Suppressors

[weekendracer]

Does anyone here shoot with a suppressor? I'm going to be getting at least one in .223 and one of the other calibers I have. Eventually, I'd like to have everything suppressable at some point.

I'm just wondering if the high end suppressors are worth the extra money or will the cheaper ones work well enough to knock down some of the sound.


My hearing is shot, I've been shooting with electronic muffs for the last year and it's helping I think, but I'm willing to spend a little money to save what's left of my hearing.

 

[TheWookie]

"I have heard" these work well and are an easy project.

Pay attention to the disclaimer at the beginning and continue at your own risk.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2787800760504732539

It's well worth the time and the money to obtain the necessary license from the BATF to build a suppressor. It's not illegal to make one or to own one if the proper paper work has been done, and the tax paid for.

As the video alluded too, the fines and imprisonment is nasty.

To your original question -- I have used suppressors, and they work just fine. No ear-pro is required.

 

[richc]

The OP is from Maine. I don't know the laws in Maine.

But am I correct in saying that suppressors are illegal in MA, with a few exceptions such as licensed manufacturers or police departments?

Just want to make sure there are no misconceptions among our group.

 

[TheWookie]

Suppressors are legal in Maine, illegal here unless you are federally licensed dealer, manufacturers, and the police; my bad for not clarifying that.

 

[weekendracer]

They sell them here in Maine, I'm guessing with the appropriate stamps they are legal. I'll be sure to stay legal in all aspects

There seems to be a huge price difference between Surefire and Gemtech, just wondering if the price difference is worth it.

I'll look into the build your own option. I know the background check isn't a big deal since they do one every so often as it stands.

 

[TheWookie]

They sell them here in Maine, I'm guessing with the appropriate stamps they are legal. I'll be sure to stay legal in all aspects

There seems to be a huge price difference between Surefire and Gemtech, just wondering if the price difference is worth it.

I'll look into the build your own option. I know the background check isn't a big deal since they do one every so often as it stands.

Your best bet is to buy one made for the weapon you're shooting, but you can make'em. Just be careful; I've heard stories of people being jacked up from not building them correctly. I have no experience building them. I'm was just a user.

 

[weekendracer]

Your best bet is to buy one made for the weapon you're shooting, but you can make'em. Just be careful; I've heard stories of people being jacked up from not building them correctly. I have no experience building them. I'm was just a user.

I'd imagine improperly fitted suppressors could lead to spectacular failures.

 

[iefstath]

they make a real difference...especially when shooting in newly "developed" areas. Gemtech makes some really nice cans especially for the price, depending on where in maine I can hook you up with a dealer I know. starting at 250 and going up + 200 tax stamp and your all set.

 

[P2A]

Stay away from GemTech. Go with a Surefire or AAC. They are better built have less shift from zero and in my opinion work better. I used a GemTech for a couple years and wouldnt use one again if I could help it. You get what you paid for.

 

[RI_John]

As an aside, I was thinking the other day, that were suppressors not ridiculously added to the 1934 NFA, most ranges would REQUIRE suppressors on every firearm to reduce "noise pollution". They would be just as common as ear plugs and eye protection are today. And we'd be bitching about how we hate having to use them and talking about "suppressor-free ranges" and how in FREE states ranges didn't require them.

 

[Mike S]

The suppressor law here in MA is one of the most frustrating, ignorant, laws on our books. Can't have loud motorcycles or cars, but let's keep those guns as loud as possible!

 

[Mike S]

As an aside, I was thinking the other day, that were suppressors not ridiculously added to the 1934 NFA, most ranges would REQUIRE suppressors on every firearm to reduce "noise pollution". They would be just as common as ear plugs and eye protection are today. And we'd be bitching about how we hate having to use them and talking about "suppressor-free ranges" and how in FREE states ranges didn't require them.

I was thinking the same thing, we must be careful what we ask for!

My favorite part of this story is the reasoning behind passing the law. In some ways not much has changed here in the PRM.

 

[andrew]

I have a couple of cans. I prefer SWR, but there are a lot of good manufacturers out there. As some other poster stated, you need to do the whole Form 4 dance to get it.

Keep in mind that to get the most out of the suppressor, sound-wise, you need to pair the can with subsonic ammo. As for the .223/5.56, there is no subsonic ammo that will cycle the AR/M16 platform. Regular supersonic ammo is almost as loud due to the supersonic crack of the bullet leaving the barrel. In other words, you'll still need ears to shoot a suppressed AR.

The .45 ACP is the perfect suppressed round. Subsonic in regular loads. I have a 9mm can and the noise difference between 147gr subsonic and standard rounds is shocking.

If you are going to spend the $200 on the transfer, I would get a high quality can. I would also get a variety of mounts, as a rifle/carbine mount is different from a pistol mount (recoil booster).

Silencertest.com and AR15.com have good info.

 

[cekim]

Keep in mind that to get the most out of the suppressor, sound-wise, you need to pair the can with subsonic ammo. As for the .223/5.56, there is no subsonic ammo that will cycle the AR/M16 platform. Regular supersonic ammo is almost as loud due to the supersonic crack of the bullet leaving the barrel. In other words, you'll still need ears to shoot a suppressed AR.

For us Ma**h***s, it would be an improvement just to not have the muzzle blast directed in our faces by breaks/comps...

My AR has plenty of boom that has nothing to do with the sound barrier...

 

[andrew]

For us Ma**h***s, it would be an improvement just to not have the muzzle blast directed in our faces by breaks/comps...

My AR has plenty of boom that has nothing to do with the sound barrier...

Some brakes are ridiculous. The Bushmaster "Mini-Y" is the loudest frigging brake I have ever heard. It is like shooting a fifty.

 

[TheWookie]

Keep in mind that to get the most out of the suppressor, sound-wise, you need to pair the can with subsonic ammo. As for the .223/5.56, there is no subsonic ammo that will cycle the AR/M16 platform. Regular supersonic ammo is almost as loud due to the supersonic crack of the bullet leaving the barrel. In other words, you'll still need ears to shoot a suppressed AR.

I'm not sure what ammo we used -- I assume it was military ball. But I've stood right beside somebody shooting a suppressed M-4, on full auto at times, and not heard anything but the sounds of a weapon cycling. I'm not sure if we're talking about the same thing, but that's my experience.

To test what we could hear, while somebody was shooting, we would walk off all different distances from the range and listen for noise,,, 75 yards away on a quiet day the sound was almost gone. At night we had to go out a little further. I'm not sure of the suppressor maker, might have been something "homemade" up at Quantico. Just my two cents....

 

[Flyer007]

http://www.tacticaledgeproducts.com/Rifleammo.html

 

[P2A]

Keep in mind that to get the most out of the suppressor, sound-wise, you need to pair the can with subsonic ammo. As for the .223/5.56, there is no subsonic ammo that will cycle the AR/M16 platform. Regular supersonic ammo is almost as loud due to the supersonic crack of the bullet leaving the barrel. In other words, you'll still need ears to shoot a suppressed AR.

Not true, that is a general fallacy about cans depending on their manufacture. Any new can that is made for govt/le is made to use issue ammo with. Ive used M855 and MK262 out of my GemTech and it was about as loud as a paintball gun. Ive used the OPS inc on the M24 using M118LR and it was as loud as a pellet gun. The only place the supersonic crack is going to matter is when your downrange of the weapon.

 

[andrew]

Not true, that is a general fallacy about cans depending on their manufacture. Any new can that is made for govt/le is made to use issue ammo with. Ive used M855 and MK262 out of my GemTech and it was about as loud as a paintball gun. Ive used the OPS inc on the M24 using M118LR and it was as loud as a pellet gun. The only place the supersonic crack is going to matter is when your downrange of the weapon.

Then I stand corrected. My experience is that subsonic is a whole lot quieter.

 

[gerrycaruso]

Suppressed firearms are not only fun to shoot,they offer advantages over unsuppressed firearms. They allow you to hear ricochets, which allows you to stop doing whatever you're doing wrong. They also make shooting more pleasant for new shooters. Talk to One Eyed Jack. He's the only guy I know with a suppressor on a shotgun and he made it.

 

[weekendracer]

Suppressed firearms are not only fun to shoot,they offer advantages over unsuppressed firearms. They allow you to hear ricochets, which allows you to stop doing whatever you're doing wrong. They also make shooting more pleasant for new shooters. Talk to One Eyed Jack. He's the only guy I know with a suppressor on a shotgun and he made it.

Thanks, I wasn't even thinking about suppressing the 870. Now something else I can look into.

 

[Twigg]

http://www.tacticaledgeproducts.com/Rifleammo.html

From the link:

Extreme Shock .223 (5.56mm NATO) Advanced, Subsonic Round, 100 grain, Hollow point, frangible ammunition. 975 fps, Box of 20

Designed for use with M4 style weapons, this round is tailored for use in close-quarters-combat scenarios, and will fully cycle in all modes of fire. Velocity of 975 fps provides controlled penetration in urban areas and other sensitive environments. When combined with a suppressor, the round enables super-quiet operation for both military and law enforcement. Will deliver MOA accuracy at 100 yards.

A few words to go with the link would be very useful.

Are you simply pointing out the availability of sub-sonic .223/5.56 ammo or have you actually used this ammo with a supressor ?

 

[one-eyed Jack]

Thanks, I wasn't even thinking about suppressing the 870. Now something else I can look into.

You can look up my post of 9-18-2008 under "firearms" to see how I built the suppressed shotgun. Your results may vary. Jack.

 

[Flyer007]

From the link:


A few words to go with the link would be very useful.

Are you simply pointing out the availability of sub-sonic .223/5.56 ammo or have you actually used this ammo with a supressor ?

Sorry was in a rush on that post. Just googled subsonic .223 to contribute to the talk. This seemed to be the most relevant link so posted it.

I only wish I had first hand experience with those in a suppressor.

 

[ShadeWPI]

I have shot several suppressed weapons, they are well worth it with a good suppressor.

.45 ACP is one of the best handgun rounds for a suppressor.

There is an advantage using sub-sonic ammunition in a supressed firearm, the crack is MUCH quieter than the concussive "BANG" from the expanding gasses, but there is still a "Crack" (the super-sonic crack tends to expand in a forward chevron from the muzzle, so if you're behind the muzzle, you don't really hear the crack. Also, directionally, the "crack" comes from the closest point of the bullets path rather than from the muzzle of the gun, which makes it much harder to place the shooter.

I have also shot an Ingram Mac-10 9mm with a "Devisator" suppressor (2 1/2" diameter 11" long suppressor, bigger than the Mac-10) with standed 9mm ammo, it was quiet but still noticable. When we loaded sub-sonic 9mm rounds into it, you could actually HEAR the mechanics of the weapon cycling. It's so wierd hearing the little clicks when shooting 30 rounds of 9mm and the last shell leaves the chamber before the first one hits the ground.

The last weapon I used with a suppressor was a 7.62x51mm. This was another BIG can, similar in size to the Mac-10's. Standing 15 feet left of the shooter and slightly forward of the end of the can, you could hear the crack. Laying next to the shooter (in a spotter's position) I was possible to make out the "click" of the firing pin on some shots.

As pointed out, for some pistols you'll need a "recoil booster" or barrel decoupler to help the action cycle. Perticularly guns that use a tilting barrel for the delayed recoil cycling.

 

[weekendracer]

I fired a similiar Mac 11, was pretty cool hearing the metal moving. Definate 'cool factor', but now I'm just looking for comfort.

 

[ShadeWPI]

Hearing the "click" of a Remington 700 hammer that's actually falling on a primer was pretty impressive and it makes following the bullet trail a lot easier (I'm not sure about everyone else, but I find it really hard not to blink in response to the concussion of an unsuppressed gunshot) I could follow the bullet's disturbance trail all the way to the target which make it a lot easier to correct the shooter on a miss. Walking a shooter into a target might be easy when you're shooting paper or near the back-stop, but when you're shooting at a hanging steel plate at 350 yards with a 1000 yard backstop, you have to see the bullet path to correct your shooter on a miss.

Spotter: "Sent It"
Rifle: Click-Pift
Range Officer: "Miss, Reengage"
Spotter: "3 Left, 1 Low"
Shooter: "Confirmed"
Spotter: "Send It"
Rifle: "Click-Pift"
Target: "Ding"
Range Officer: "Hit, Next Target"

 

[cekim]

but when you're shooting at a hanging steel plate at 350 yards with a 1000 yard backstop, you have to see the bullet path to correct your shooter on a miss.

300YD gong with a 700 in .308, I was all done blinking in plenty of time to see the berm hit if I missed... Not that I am admitting to missing (in which case, I'd clearly blame an ammo change or the guy sitting next to me).

I've actually stopped blinking with smaller calibers as a result of the ear-splitting break on my Colt and the big bang of the 700...

In fact, with an A2-style MA Legal break on a different AR, I wasn't even flinching on .223...

So, the lesson of this story is fire the biggest, loudest gun you can find to desensitize you to the smaller one you intend to use...

That said, I think we should all sue the state for hearing loss caused by their policies on silencers... (of course I am kidding, such a lawsuit would have all manner of unpleasant unintended consequences, but we should be free to use them...)

 

[Franco]

this may sound stupid, but my co-worker(a fudd) told me to try a ballon on the muzzle end of a .22lr as a suppressor. it works good only for one shot though obviously. i still havent tried anybody know if this works?

 

[Flyer007]

this may sound stupid, but my co-worker(a fudd) told me to try a ballon on the muzzle end of a .22lr as a suppressor. it works good only for one shot though obviously. i still havent tried anybody know if this works?

Don't.......felony illegal. Per the suppressor laws we have been discussing.

basically having any object that attempts to muffle the sound is illegal without following the NFA paths we have discussed.