ATF Agents Raid Home of Youtube Gun Personality FPSRussia

[warwickben]

They see a guy blowing shit up all the time ... He doesn't make threats or any thing like that.
There's no way you can watch a video from him and not know its a joke.
Says flat out in the videos what he's using and he has people that he works with.

I could see the ATF Sending two guys to make sure all his paper work is ok. The idea of a independent person doing a small show like fps is new vs a million dollar movie doing the same thing. Did they Really need 40 guys???? Pretty clear cut you know .

"The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized."



We don't drive every cop off this site lol. heck some of them change there names
Cause of other cops, so don't lump every one in the same group.

The reason your getting hate on this is you did what the ATF did and assumed way to much.

 

[warwickben]

Yup that's my point the biggest explosion he's done he said how many pounds and it was wel under the legal limit.
You'd think the ATF would know there own laws.

 

[ntomsw]

I hope he makes a video blasting the ATF. That would make me so happy.

 

[cekim]

"Things to be seized", There is my rub with the warrant, ATF came up empty handed, which indicates an affidavit that should never have been written.

This is one of many arenas where what is missing from our laws is a "feedback" on bad behavior WRT violations of civil rights.

Like a "3 strikes you are out" or a built in penalty clause to the state/actors who get it wrong on an instance by instance basis.

If they had to pay $10K each time they issued a warrant that came up empty, they would sure think hard about issuing those warrants now wouldn't they? "FEEDBACK". I don't know what the right amount of feedback would be, but there is none right now barring a full-on civil rights lawsuit which sets the bar too high and insulates the "bad actors".

 

[soloman02]

Hate to say it, but if the guy didn't flaunt all his stuff all over the internet he'd never be in trouble. Yes may be a dumb license, etc. etc. But if he just stuck with his buddies and did it on their own private time/land then no one would bother them. Start flaunting your stuff around and someone comes a knocking (see: Flashbanging).....

By that logic, Mark Wahlberg, Bruce Willis and just about every other actor out there should have their house raided by the ATF. And that rape victims should be raped for wearing sexy clothes.

I'll say it....

**** the ATF

I'll add to that: The ATF should die in a fire.

I can see it now;

Tomorrow a New FPS Russia Video for all my American Comrades!
"Hello this is FPS Russia."
"Your ATF raided my home trying to find something."
"They found nothing."
BLAM BLAM BLAM BLAM BLAM BLAM BLAM BLAM BLAM BLAM BLAM BLAM BLAM BLAM BLAM BLAM BLAM BLAM BLAM BLAM BLAM BLAM BLAM BLAM
"Have a Nice Day!"

That would be an epic video.

 

[soloman02]

This is one of many arenas where what is missing from our laws is a "feedback" on bad behavior WRT violations of civil rights.

Like a "3 strikes you are out" or a built in penalty clause to the state/actors who get it wrong on an instance by instance basis.

If they had to pay $10K each time they issued a warrant that came up empty, they would sure think hard about issuing those warrants now wouldn't they? "FEEDBACK". I don't know what the right amount of feedback would be, but there is none right now barring a full-on civil rights lawsuit which sets the bar too high and insulates the "bad actors".

The ATF and others commit so much BS that I'd rather have the bar be high at this point. At least I'd know my chance of being secure in my persons and possessions would actually be pretty high.

 

[W.E.C]

This is one of many arenas where what is missing from our laws is a "feedback" on bad behavior WRT violations of civil rights.

Like a "3 strikes you are out" or a built in penalty clause to the state/actors who get it wrong on an instance by instance basis.

If they had to pay $10K each time they issued a warrant that came up empty, they would sure think hard about issuing those warrants now wouldn't they? "FEEDBACK". I don't know what the right amount of feedback would be, but there is none right now barring a full-on civil rights lawsuit which sets the bar too high and insulates the "bad actors".

I was thinking along those lines as well,
but any self respecting honest judge would be righteously pissed at these guys, and if they came back for another warrant , he would tell them to step off, he was burned once by signing off the first time.

 

[FSTC]

They new they wouldn't find anything.
The ATF picked a highly visible target, to scare the rest of us "activists"
Ted Nugent is next.

 

[Gman021]

I agree. But again, from the other side of the equation (guy trying to find bad guys), like I said previously if he posts thing that look illegal (big BOOMS) then it may be P/C to get he warrant to go search. Again, it's using the legal system. I understand he is a business man, that's awesome he his. How many guys on here watch what they say about what they own because they don't want to get in trouble? It's the same thing... and I'll try one last time... I never said if i thought anything was legal/illegal good/bad.

I don't think he would do illegal things with millions of people watching on the internet.

 

[cekim]

I was thinking along those lines as well,
but any self respecting honest judge would be righteously pissed at these guys, and if they came back for another warrant , he would tell them to step off, he was burned once by signing off the first time.

Much the the remainder of our system of Due Process - "trust but verify".

 

[soloman02]

Read what he posted again. He refered that the bar was high on seeking civil recourse against the the agents, not the other way around.

I did.

"but there is none right now barring a full-on civil rights lawsuit which sets the bar too high and insulates the "bad actors"."

I read "bad actors" to mean legitimate offenses that they don't pursue because a civil lawsuit set the punishment at a really high level (like 100k-500K+) for failing to find anything.

I guess I need Cekim to elaborate on that point.

 

[FSTC]

Why is it whenever I hear "jammed up", it is when a cop or someone who is talking to or with or about cops uses it. Where does that term come from?

 

[cekim]

I did.

"but there is none right now barring a full-on civil rights lawsuit which sets the bar too high and insulates the "bad actors"."

I read "bad actors" to mean legitimate offenses that they don't pursue because a civil lawsuit set the punishment at a really high level (like 100k-500K+) for failing to find anything.

I guess I need Cekim to elaborate on that point.

"bad actors" in this context would be the agents of the state who issued and acted on a bad warrant which found nothing.

Obviously there has to be a balance there, I am not talking a out marching DAs off to camps for biffing a warrant (in good faith). The penalties must be arranged to allow for "reasonable" behavior, but in this context, there is a concrete cost to those against whom a warrant was executed, so I don't find it unreasonable to have a "loser pays" presumption on any warrant. That sets a "bar" to the issuer that makes them stop and think about the consequences of getting it wrong. It better be worth it.

That isn't individually "punitive" to the agents of the state. The more punitive side of my thoughts (three strikes or some approximation) would have to be arranged to have some leeway. Some number of bad ones in good faith, ok, but eventually you have a pattern of warrants that came up empty which objectively means something needs to change.

 

[xtry51]

This seems like it would have been an opportune time to stretch the legs on that mini gun again.

 

[cekim]

Read what he posted again. He refered that the bar was high on seeking civil recourse against the the agents, not the other way around.

Correct. This is one of many situations where "most of the time" good people do the right thing in the system. However, there are serial abusers. Our laws and systems lack oversight barring civil rights lawsuits which allow the ones within the system who abuse this trust to operate for a long time with impunity.

It seems to me, as with any law, that there can be intermediate remedies in the law against bad or negligent behavior which show misbehavior early and provide disincentive for "stretching".

 

[BerkshireHunter]

This seems like it would have been an opportune time to stretch the legs on that mini gun again.

I'm not an FPS Russia fan, but this sounds F'ed up. Just like his associate's murder.

Oh, btw, I ****in hate Big Sis and the douchebag media. This country has gone straight up 1984. Thanks Federal Reserve.

(Does this get me on the kill lists?)

 

[bricktop]

Yup that's my point the biggest explosion he's done he said how many pounds and it was wel under the legal limit.
You'd think the ATF would know there own laws.

Actually you can call in ten times with questions for their agents and get ten different answers. So they're like cops in that respect. If you want the straight-up, you have to request it in writing.

 

[DrRansom]

lol no idea how many lives, but all the guys that PM or give me good rep are keeping me alive I guess. They just don't want to be vocal and get strung up. Other disagree with me wholeheartedly, but appreciate that I don't freak out and swear and bash guys in retuen (not often anyways I'm only human).

Yes, that is quite a rep bar you got there. Leading the unspoken pack, FTW!

 

[Evadd]

The piling on in this thread is why i never post anymore. You're either with the group or you're the enemy, no middle ground ever. NES doesn't like dissenting opinions, posters would rather drive off the people who aren't as hard-core as they "should" be.

I haven't been here as long or as active as many, but this is a painfully sad truth about this forum.

I know there are tons of members here who aren't all Johnny Bravo and are reasonable people, but there is also a very vocal hardcore % that like to gang up on and bully those who dissent even a little bit. And then there are a number of lemmings who post up "Yeah, me too! Eat it, liberal hippy!" just to fit in.

 

[Finalygotabeltfed]

This board needs a ****ing lemming filter.........BADLY.

 

[Admin]

The piling on in this thread is why i never post anymore. You're either with the group or you're the enemy, no middle ground ever. NES doesn't like dissenting opinions, posters would rather drive off the people who aren't as hard-core as they "should" be.

Right and wrong is pretty black and white. There is no middle ground on this issue. The only person getting piled on in this thread is a troll who has been banned for trolling and throwing out horrible legal advice claiming to be an LEO.

 

[flintoid]

I haven't been here as long or as active as many, but this is a painfully sad truth about this forum.

I know there are tons of members here who aren't all Johnny Bravo and are reasonable people, but there is also a very vocal hardcore % that like to gang up on and bully those who dissent even a little bit. And then there are a number of lemmings who post up "Yeah, me too! Eat it, liberal hippy!" just to fit in.

If this is what you see and feel, then you aren't looking hard enough. You and BradM are skimming the surface of what comprises this forum... and probably doing yourselves a disservice.

Opinions expressed in these shit fests usually are posed against shitheads with very solid, anti-2A opinions. Trolls. Whether you want to accept that or not- the people that push back against them usually have tracked their posts and behavior long enough to have vetted out their agendas.

Anyways- I think you need to seriously talk to some of "those people" that you're labeling as "Johnny Bravos." We are not all that bad, and to be honest, you'll learn a few things.


And back to my original point....


This forum is more than arguments. It is advice. In the form of building firearms. Shopping firearms. Learning to shoot firearms. Shopping training. Buying shit you want cheap via group buys. Group shoots. Car shoots. Dinners. Pig roasts. Etc.

I've helped over 75 people build AKs on this forum. 75 ****ing people that I did not know before 2009.

If you actually come on here to read, learn, and gain from it, you'll see what I'm saying. But if you log on for these BS troll fights, you'll post like what I've quoted (and like BradM), and continue to complain in the future. Because you don't know any better than that. It's your choice. Be a bitch, or don't be one.

 

[Evadd]

If this is what you see and feel, then you aren't looking hard enough. You and BradM are skimming the surface of what comprises this forum... and probably doing yourselves a disservice.

Opinions expressed in these shit fests usually are posed against shitheads with very solid, anti-2A opinions. Trolls. Whether you want to accept that or not- the people that push back against them usually have tracked their posts and behavior long enough to have vetted out their agendas.

Anyways- I think you need to seriously talk to some of "those people" that you're labeling as "Johnny Bravos." We are not all that bad, and to be honest, you'll learn a few things.


And back to my original point....


This forum is more than arguments. It is advice. In the form of building firearms. Shopping firearms. Learning to shoot firearms. Shopping training. Buying shit you want cheap via group buys. Group shoots. Car shoots. Dinners. Pig roasts. Etc.

I've helped over 75 people build AKs on this forum. 75 ****ing people that I did not know before 2009.

If you actually come on here to read, learn, and gain from it, you'll see what I'm saying. But if you log on for these BS troll fights, you'll post like what I've quoted (and like BradM), and continue to complain in the future. Because you don't know any better than that. It's your choice. Be a bitch, or don't be one.

You make a lot of good points, and I agree with pretty much all of what you said. I never said I thought everyone was bad; I think it's quite the opposite. I think that the vast majority of people on this forum are great. As an example, as I am someone who is new to building ARs, I've been offered help without even really having had to ask for it. I've joined in a few group buys and love it. As for being a complainy bitch, it's on both sides of the fence, but there are some who refuse to see it.

 

[Apathesis]

Here's Primus Tactical's "training video" from his FB page, in case you haven't seen it:


The dude sure did run up a pretty epic post count in ONE MONTH.

 

[Quiet]

Maybe PT really isn't a cop, Just plays one on the computer. But this is the internet and only the truth can be posted on the internet.

Be CAREFUL!!! That emoticon looks like it might be a destructive device. ATF JBT incoming

The piling on in this thread is why i never post anymore. You're either with the group or you're the enemy, no middle ground ever. NES doesn't like dissenting opinions, posters would rather drive off the people who aren't as hard-core as they "should" be.

Rad- did i say anywhere that i agree with him? No. I just get tired of seeing anyone with an opposing opinion get shit on. Why not just stay on topic? He has his opinion, i strongly disagree so maybe i say that, then move on. No reason to derail everything.

I haven't been here as long or as active as many, but this is a painfully sad truth about this forum.

I know there are tons of members here who aren't all Johnny Bravo and are reasonable people, but there is also a very vocal hardcore % that like to gang up on and bully those who dissent even a little bit. And then there are a number of lemmings who post up "Yeah, me too! Eat it, liberal hippy!" just to fit in.

Yeap, if you post a question for discussion or an opinion which differs one itoa from SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED you are harrassed pretty good. If you don't back down, you get labelled a troll. If you keep on it, you're gonna get banned, because any moderator doesn't want to have disharmony on his forum. So this forum is what it is, a place where differing opinions is not tolerated because the mods allow the abuse of dissenting opinion at the get go.

If the admin wants a forum with more diverse thought, he could change that behavior. But he doesn't. It's his forum. I respect that, so I choose not to air my thought provoking questions constantly. Just once in a while when I can't resist. Like this time. :-D

Is it me, or has there been an abundance of posts lately from people who "never post here anymore"?

People leave and return, part of the ebb and flow of a forum. It's good to hear from the ones that are unhappy at times, especially folks with high post counts. Right now NES is flying high and I hope that continues.

It is ironic that an American pretending to be Russian gets raided by thugs who pretend to be Americans.


KGB ~ ATF ?

THAT IS SO HILARIOUS and sadly TRUE. +2

"Things to be seized", There is my rub with the warrant, ATF came up empty handed, which indicates an affidavit that should never have been written.

Hey, I have it from a good source that their warrant was to seize any and all explosives used during the taping of his videos.
Think about it.

 

[Quiet]

If this is what you see and feel, then you aren't looking hard enough. You and BradM are skimming the surface of what comprises this forum... and probably doing yourselves a disservice.

Ya, me too, I guess. I may not yet see the depth of what this forum has to offer, nor will lots of folks who never have the chance to find out because they're turned off by getting bashed for having a different opinion on something.

Me? I run a forum. I understand the folks who post here and I have pretty thick hyde. So it is what it is. :shrug:

 

[RedSoxandAKs]

Well, obviously there was a warrant. So, over what would you sue them? They did everything by the book, apparently.

The disturbing thing here is the escalation of force,intimidation and firepower police all over the country are using in these situations. Twenty..maybe even ten years ago you had a couple of patrol cars and maybe an SUV with the ATF/DA types executing the warrant. Look around the country now...seems like every warrant is being served by a SWAT team...although it's usually regular officers in their SWAT costumes. SPF is lucky it went the way it did...Look at that Marine in San Diego last year who was shot 20 something times...or the guy on the YouTube vid shot for holding a golf club before the police even ID themselves. Cops are getting militarized, aggressive and using excessive tactics.

 

[Quiet]

Dude, you've been here like...2-3 months?

Yes. I don't understand the intent of your question.

 

[flintoid]

As for being a complainy bitch, it's on both sides of the fence, but there are some who refuse to see it.

I bust nuts around here a lot. And usually it's for those who deserve it.

Primus was a LEO who bought into that mentality that exists among select LEOs where they think they're more privaleged than "regular" citizens of the US. It's something that I've seen a lot in LEO crowds that I know. And it's dangerous.

So giving him the latitude to act the way he was can sway people who don't know any better. He honestly deserved the shit he got. And I honestly believe the mods here left him "active" and unbanned so people could pick his logic apart and help educate people.

Things happen for a reason. Primus was a LEO that had no grasp on the Bill of Rights. He believed it applied to Law Enforcement Officers, and could be adapted and manipulated when convenient in conducting his job.

Which is the definition of a ****er.

 

[flintoid]

Ya, me too, I guess. I may not yet see the depth of what this forum has to offer, nor will lots of folks who never have the chance to find out because they're turned off by getting bashed for having a different opinion on something.

Me? I run a forum. I understand the folks who post here and I have pretty thick hyde. So it is what it is. :shrug:

Your type won't ever seek to meet people in real life after your online interactions.

You don't have to act like it's not your choice that you miss out on a lot that this forum has to offer. Stop acting ignorant. It's a transparent act, dude.