Coonan firearms fiasco

KBCraig said:
Humans are the weak links, as always.

That sounds great, but then remember that some human has to actually key or post the updates. This is a small manufacturer where the parts sit in a box on a bench, not a large industry where everything is bar-coded and scanned and tracked at every stage.

From the Army, through a .gov career, to private employment, one thing that I've always found true is that the more record keeping you demand, the more pencil-whipping you will get.
Click to expand...
I totally agree with what you're saying. Humans are the weak link in any system of this sort.

I grew up in a small manufacturing plant, making things of little consequence, and we knew where every project was in the queue. Considering the legal penalties associated with a frame showing up in the wild that's unaccounted for, or for complete but unnumbered frames during an inspection by the ATF, it's not unreasonable to assume that they have production travelers that are at least as thorough as ours were, and a bound book of all their created serial numbers. Someone is in charge of knowing where they are at all times; their life would be made easier by putting it in a computer (with off-site, redundant backups).

There are certain milestones that are really easy to track for, even in a mom and pop facility. At minimum, I'd expect four: frame serialized, in production, final function test complete, shipping. If they kept these in the computer, it could be available to customer service/receptionist, and similarly to a pretty simple order tracking website.

I feel for Coonan right now; they're in a tough spot. I also feel for their customers (of which we seem to have at least three in this thread) who are completely in the dark. A very simple production tool could help everybody feel more comfortable with the process, and obviate this thread. Even if the message was "still waiting on frames from foundry," I'd bet that most customers would find it preferable to the silence they're getting now.
 
Mesatchornug said:
I feel for Coonan right now; they're in a tough spot. I also feel for their customers (of which we seem to have at least three in this thread) who are completely in the dark. A very simple production tool could help everybody feel more comfortable with the process, and obviate this thread. Even if the message was "still waiting on frames from foundry," I'd bet that most customers would find it preferable to the silence they're getting now.
Click to expand...
Yep!
 
mike.b said:
Andrew, I'm in the same boat you are. I ordered a 45 back in early July and have not heard anything. I actually had an issue with my Coonan 357 and emailed there tech support. After a week, when I did not get a response, I called and got no answer, I left a message and then no response again. That's when I found out things are not normal. About two weeks ago I ordered a recoil spring for my 357 because I needed one but also to see if it would get shipped. My credit card has been charged and the order is still showing "in process." I did call Capital one and filed a claim and they actually refunded my money. I'm not sure if this is temporary while they conduct their investigation but I have a feeling when they get no response from Coonan like all of us, it will be permanent. I'm bummed because I really liked my Coonan but the way they have been treating their customers, I cant trust them.
Click to expand...
Oh man another coonan customer left in the dark. I had issues with my 357 on multiple occasions but at the time (back in February) they were actually answering the phone and responding to emails so I got it resolved quickly. This is the other big problem - customers who have a gun that might need servicing. Can't accomplish much if you don't respond to your customers....

Also regarding recoil springs. I bought my coonan springs from Wolff. Just use the conventional Colt 1911 .45 recoil springs and select which weight you want. I believe the factory 357 coonan spring is 22 pounds
https://www.gunsprings.com/COLT/1911 GOV'T PISTOL/cID1/mID1/dID1#3

That's great that capitalone refunded you the money. And ya if my CC company (BOA) doesn't get a response from Coonan I'm not sure if they automatically refund me the money or say "hey we tried but you're on your own now"?

Ya I really enjoyed shooting my Coonan. I must have shot 4k plus rounds through it and never had any FTE's. Always grabbed lots of attention at the range.
 
Last edited:
Users are the nemesis of software systems. Without users we'd write perfect software every time!

:)

KBCraig said:
Humans are the weak links, as always.

That sounds great, but then remember that some human has to actually key or post the updates. This is a small manufacturer where the parts sit in a box on a bench, not a large industry where everything is bar-coded and scanned and tracked at every stage.

From the Army, through a .gov career, to private employment, one thing that I've always found true is that the more record keeping you demand, the more pencil-whipping you will get.
Click to expand...
 
Mesatchornug said:
......................

I feel for Coonan right now; they're in a tough spot. I also feel for their customers (of which we seem to have at least three in this thread) who are completely in the dark. A very simple production tool could help everybody feel more comfortable with the process, and obviate this thread. Even if the message was "still waiting on frames from foundry," I'd bet that most customers would find it preferable to the silence they're getting now.
Click to expand...

Why do you "feel"for them? They are in a spot they put themselves into. It's poor money management, poor business management.
They are taking monies for firearms they are not delivering on and are apparently still taking orders.

No contact with customers is a sign of a company in trouble. It's not all that difficult to:
1: send an email blast.
2: post something on their website.
3: post on Facebook.
4: put a message on their phone voicemail.
 
I have represented contractors who do what Coonan appears to do. They take fees for jobs that they then use to buy materials on pending jobs that's they've already been paid for and spent the money. It becomes a glorified pyramid scheme which collapses when someone get's injured or a spouse complains that they need a trip to Hawaii. Coonan is making guns using old client's money and selling them at a profit to dealers. At some point they have to bite the bullet and make good on the prepaid clients or it collapses.
 
dhuze said:
Why do you "feel"for them? They are in a spot they put themselves into. It's poor money management, poor business management.
Click to expand...
You're completely right. That's why I didn't say everyone should forgive and forget. This behavior absolutely should affect the decisions of current and potential customers.

At the same time, my experience with small businesses is that many are run by folks who are passionate about their product or service, not about running a business. When they get in a bind they get overwhelmed and make questionable decisions. Then their ego makes them double down rather than admitting they need help.

So yeah, I feel for folks who I doubt are malicious but are in a bad position, and hope that they figure out how to correct it for everyone before they sink themselves. Because I think that collapse is the worst thing for everyone - a fraud sentence doesn't deliver guns; and while it might return their money, that's not what they were looking for.
 
dhuze said:
Why do you "feel"for them? They are in a spot they put themselves into. It's poor money management, poor business management.
They are taking monies for firearms they are not delivering on and are apparently still taking orders.

No contact with customers is a sign of a company in trouble. It's not all that difficult to:
1: send an email blast.
2: post something on their website.
3: post on Facebook.
4: put a message on their phone voicemail.
Click to expand...
Yep. Very easy to contact customers nowadays. No excuse.
 
nstassel said:
I have represented contractors who do what Coonan appears to do. They take fees for jobs that they then use to buy materials on pending jobs that's they've already been paid for and spent the money. It becomes a glorified pyramid scheme which collapses when someone get's injured or a spouse complains that they need a trip to Hawaii. Coonan is making guns using old client's money and selling them at a profit to dealers. At some point they have to bite the bullet and make good on the prepaid clients or it collapses.
Click to expand...
Well said Neil. Never thought I’d be involved in a glorified pyramid scheme lol.

I heard back from another guy who’s in the same boat BUT contacted his AG in Ohio:
“Well got another email from AG in Ohio, I was assigned a case worker and have to forward my receipt and any other correspondence with coonan to her”

Imagine if I tried to contact dimples??! HAH
 
OP I hope all turns out good in the end. If not, let's go shooting some time on my dime.
 
Got another notice from BOA. They're requesting additional documents and had me sign/date a form to be faxed over. So they're continuing to investigate which is a good sign for now.
 
Wow, glad it all worked out for you in the end. Sucks about Coonan though. The longer this goes on, the more claims they’ll have against them like yours. I don’t have a business degree, but I imagine this isn’t going to work out for them in the long run.
 
Lsgun1 said:
Thanks for posting all this, I was considering getting one. I'll skip now.
Click to expand...
Yeah I would skip it. They are awesome guns to shoot and I really wish this was going to work out but apparently it's not.

They're readily available on gunbroker but god forbid you have a problem (I had a few with mine which were fixed by coonan) who's going to repair it??
 
Tinkermatic said:
Wow, glad it all worked out for you in the end. Sucks about Coonan though. The longer this goes on, the more claims they’ll have against them like yours. I don’t have a business degree, but I imagine this isn’t going to work out for them in the long run.
Click to expand...
Yeah they're in some serious trouble at this point. There's A LOT of people (based on their FB review page) who have paid for guns and accessories and haven't received anything. I honestly don't know how they're going to dig themselves out of this massive mess. They're reputation is in the shitter at this point.
 
Tinkermatic said:
Wow, glad it all worked out for you in the end. Sucks about Coonan though. The longer this goes on, the more claims they’ll have against them like yours. I don’t have a business degree, but I imagine this isn’t going to work out for them in the long run.
Click to expand...
They will just move somewhere and get uncle stan to be on the paper work..... After bankruptcy.
 
andrew1220 said:
Well BOA has refunded me the money!! This is a huge relief. However it still sucks that I won't get the gun. Really wanted it. But I'd be a fool to buy another Coonan until they prove they're stable.
Click to expand...
As much as i hate credit cards "they" are generally pretty good at supporting customers. I also have this nagging thing in my head that companies are not to charge you for products until they ship. This is how cmp and several other places i have delt with do it. Now if you send a check or use a debit card ......well have fun.
 
andrew1220 said:
Yeah I would skip it. They are awesome guns to shoot and I really wish this was going to work out but apparently it's not.

They're readily available on gunbroker but god forbid you have a problem (I had a few with mine which were fixed by coonan) who's going to repair it??
Click to expand...
well you can always have greg derr fix it and make it even better
 
mac1911 said:
As much as i hate credit cards "they" are generally pretty good at supporting customers. I also have this nagging thing in my head that companies are not to charge you for products until they ship. This is how cmp and several other places i have delt with do it. Now if you send a check or use a debit card ......well have fun.
Click to expand...
Yup. Another customer I’m currently talking to said he used a debit card and his credit union is telling him they can’t help him especially since it’s been over 90 days. He’s beyond livid at this point. Sucks.

And yes companies should not be charging until it ships. I’ve learned my lesson here.
 
84ta406 said:
Glad to hear you got your money back. My brother has always had a hard on for a .357 coonan. This thread changed his mind.
Click to expand...
Ya they’re very cool guns but he’d be wise to hold off until Coonan revives themselves...if that ever happens.
 

Similar threads

B Kings Firearms Ohio
Replies
4
Views
309
Da_lucche
Da_lucche
What are your silliest, most useless firearms.
4 5 6
Replies
177
Views
4K
Marty McFly
Marty McFly
Bergen County Firearms lawyer
Replies
4
Views
261
GaryO
GaryO
Interesting Article on the "Notching" of Firearms to Keep Track of "Kills"
Replies
8
Views
382
clampett
clampett
Colorado Democrats Pushing 11% Excise Firearms Tax, Other California Gun Controls
Replies
6
Views
195
SpaceCritter
SpaceCritter
Back
Top Bottom