Where does MA law state 'concealed' carry?

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brtt485

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So a friend stops by today who just got his Class A LTC, no restrictions and tells me his buddy who is a cop said that 'there is no license you can get in MA that allows you to carry concealed'. I obviously laughed at him as I have been carrying concealed for years in MA under my Class A LTC with no restrictions, plus having gained all kinds of the knowledge from most of you folks here on NES. I told him that the ability to legally carry a concealed firearm was exactly what his Class A LTC with no restrictions gave him. He said 'prove it'! No problem I thought so I went into the MA firearm statutes online and from what I could find there and searching on here, there doesn't seem to be anywhere that the law states you can carry concealed. It does state that you cannot CCW with a Class B so I guess one could infer that you CAN CCW with a Class A but what am I missing?

I know it is legal but where does MA Law state you can CCW with an unrestricted Class A???

(note, I did find this online which makes it obvious enough but I was curious for my own knowledge where it was in the statutes)
 
I'm not going to look up the reg. It's pretty much inferred that ALP lets you carry concealed.

Truly though, you are subject to the whims of your CLEO....ask him. That is your proof. If he says you can conceal carry...then so be it. Because he's the one thats allowed to revoke it. If he says you can open carry...then so be it. It's really that simple and that stupid. Its truly arbitrary and capricious as it can get.
 
Mark from MA said:
I'm not going to look up the reg. It's pretty much inferred that ALP lets you carry concealed.

Truly though, you are subject to the whims of your CLEO....ask him. That is your proof. If he says you can conceal carry...then so be it. Because he's the one thats allowed to revoke it. If he says you can open carry...then so be it. It's really that simple and that stupid. Its truly arbitrary and capricious as it can get.
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Good point, never thought about open carry that way, but makes sense...if it's okay with your chief, would suppose you're good to go. As long as you don't mind being the subject of occasional "man with gun" calls around our fine Commonwealth.[thinking]
 
Mark from MA said:
I'm not going to look up the reg. It's pretty much inferred that ALP lets you carry concealed.

Truly though, you are subject to the whims of your CLEO....ask him. That is your proof. If he says you can conceal carry...then so be it. Because he's the one thats allowed to revoke it. If he says you can open carry...then so be it. It's really that simple and that stupid. Its truly arbitrary and capricious as it can get.
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If the CoP in Westfield, MA says its legal and the LEO questioning me in Weymouth disagrees what my CoP isn't going to help me!

I think the question in my original post is just more proof how completely ridiculous the firearms laws in this state are.

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Golddiggie said:
Page one of this document: http://www.handgunlaw.us/states/massachusetts.pdf

"Class A The Class A Unrestricted LTC permits the purchase, possession and carrying of large-capacity handguns and
transporting rifles, shotguns and Large Capacity feeding devices.
THIS IS THE ONLY LICENSE THAT ALLOWS THE CONCEALED CARRYING OF FIREARMS"
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Saw that too but that last part is NOT in the law books!
 
Mike-Mike said:
That's the problem, In general, Laws disallow things. Show me a law that says it's ok to eat apple pie on Wednesday night?
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I appreciate your point but one would think the importance of a complete understanding of firearms laws would lead to laws that specifically state the whether concealed carry is allowed or not. But then I guess that just goes back to what I said previously about the disaster that is MA gun laws.

By no means am I saying that CCW is not legal, I was just curious if it was specifically stated anywhere in the laws or regs.

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ColdDayInHell said:
Worst part about the wording is Large Capacity.

No, it's standard ****ing capacity to me you moonbat pieces of shit.
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At least you don't live in NY!
 
brtt485 said:
I appreciate your point but one would think the importance of a complete understanding of firearms laws would lead to laws that specifically state the whether concealed carry is allowed or not. But then I guess that just goes back to what I said previously about the disaster that is MA gun laws.

By no means am I saying that CCW is not legal, I was just curious if it was specifically stated anywhere in the laws or regs.
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I agree with you and am not trying to be smart. If there were a Law prohibiting it it would be easy to find.
 
MGL Chapter 140 Section 141
A Class A license shall entitle a holder thereof to purchase, rent, lease, borrow, possess and carry: (i) firearms, including large capacity firearms, and feeding devices and ammunition therefor, for all lawful purposes,
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"all lawful purposes" means everything that isn't expressly forbidden by law. There is no law which forbids carrying a concealed firearm with a Class A LTC, thus it is legal. This is in contrast to a Class B LTC, for which concealed carry is expressly forbidden by law.

As Mike-Mike points out, laws are generally prohibitive in nature. You are legally permitted to do anything which is not forbidden by law. When your friend tells you there is no law that states that an LTC-A allows you to carry concealed, your response should be that there is no law that disallows you from carrying concealed with an LTC-A.
 
mlaboss said:
MGL Chapter 140 Section 141


"all lawful purposes" means everything that isn't expressly forbidden by law. There is no law which forbids carrying a concealed firearm with a Class A LTC, thus it is legal. This is in contrast to a Class B LTC, for which concealed carry is expressly forbidden by law.

As Mike-Mike points out, laws are generally prohibitive in nature. You are legally permitted to do anything which is not forbidden by law. When your friend tells you there is no law that states that an LTC-A allows you to carry concealed, your response should be that there is no law that disallows you from carrying concealed with an LTC-A.
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Agreed and understood. This is how I have always interpreted it myself and therefore never thought to dig deeper to see if it was expressly stated as 'allowed' elsewhere. Was just curious after it was brought to my attention.
 
Mike-Mike said:
That's the problem, In general, Laws disallow things. Show me a law that says it's ok to eat apple pie on Wednesday night?
Click to expand...


Couldn't agree more on the above!

However the OP should understand that there is no law prohibiting OPEN carry either in MA. Go ahead and open carry a fire arm in mass and see what happens though! One sheeple citizen calls the cops......and your LTC A will be pulled for "unsuitability".........however you have technically broken no law.......or had any due process proving you broke any law. Let your friend know this as well.
 
Generally, laws prohibit or restrict, they do not allow, or permit.

There is no law that says that one may not carry a firearm (using the MGLs definition, i.e. a handgun) openly, or concealed, except in specific, prohibited places, such as schools and federal buildings, for example.

There is no "Law" that says "You can carry your piece concealed"; there are laws saying that you may not carry an uncased long gun on a public way unless lawfully engaged in hunting, or that you need an FID for ammo.

Think about this: one does not need an FID or LTC for a black powder rifle, but the laws does not say this....it exempts primitive firearms (not taking a fixed cartridge) from the LTC/FID requirements.

Cop referenced in the OP was wrong, either deliberately or out of ignorance. Perhaps one of the LEOs that's been posting recently can chime in?
 
Sec. 131 allows LTC-A holders to "purchase, rent, lease, borrow, possess and carry . . . for all lawful purposes, subject to such restrictions relative to the possession, use or carrying of firearms as the licensing authority deems proper" A standard rule of statutory construction is the plain meaning rule: "carry" means carry--open, concealed, on your head, however else you want to carry, but subject to any restrictions imposed by your town chief of police. If your LTC-A says target only, you can't carry in public, open or concealed. If you carry openly under an unrestricted LTC-A, you would be entitled to do so under Sec. 131, but you might run afoul of another legal infraction, like disturbing the peace MGL ch 272, s. 53 (and in the process render yourself no longer a suitable person for your LTC). Thus most unrestricted LTC-A holders carry concealed. LTC-B specifically prohibits carrying concealed ("shall not entitle the holder . . . to carry . . . in a concealed manner . . . ). LTC-B does let you carry, i.e. carry openly, but you still have to worry about disturbing the peace, getting shot by a cop, etc.
 
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https://malegislature.gov/Laws/GeneralLaws/PartI/TitleXX/Chapter140/Section131

MA laws states a Class B does not allow for the carrying of a concealed firearm. For class A it doesn't state it is illegal to carry it concealed so it is allowed. Like was stated law mostly tells us what we can't do. If it is restricted then it is legal.

(a) A Class A license shall entitle a holder thereof to purchase, rent, lease, borrow, possess and carry: (i) firearms, including large capacity firearms, and feeding devices and ammunition therefor, for all lawful purposes, subject to such restrictions relative to the possession, use or carrying of firearms as the licensing authority deems proper; and.......

(b) A Class B license shall entitle a holder thereof to purchase, rent, lease, borrow, possess and carry: (i) non-large capacity firearms and feeding devices and ammunition therefor, for all lawful purposes, subject to such restrictions relative to the possession, use or carrying of such firearm as the licensing authority deems proper; provided, however, that a Class B license shall not entitle the holder thereof to carry or possess a loaded firearm in a concealed manner in any public way or place;
 
brtt485 said:
If the CoP in Westfield, MA says its legal and the LEO questioning me in Weymouth disagrees what my CoP isn't going to help me!

I think the question in my original post is just more proof how completely ridiculous the firearms laws in this state are.

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Saw that too but that last part is NOT in the law books!
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Having lived in Weymouth for 25 years, I can tell you that the leo there is a d***! You can choose which particular one I am talking about.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
I think you're friend's cop buddy is f-ing with him. While I've seen and heard some pretty outrageously false information coming from LEOs about gun laws, this is so far off base as to be (almost) funny. How is it that this cop has never encounter someone carrying? On the off case this cop IS serious, he need to get reeducated before he does something that drags him and his employer into federal court.
 
The Massachusetts Supreme Judicial Court (the guys who have the final say on all laws in Massachusetts) say it's legal to carry concealed with a LTC-A.

See FIREARMS RECORDS BUREAU v. SIMKIN, 466 Mass. 168 (2013) http://masscases.com/cases/sjc/466/466mass168.html

However, Simkin is not responsible for alarm caused to others by his mere carrying of concealed weapons pursuant to a license permitting him to do exactly that.
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qqac said:
... LTC-B does let you carry, i.e. carry openly, but you still have to worry about disturbing the peace, getting shot by a cop, etc.
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Actually, LTC-B FORCES you to open carry, as concealed carry is NOT permitted.
 

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