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Anyone understand this business of MA changing tax law for out of staters working from home?

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Someone just mentioned this to me today, so I looked into it a bit.


Normally as a NH resident I pay MA taxes on 100% of my income as I have an office there (and elsewhere) however my income is apportioned, actually very modestly and favoring MA..

Now MA is changing something and I don't quite know what yet. It's either just legislating a practice of continuing to collect taxes that I can apportion as I always have. Or now maybe they want to end apportionment, but maybe also looking back at all of 2020?

Luckily even democrats in NH are all over this (whatever it is).. maybe its time to become officially remote or use a NH office as my base, tell MA what I owe them and send a check versus the other way around.
 
Yes (and this is very high level, so feel free to PM if you want to discuss further) - the general rule is you’re taxed on where the work is performed, not where the product ends up or where the beneficiary of the work is located.

For example, when I was at a Big 4 accounting firm, I had clients all over the country. However, given that I was in tax, most of the work I did was out of the Boston office, so the work I did for a client in California did not make those wages subject to CA tax. However, there were two years where I was constantly in New York (every other week for 18 months) and because I was spending so much time there, I was deemed to be a NY non-resident for tax purposes, and my wages were subject to NYS taxes specifically for that time in which wages were earned in the state. The Firm grossed up my wages and paid the tax there on my behalf, essentially (as you correctly note) apportioning my wages between the two jurisdictions. When we filled out our time sheets, you entered the client you were working on, where you were doing the work, and the time spent on that, just like most other professional services firms (law, engineering, architecture, etc).

What MA is trying to do is say that because the employer or finished product is in MA then those wages are subject to MA tax. Because the pandemic has pushed so many people to work remotely, and in many cases in other states, those wages are no longer subject to MA tax and the state is trying to fill that revenue shortfall with this bill. It’s bullshit, and if challenged, would most likely be rejected in court as it’s the opposite of what every state does as well as the general tax treaty that’s the foundation for all of the treaties we have with other countries.

Let’s use a simple international example: You want to have a website built for your business. Assume your company is newly formed and doesn’t have a lot of extra cash, so you look for lower cost options and determine that you have 2 options - pay someone from India to come to your place of business and build a website for you, or you can pay someone to build the site from their home in India. Further assume the person hired is not a US citizen, whose permanent residence is in India, has no permanent establishment or nexus in the US through other activities, is deemed to be an independent contractor, and your office is in NH where individual income isn’t taxed. Also assume there are no tax treaty provisions that reduce or alter tax rates and provisions. We’re trying to keep this example simple.

If you hire the person to come to the US and work from your office, he’s subject to a 20% automatic withholding on wages paid to that person. Further, if that person wanted to get that 20% back (or some portion thereof), he would have to file a US tax return. However, if you hire the person who does everything remotely, those wages are not subject to the automatic withholding provisions.

Again, the above is the most watered down and simple example I could come up with right now. There are any number of actual items that may impact the above scenario if it really happened. Essentially, MA wants to treat everyone as though they’re working in the local office, regardless of where the work is actually performed. That’s just not going to pass the smell test if challenged in court. Rather than putting people in limbo, NH is trying to address the problem legislatively.

It‘s been a long day, so I’m sure there’s something I’ve left out, but the above is a high level explanation. Again, feel free to PM if need be.

CG
 
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Part of the problem is it's unclear what MA DOR has done. I also live in NH and work in MA and NH and apportion my wages based on days worked in each state. Reading it strictly it would no longer allow you to apportion wages to your state of residence during the state of emergency and thus be taxed as MA income for as long as MA DOR says you can't. A more favorable reading would allow you to apportion your wages at the ratio prior to the pandemic during the pandemic. My understanding of the law prior to this declaration would have allowed any NH resident working from home during the pandemic to apportion all their wages during that time as NH income.

Some things that will need answers before the end of the year -
What if a NH resident voluntarily switched to 100% WFH before MA declared a state of emergency on 3/10?
What if a NH resident voluntarily switched to 100% WFH before MA issued a stay at home order on 3/24?
(Some employers started giving employees the option to 100% WFH well beforehand)
What if an employer closed their office before the state of emergency?
What if an employer closed their office before the stay at home order?
(Many employers switched to mandatory 100% WFH before one or both of the above)
How does an employer opening their general office space at some point after they become eligible (5/25 if outside Boston, 6/1 in Boston) affect this?
If the employee returns to the office for some amount of time after the office reopens can they adjust their apportionment to reflect the new ratio? (ex prior to pandemic employee worked 80% MA 20% NH but once the office reopens they switch to 20% MA 80% NH)
If an employee remains 100% WFH in NH after their MA office opens can they apportion wages to NH?
If the employer expects the employee to WFH indefinitely can they switch the state of record for their employment?

It seems like the problem is actually a proposed change in the regulations. It appears that IF this regulation is adopted as proposed the answers to the questions above will be key in determining how you can apportion your wages as a NH resident previously working in MA.
Pursuant to this rule, all compensation received for services performed by a non-resident who, immediately prior to the Massachusetts COVID-19 state of emergency was an employee engaged in performing such services in Massachusetts, and who is performing services from a location outside Massachusetts due to a Pandemic-Related Circumstance will continue to be treated as Massachusetts source income
...
830 CMR 62.5A.3 is effective through the earlier of December 31, 2020, or 90 days after the date on which the Governor of the Commonwealth gives notice that the state of emergency declared in Executive Order 591 is no longer in effect.

There is a public hearing about this proposed change on August 27th at 10am. It will be done via Webex, there are instructions for submitting testimony beforehand at the link below.

The first TIR statement outlines the same facts as above.

This TIR supercedes the first but doesn't offer much additional clarity regarding the above questions

Here's the MA declaration of a state of emergency on March 10th

Here's the stay at home order issued on March 23, taking effect on March 24
 
@natf - you’re correct and what’s happening is that MA is trying to ram this through in a hurry while there are so many unanswered questions and scenarios that haven’t been fully fleshed out. This would be a slow-motion train wreck if it actually goes through. I fully expect the MA Bar Association, the MA Society of CPAs, and the MA Taxpayer Foundation to weigh in, along with several other similar organizations in different states before this goes to a vote.
 
In my situation I happen to have an office in MA and work for a company based in NC, manage people from MA, NH, TX, VA, and India.

Kinda ridiculous MA can expect to kick us out of the state, essentially close the office, then turn around and expect I potentially even pay more taxes to them than last year (if I can't apportion at all). Its laughable - if I am in NH they have as much stake in my income as the foreign country of India does.

My feedback will be if they do this stuff those of us working remotely will continue to do so in the future, they may reap a few months this year but going forward they will reap nothing from many of us. The company I work for is already noting how well this works and has been combing offices, is eager to shift people to remote.
 
Yes (and this is very high level, so feel free to PM if you want to discuss further) - the general rule is you’re taxed on where the work is performed, not where the product ends up or where the beneficiary of the work is located.

For example, when I was at a Big 4 accounting firm, I had clients all over the country. However, given that I was in tax, most of the work I did was out of the Boston office, so the work I did for a client in California did not make those wages subject to CA tax. However, there were two years where I was constantly in New York (every other week for 18 months) and because I was spending so much time there, I was deemed to be a NY non-resident for tax purposes, and my wages were subject to NYS taxes specifically for that time in which wages were earned in the state. The Firm grossed up my wages and paid the tax there on my behalf, essentially (as you correctly note) apportioning my wages between the two jurisdictions. When we filled out our time sheets, you entered the client you were working on, where you were doing the work, and the time spent on that, just like most other professional services firms (law, engineering, architecture, etc).

What MA is trying to do is say that because the employer or finished product is in MA then those wages are subject to MA tax. Because the pandemic has pushed so many people to work remotely, and in many cases in other states, those wages are no longer subject to MA tax and the state is trying to fill that revenue shortfall with this bill. It’s bullshit, and if challenged, would most likely be rejected in court as it’s the opposite of what every state does as well as the general tax treaty that’s the foundation for all of the treaties we have with other countries.

Let’s use a simple international example: You want to have a website built for your business. Assume your company is newly formed and doesn’t have a lot of extra cash, so you look for lower cost options and determine that you have 2 options - pay someone from India to come to your place of business and build a website for you, or you can pay someone to build the site from their home in India. Further assume the person hired is not a US citizen, whose permanent residence is in India, has no permanent establishment or nexus in the US through other activities, is deemed to be an independent contractor, and your office is in NH where individual income isn’t taxed. Also assume there are no tax treaty provisions that reduce or alter tax rates and provisions. We’re trying to keep this example simple.

If you hire the person to come to the US and work from your office, he’s subject to a 20% automatic withholding on wages paid to that person. Further, if that person wanted to get that 20% back (or some portion thereof), he would have to file a US tax return. However, if you hire the person who does everything remotely, those wages are not subject to the automatic withholding provisions.

Again, the above is the most watered down and simple example I could come up with right now. There are any number of actual items that may impact the above scenario if it really happened. Essentially, MA wants to treat everyone as though they’re working in the local office, regardless of where the work is actually performed. That’s just not going to pass the smell test if challenged in court. Rather than putting people in limbo, NH is trying to address the problem legislatively.

It‘s been a long day, so I’m sure there’s something I’ve left out, but the above is a high level explanation. Again, feel free to PM if need be.

CG

Thank you so much for that, at this point its a bitch, wait, & see. Hopefully MA is intimidated out of it - I imagine NH may be able to legislate something that blocks it (all least for Q4) even if politicians, lawyers, and courts can't fix it.
 
You gotta love reporters that don't understand what they are writing.

Previously, Massachusetts allowed non-residents to deduct a portion of their taxable income based on the amount of time spent working outside of the state.

That policy benefited the tens of thousands of New Hampshire residents who commuted each day into Massachusetts before the pandemic by potentially reducing their tax burden.

So non-residents who work EVERY DAY in Mass were somehow benefiting from apportionment of work. . . they did 100% in mASS. Got it. LOL


Here's where I think rubber and road will meet:

If you work for a company that has offices in mASS and NewHampster, you're gonna be able to tell Charlie to pound sand.

If you work for a company that ONLY had offices in mASS, I think they have grounds to go after something.

The reality is that they are trading dimes for dollars. Sure, let's chase those few people that are now working in NH. Instead of thinking how to actually SOLVE the problem.

But that is what makes Trump so amazing. Because politicians are not creators, they are takers. Trump SOLVES problems. Most politicians just find a new way to make YOU solve the problem.
 
I've been watching this tax issue as well and haven't made much sense of it. My office is based in Mass and I have Mass income tax withheld. I usually work from home 1-3 days per week and travel to various states and countries. Last year I kept meticulous records of every work day that I spent outside of Mass and when I filed my state taxes I was able to get refunded for those days. This year I've been 100% remote in NH since the beginning of March and it sounds like the Commonwealth is going to cling on to every penny of the state tax that was withheld from my pay.
 
In my situation I happen to have an office in MA and work for a company based in NC, manage people from MA, NH, TX, VA, and India.

Kinda ridiculous MA can expect to kick us out of the state, essentially close the office, then turn around and expect I potentially even pay more taxes to them than last year (if I can't apportion at all). Its laughable - if I am in NH they have as much stake in my income as the foreign country of India does.

My feedback will be if they do this stuff those of us working remotely will continue to do so in the future, they may reap a few months this year but going forward they will reap nothing from many of us. The company I work for is already noting how well this works and has been combing offices, is eager to shift people to remote.

If your employer has an office in NH, you should request to be coded to that office for the time being unless there’s a reason for not doing so (managing cost centers, etc).
 
I've been watching this tax issue as well and haven't made much sense of it. My office is based in Mass and I have Mass income tax withheld. I usually work from home 1-3 days per week and travel to various states and countries. Last year I kept meticulous records of every work day that I spent outside of Mass and when I filed my state taxes I was able to get refunded for those days. This year I've been 100% remote in NH since the beginning of March and it sounds like the Commonwealth is going to cling on to every penny of the state tax that was withheld from my pay.

You need to pull up your last few paystubs and see if MA tax is still being withheld. If it is, reach out to your HR department and ask them why since have not worked in MA since March. Your company’s payroll service provider (if applicable) should be able to uncheck the MA box and check the NH box.

As I noted above, there may be a reason why your company is still considering you a MA EE.
 
I'm moving to NH in a few weeks, and my company agreed to make me a perm remote NH resident worker. Corp office is Boston, but we have branches in NH. Hoping this means I don't have to pay MA taxes.
Make a visit to those branches and talk business for a few minutes.
 
There is an unintended consequence.

States that tax all of a resident's income generally apply a credit for income taxes paid in another state. If you work in NY but live in MA, you get credit for the NY taxes so you do not pay MA taxes as well. Ditto the other way around - it's pretty much universal in state tax codes.

Now consider someone who lives in NY the entire year, but works remote for a MA company. How do you think NY is going to feel about that person getting a credit on his NY income taxes for the taxes he paid as a MA remote worker?
 
You need to pull up your last few paystubs and see if MA tax is still being withheld. If it is, reach out to your HR department and ask them why since have not worked in MA since March. Your company’s payroll service provider (if applicable) should be able to uncheck the MA box and check the NH box.

As I noted above, there may be a reason why your company is still considering you a MA EE.

Thanks, I'll reach out to them. My position is based in the Corporate office in Mass though so I doubt I'll have any luck. I live in NH by choice. We do have two locations in NH which I would LOVE to be "based" out of but they are business unit locations and my role serves all the business units so I doubt any of the business units would want to carry my salary when my work is spread out among them all. Doesn't hurt to ask though!
 
My company shifted employees that "could" work from home, to remote workers prior to the "order".

They quickly realized that productivity wasn't really affected one way or the other and it's less expensive to maintain someone at home. I doubt we'll return to the office this year, probably next spring or summer. It's possible many of us will be converted to permanent remote workers. Even if not, management is more accepting of the idea now and it opens the possibility of relocating without having to find work in the new place.

So one possible outcome is I move to another state (in a year or so) and telecommute forever. I'm wondering what impact this could have on that.
 
I've been watching this tax issue as well and haven't made much sense of it. My office is based in Mass and I have Mass income tax withheld. I usually work from home 1-3 days per week and travel to various states and countries. Last year I kept meticulous records of every work day that I spent outside of Mass and when I filed my state taxes I was able to get refunded for those days. This year I've been 100% remote in NH since the beginning of March and it sounds like the Commonwealth is going to cling on to every penny of the state tax that was withheld from my pay.
My read is that at best you won't be able to get refunded for more days than last year because the assumption (reality?) is those extra days are due solely to Covid. Worst case, you'll have to fight for even what you got last year.

The other side of the coin in what I read is that MA residents who would normally work in NH and would be exempt, and who are now being told to work from home due to Covid, won't have to pay MA income tax.

Personally if MA is going to collect income tax from people who work in MA (debating that is a different discussion) then forget trying to implement special Covid rules. If one is whatever-enough to stay in MA while normally working in NH, and are getting impacted by this, then either take it up with your company to get additional compensation, or just suck it up. And speaking of suck it up, that's what MA DOR needs to do WRT people now working from home in NH (and elsewhere) <\soapbox>
 
For those that are going to reach out to their employers who don't have an office in another state (even if they do), keep in mind that there may be broader tax implications and compliance matters for the organization if they shift employees to other states (nexus establishment, SUTA contributions, other payroll tax matters, and others). It's not necessarily an easy decision making matter, and obviously multiple other factors come in to play.
 
MS and PA (I think it’s PA) have legislatively enacted rules that say if an employee was considered a non-resident in the state pre-Covid, then they are still considered a non-resident if in a similar fact pattern as the above posts.
 
I'm moving to NH in a few weeks, and my company agreed to make me a perm remote NH resident worker. Corp office is Boston, but we have branches in NH. Hoping this means I don't have to pay MA taxes.

You are a NH resident working for a NH company at that point. mASS can pound sand.

It could create a nice cottage industry of a Jack-style mill in Suthuhn NH that becomes the NH satellite office of MANY smaller MA companies so that NH residents can declare they are 100% NH paid and employed.

It could turn around and backfire on them.

Could???? All insane laws have massive unintended consequences. This would be a riot!
 
You are a NH resident working for a NH company at that point. mASS can pound sand.

It could create a nice cottage industry of a Jack-style mill in Suthuhn NH that becomes the NH satellite office of MANY smaller MA companies so that NH residents can declare they are 100% NH paid and employed.

It could turn around and backfire on them.

Could???? All insane laws have massive unintended consequences. This would be a riot!

No - he’d be working for a MA company with a location or branch (branch being a SMLLC with the corporate body as the sole member, for this example).

Wayfair v. SD changed the rules and considerations for organizations that operate in multiple jurisdictions. The old Quill rules and PL 86-272 have been impacted by creating “economic interest” where there previously may not have been one.
 
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