY NEEDED and she had nothing! The judge kept reducing his payment each and every time he appealed the monthly amount. Once child support was over, he got a job in his original profession again, the kids never suffered, and he lived happily ever after!
Another guy I knew ended up receiving alimony from his ex wife who was an ICU nurse. She paid for his brand new, fully loaded Dodge 4x4 P/U and he proudly let her know it!

Would the wife have “stolen” the house if it was their house? Assets get split in half, if the wife ends up w the house then she likely had to buy his half of the equity out which could have been offset by him keeping other joint assets such as retirement, etc. They don’t just “give” the wife the house.

His kids HAD ALL THEY NEEDED? According to who? Some asshat that purposely takes lower paying jobs to avoid child support? Sounds like a real prize and an awesome dad . He got lucky, judges usually smell that shit a mile away. If you’re a doctor and quit your job to go work at McDonald’s, the judge will generally require the amount of support based on what you are capable of/should be making, not what you decide to make.

I know a guy who did that, basically didn’t work/worked lower jobs under the table so he didn’t have to pay child support. In the end, he’s in his early 50’s w no assets, gave up over a decade of income and of course even if he was going to go back to work it’s be at a fraction of what he could be making. And his son got killed in a car accident a month ago thinking/knowing his dad was a loser.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

Would the wife have “stolen” the house if it was their house? Assets get split in half, if the wife ends up w the house then she likely had to buy his half of the equity out which could have been offset by him keeping other joint assets such as retirement, etc. They don’t just “give” the wife the house.

Sometimes the woman gets full use of the house, 50% equity, and an obligation to sell it when the kids reach a certain age and split the proceeds with the former spouse.

 

[Buck F]

Sometimes the woman gets full use of the house, 50% equity, and an obligation to sell it when the kids reach a certain age and split the proceeds with the former spouse.

Yes, sometimes. That doesn’t equate to stealing anything. And that only works if they have enough equity/other assets to make it work.

I guess my beef is with all the “stealing” talk. If it’s the home they had children in it’s their home, a joint asset. It gets split. Both can’t live there.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

Yes, sometimes. That doesn’t equate to stealing anything. And that only works if they have enough equity/other assets to make it work.

I guess my beef is with all the “stealing” talk. If it’s the home they had children in it’s their home, a joint asset. It gets split. Both can’t live there.

But, the party if the first part not in possession does not get a credit for half of the rental value of the property when solely possessed by the party of the second part. Single family houses on my street or half duplexes rent for $3K/month+ so that value is not insubstantial - especially when the party of the first part has to pay rent while that person's half of the asset provides rent free housing to the party of the second part.

 

[Buck F]

But, the party if the first part not in possession does not get a credit for half of the rental value of the property when solely possessed by the party of the second part. Single family houses on my street or half duplexes rent for $3K/month+ so that value is not insubstantial - especially when the party of the first part has to pay rent while that person's half of the asset provides rent free housing to the party of the second part.

That’s a big if. I would submit that your scenario is the exception rather than the rule and it’s still not stealing anything. Aside from lawyers and accountants we probably deal w divorces more than most professions. And having been through one, having been in long term relationships w a couple of divorced women and having many friends/clients that have been through it, most of what I see is a split of the assets where one buys out the others half (one way or the other). Or they end up having to sell the house if there isn’t enough equity or assets to make it work.

I’m not saying that guys don’t get the short end of the stick, but it’s not always that way and doesn’t usually have to be. Most of the people I know (men and women), who proclaim to be the just ones in the divorce, aren’t. It always takes two.

 

[LTCRN]

Would the wife have “stolen” the house if it was their house? Assets get split in half, if the wife ends up w the house then she likely had to buy his half of the equity out which could have been offset by him keeping other joint assets such as retirement, etc. They don’t just “give” the wife the house.

His kids HAD ALL THEY NEEDED? According to who? Some asshat that purposely takes lower paying jobs to avoid child support? Sounds like a real prize and an awesome dad . He got lucky, judges usually smell that shit a mile away. If you’re a doctor and quit your job to go work at McDonald’s, the judge will generally require the amount of support based on what you are capable of/should be making, not what you decide to make.

I know a guy who did that, basically didn’t work/worked lower jobs under the table so he didn’t have to pay child support. In the end, he’s in his early 50’s w no assets, gave up over a decade of income and of course even if he was going to go back to work it’s be at a fraction of what he could be making. And his son got killed in a car accident a month ago thinking/knowing his dad was a loser.

I guess not knowing all the answers of the true outcome could go either way. I only typed what I was told and when I hear something like this, I just listen. Nest time, I guess I should get fully involved in the drama and horror of love and war so I can report all of the details more accurately to prevent someone from second guessing what I document.

 

[SFC13557]

is she going for alimony?

 

[Buck F]

I guess not knowing all the answers of the true outcome could go either way. I only typed what I was told and when I hear something like this, I just listen. Nest time, I guess I should get fully involved in the drama and horror of love and war so I can report all of the details more accurately to prevent someone from second guessing what I document.

You don’t have to get fully involved to understand that you’re hearing one side of a story, one that is very emotionally charged and never as simple as one side lays out. Telling a story you heard is hardly documenting something.

 

[Lank]

this is a total out yourself thread

 

[upcountry]

In my case, back in the '90's, my ex wanted half my pension. I gave her the house instead and she was OK with that.
We each had a lawyer as consultants as we were using a mediator. Lawyers OKed it at each end, we agreed, went to court and the judge asked if we were in agreement. We said "yes" he said "OK" we left court and went to our jobs.
I paid child support ($1 child support, $1 taxes, $1 for me), shared college expenses and I'm remarried to a wonderful woman and we're living well.

 

[BigDaddy-Oh]

Thank you for your service, Sorry for you pain. I cannot speak to any legal stuff. I went through a divorce 35+ years ago but we used Hyatt Legal Services in California. Basically they filed the paperwork. We split everything pretty much 50/50. No Kids, just a condo . . . split $26K when it sold and it bankrolled the start of my gun collection. We were very young.

My only advice is talk it out with a friend (or someone impartial) if you find it starts getting you down. I have a friend who is going through an ugly divorce ( I do not know the wife) and we talk a lot.

 

[Hold_The_Mayo]

That’s a big if. I would submit that your scenario is the exception rather than the rule and it’s still not stealing anything. Aside from lawyers and accountants we probably deal w divorces more than most professions. And having been through one, having been in long term relationships w a couple of divorced women and having many friends/clients that have been through it, most of what I see is a split of the assets where one buys out the others half (one way or the other). Or they end up having to sell the house if there isn’t enough equity or assets to make it work.

I’m not saying that guys don’t get the short end of the stick, but it’s not always that way and doesn’t usually have to be. Most of the people I know (men and women), who proclaim to be the just ones in the divorce, aren’t. It always takes two.

Yup. The “stealing” language is not accurate to what actually happens. All marital assets are listed on forms and the value/equity is split 50/50. One party only keeps the house if the assets work out in a way to buy out the equity of the other person (up front, or if by agreement, delayed). It could be retirement money vs house (in which case I suggest take/keep retirement money and sell the house).

My unpopular opinion is probably not welcome, but here it is anyways. I definitely did not make out in my divorce. Not even close. We had started the marriage fairly close to equal from an asset perspective. Now post divorce, I’m still continuing to fund lawyers as the ex seems to prefer paying his attorney over splitting kid related costs (which he ends up having to contribute to anyways).

As for women initiating divorces to fleece their husbands? While I technically filed the divorce papers first in court, he moved out (unplanned), took most of his things, drafted some sort of separation agreement, and consulted lawyers; all before I took that step. Doesn’t seem like someone who wanted to work it out.

 

[Cowgirlup]

As for women initiating divorces to fleece their husbands? While I technically filed the divorce papers first in court, he moved out (unplanned), took most of his things, drafted some sort of separation agreement, and consulted lawyers; all before I took that step. Doesn’t seem like someone who wanted to work it out.

Similar here. Ex announced one day that he didn't want to be married. No reason. Nothing personal. Then he went back and forth on it for a year.
The last time he said he was leaving I stopped trying to make it work. Got boxes and started packing for him. I hired and paid for the attorney to make sure everything was legal. I didn't even find out he had a GF until after it was over. She filed on her husband so she and my ex could hook up.

This is a predominantly guys forum so you're going to have more guys with bad experiences. On a mostly ladies forum it would be a bunch of women with bad experiences. Nearly every woman I know who filed on their spouse did so due to infidelity or abuse. Women just do not put up with that like they did in past generations. And no. none of that is exclusive to women. Men can be in abusive relationships and women also cheat.
I worked with a bunch of gay people at a side job. The amount of cheating was off the charts so anyone who switched teams thinking things would be better were in for a surprise.

Let's face it. There are just a lot of lousy, nasty, selfish people on the planet. It takes a lot of work to sift through all that to find decent people to have in your life.

 

[ThePreBanMan]

Best idea I've read here is sell them to a friend you trust until the dust settles. That may still cost some loot if you can't eFA-10 them all and dealer transfers are involved. But, you'll get them back.
In the grand scheme of things guns are pretty insignificant in value.

Aside from the assets being split 50/50 I believe so with the debts. Put all those transfers on a credit card, make her pay half of what you inquire to keep them out of her reach...

Reading threads like this make me glad I decided long ago that I was never getting married or having children.

I do not regret that decision. Although my girlfriend of 20 years wishes it for otherwise, there ain't never going to be a ring on it..

I'm a big earner, she makes small potatoes. I have no interest in assuming such liabilities. With no common law marriage in Massachusetts, what's mine is mine, and what's hers is hers. I've got a ton of money in my retirement accounts too. There's no way I put that on the table. F*** that noise.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

Yup. The “stealing” language is not accurate to what actually happens. All marital assets are listed on forms as are the assets of the parties parents and their estate planning documents and history of parental wills if requested by either party and the value/equity is split 50/50. One party only keeps the house if the assets work out in a way to buy out the equity of the other person (up front, or if by agreement, delayed). It could be retirement money vs house (in which case I suggest take/keep retirement money and sell the house).

FIFY (MA specific comment). MA courts consider expected future inheritances when deciding "equitable".

 

[Hold_The_Mayo]

FIFY (MA specific comment). MA courts consider expected future inheritances when deciding "equitable".

Can’t speak to that generally, but our parents were kept out of the financial documents and it was never raised.

 

[SgtHal75]

Yup. The “stealing” language is not accurate to what actually happens. All marital assets are listed on forms and the value/equity is split 50/50. One party only keeps the house if the assets work out in a way to buy out the equity of the other person (up front, or if by agreement, delayed). It could be retirement money vs house (in which case I suggest take/keep retirement money and sell the house).

My unpopular opinion is probably not welcome, but here it is anyways. I definitely did not make out in my divorce. Not even close. We had started the marriage fairly close to equal from an asset perspective. Now post divorce, I’m still continuing to fund lawyers as the ex seems to prefer paying his attorney over splitting kid related costs (which he ends up having to contribute to anyways).

As for women initiating divorces to fleece their husbands? While I technically filed the divorce papers first in court, he moved out (unplanned), took most of his things, drafted some sort of separation agreement, and consulted lawyers; all before I took that step. Doesn’t seem like someone who wanted to work it out.

I would make him pay my legal costs every time he took me to court. If he’s being difficult I’m sure the judge would side with you and then he would cut the crap. Shouldn’t the decree state all these kids costs?

 

[SgtHal75]

Similar here. Ex announced one day that he didn't want to be married. No reason. Nothing personal. Then he went back and forth on it for a year.
The last time he said he was leaving I stopped trying to make it work. Got boxes and started packing for him. I hired and paid for the attorney to make sure everything was legal. I didn't even find out he had a GF until after it was over. She filed on her husband so she and my ex could hook up.

This is a predominantly guys forum so you're going to have more guys with bad experiences. On a mostly ladies forum it would be a bunch of women with bad experiences. Nearly every woman I know who filed on their spouse did so due to infidelity or abuse. Women just do not put up with that like they did in past generations. And no. none of that is exclusive to women. Men can be in abusive relationships and women also cheat.
I worked with a bunch of gay people at a side job. The amount of cheating was off the charts so anyone who switched teams thinking things would be better were in for a surprise.

Let's face it. There are just a lot of lousy, nasty, selfish people on the planet. It takes a lot of work to sift through all that to find decent people to have in your life.

Perfectly said. Your ex sounds like mine

 

[SgtHal75]

FIFY (MA specific comment). MA courts consider expected future inheritances when deciding "equitable".

Yup, helps me out huge

 

[Buck F]

Can’t speak to that generally, but our parents were kept out of the financial documents and it was never raised.

Same in my case. Have never heard about the parents being involved in the divorcing kids financials although if there's an imminent inheritance I imagine it could be brought up in isolated cases. It certainly isn't the norm where you have to provide the parents financials during a divorce.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

Same in my case. Have never heard about the parents being involved in the divorcing kids financials although if there's an imminent inheritance I imagine it could be brought up in isolated cases. It certainly isn't the norm where you have to provide the parents financials during a divorce.

It is common when one party knows the other party's parents are loaded. Any divorce MA divorce attorney who does not inquire about this issue and is not very familiar with the concept of a Vaughn declaration is incompetent. And yes, the courts have compelled parents to produce this info (even when they reside out of MA)

 

[weekendracer]

Or spend your money up front for a good lawyer and get a bullet proof prenump.

The only people I've ever heard say prenups are bulletproof are the lawyers who write them.

 

[ThePreBanMan]

The best prenup is just not to nup at all.... I honestly don't understand the appeal of getting married these days... There's a greater than 50% chance it won't work out and you'll lose half your shit. The wedding costs a bunch of loot. Then you get the privilege of paying the marriage penalty tax. You really get screwed if one works in the private sector and the other in the public. The public sector pension will result in deductions from the social security benefits of the private sector worker.

Why TF would anyone sign up for this???

 

[Lank]

FIFY (MA specific comment). MA courts consider expected future inheritances when deciding "equitable".

That is f$(king criminal.

It's the same as Joe Biden croaking own about 3.5 T spending sprees are paid for

 

[FPrice]

FIFY (MA specific comment). MA courts consider expected future inheritances when deciding "equitable".

How would the court know about expected future inheritances?

How would they react to a parent telling them to go pound sand because they (the parents) are not involved?

 

[Rob Boudrie]

How would the court know about expected future inheritances?

How would they react to a parent telling them to go pound sand because they (the parents) are not involved?

Google "Vaughn Declaration". It is a MA court order, enforceable in other states (tested in NY) that compels parents and/or grandparents of a party to a divorce to provide a sworn financial statement listing all their assets as well as copies of their estate planning documents and history of changes (so recent changes to hide the pre-inheritance can be ignored).

 

[Lank]

Google "Vaughn Declaration". It is a MA court order, enforceable in other states (tested in NY) that compels parents and/or grandparents of a party to a divorce to provide a sworn financial statement listing all their assets as well as copies of their estate planning documents and history of changes (so recent changes to hide the pre-inheritance can be ignored).

More evidence the state thinks all money is theirs and subject to their control.

That law must be overturned....I know fat chance

 

[AHM]

went through this, and had the dick head from village vault come and tell me current value for him buying the lot. his number was laughable, but he provided documentation so i could list them on my financial statement. good luck

Beats the hell out of epic NES advice such as
"'Sell' most of your guns, but leave a few token guns behind.
(That way, if your wife jacks you up on Assault with a Deadly Weapon,
you can get charged with a few token felonies)".

Here's an object lesson (or two) about valuation of physical possessions during divorce.

I'm grateful to learn at an early age that PEOPLE CHANGE. The person you married 20 years ago may not be the same person that you're still tied with. I cannot take that chance.

I personally LOLed -
since it's coming from the one NESer that I know can
legitimately ask, "does this rag smell like chloroform?".

You can never predict that after a woman has kids she hits the wall between 35 and 40 years old, renounces her Christianity, abuses anti-depressants and starts practicing witchcraft.

I know a guy (with two kids) whose wife dumped him
because she got saved but he wouldn't lay off the Dungeons and Dragons.
(Well, that's his story and the last I heard, he's stuck to it).

Another statistic is 90% of the women that get a college degree after they are married file for divorce.

A late cousin's wife pulled that on him when their four kids were in their teens,
only she did it while she was still in community college going for her midlife degree.

His ex- never did me any dirt, but when my cousin called my mother (his aunt) to break the news,
she said he used words she'd never heard before.

If you want to get a marriage license I think it should be a state requirement that you watch divorce corp. f*** that Pre-Cana nonsense.

We signed up for the One Weekend And Done plan.
(And when it was over we made a beeline for the closest Ground Round).

The Bride made a big splash with all the other grooms
who wanted her cookie recipe.

But times change...

Strong independent women do not need nor want spousal support.

So, any plans this weekend?

You are damaged.

Lol! That's what everyone who doesn't want to believe the truth says. ...

Who hurt u!!!!

Pro-tip: don't ask @Fishfinder to show you the place on the Wolfman doll...

Google "Vaughn Declaration" for see how deep the screw turns.

(LTFY).
That web search does not deliver.

You've sketched out the meaning further down the thread.
But if you really want to scare people,
it'd be more effective if you linked to
some definitive article that's on-point.

Yes, sometimes. That doesn’t equate to stealing anything. And that only works if they have enough equity/other assets to make it work.

I guess my beef is with all the “stealing” talk. If it’s the home they had children in it’s their home, a joint asset. It gets split. Both can’t live there.

Near as I can tell, I know someone who lives in
something like a mother-in-law bedroom at her ex's house.
Because they have family obligations and besides they can not afford to live apart.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

hat web search does not deliver.

You've sketched out the meaning further down the thread.
But if you really want to scare people,
it'd be more effective if you linked to
some definitive article that's on-point.

My fault for using the incorrect term "Vaughn Declaration" instead of "Vaught Affadavit"

What is a Vaughan Affidavit?

Divorcing couples may want to know if their soon to be ex-spouse will be the beneficiary of an inheritance post divorce. In Massachusetts, unlike almost any other state, the Judge, when determining the division of the estates of two divorcing parties, must take into consideration “the opport...

blog.mass.gov

Privacy in Estate Planning and the Vaughan Affidavit | JD Supra

People typically have several goals in mind when they are looking to create or tweak an estate plan, and important to some may be the desire for...

www.jdsupra.com

How Massachusetts Courts Treat Future Inheritances and Expectancy Interests in Divorce Cases

Massachusetts divorce lawyer Nicole K. Levy reviews the treatment of future inheritance and unvested expectancy interests in Massachusetts divorce cases.

www.lynchowens.com

 

[TheGreekFreak]

Sorry OP, that really sucks. If firearms are the only thing you think you'll have to worry about sorting out, consider yourself lucky.

Make no mistake, regardless what anyone says, you are in a war. Hope you get lucky and things remain civil enough where you only have to meet her in the DMZ at the end to sign a reasonable ass paddling agreement.......because if enough birdies get into her ear or she wakes up on the wrong side of the bed remembering you as Ike Turner all of a sudden, you're in for a painful process.

I was young when my uncle went through a nasty divorce....it was horrifying. Even worse was a few years prior, when things were starting to get past the point of no return, my dad forced him to at least meet with a good divorce attorney to have a plan before she smartened up herself. Attorney had outlined some plan to help him keep his house, protect assets, etc.. He wouldn't go through with it, was too naive and felt it was immoral to do behind her back.

SUPRISE, a few years later she lawyers the hell up, moves in with the boyfriend from an affair, and comes after EVERYTHING......result for innocent uncle who thought integrity still exists: an absolute rectal massacre.

Wishing you the best, just hope you don't take anything lightly or underestimate her until this shit is really final with the ink dried on paper.