Steel cased ammo use at the range

[mac1911]

This is where I got it from.....this copy paste is from pew pew tactical article on steel vs brass. I've read this case elsewhere too

Now take for example, surplus AKs running around. These rifles can, if not properly tuned, rip the heads clean off of softer brass cases. This is because, in general, the tolerances are not as tight on these guns and they extract with much more force than most brass-cased ammo is designed to tolerate.

So my conclusion, from reading these is that they were designed to extract hard.....cuz steel. So.....there's that.

Yeah , no
Properly tuned AK... thats a joke right.
Aks designed for steel, I dont think so
Borris can you chime in?

yet “they” say tugo slave brass cased surplus is the best.
It your ripping case heads off its probanly because of excessive head space and steel will seperate just as well with excessive head space.
Fun stuff

 

[whacko]

Yeah , no
Properly tuned AK... thats a joke right.
Aks designed for steel, I dont think so
Borris can you chime in?

yet “they” say tugo slave brass cased surplus is the best.
It your ripping case heads off its probanly because of excessive head space and steel will seperate just as well with excessive head space.
Fun stuff

It's just what I've read.

What do I know.

If you read back to my first post about it....I said "it's my understanding that....." which generally means someone is not claiming total undeniable fact....but something that has been claimed by someone else.

 

[drgrant]

Now take for example, surplus AKs running around. These rifles can, if not properly tuned, rip the heads clean off of softer brass cases. This is because, in general, the tolerances are not as tight on these guns and they extract with much more force than most brass-cased ammo is designed to tolerate.

So my conclusion, from reading these is that they were designed to extract hard.....cuz steel. So.....there's that.

If an AK is tearing off brass caseheads, something is wrong with the rifle. Seriously wrong.

 

[whacko]

If an AK is tearing off brass caseheads, something is wrong with the rifle. Seriously wrong.

I don't disagree with you. I didn't write the article.

 

[jkelly1229]

How about the hunting ammo that literally cooks the animal when you shoot it?
Do those ranges allow that?

No they don't like incendiary ammo either.

Listen I thought it was far fetched until I saw that Brazilian gun range blow the f up.

I've heard it like 45 times poking around a few gunshop indoor ranges it's a thing they believe.... and they take seriously... granite state in Hudson says it all the time.

I've heard bi metal beats the piss out of steel too.. personally idc I go to an outdoor range but this is said at these places

 

[drgrant]

No they don't like incendiary ammo either.

Listen I thought it was far fetched until I saw that Brazilian gun range blow the f up.

I've heard it like 45 times poking around a few gunshop indoor ranges it's a thing they believe.... and they take seriously... granite state in Hudson says it all the time.

I've heard bi metal beats the piss out of steel too.. personally idc I go to an outdoor range but this is said at these places

Glock had a test range "blow up" like that too, I think the fire was minor enough it only injured one or two people though.

The real deal IMHO is not fire though, its backstop damage.

 

[jkelly1229]

Glock had a test range "blow up" like that too, I think the fire was minor enough it only injured one or two people though.

The real deal IMHO is not fire though, its backstop damage.

I've also heard because of the damage it can cause ricochets to not bounce in the trap. If they hit a pitted spot and bounce back.

Who knows public ranges are terrifying enough with out worrying about that stuff

 

[drgrant]

I've also heard because of the damage it can cause ricochets to not bounce in the trap. If they hit a pitted spot and bounce back.

Who knows public ranges are terrifying enough with out worrying about that stuff

Well, that, but there's a human interface/workflow/testing problem with bullets that magnets stick to, also. Some guy brings in AP or true steel core, and your backstop/bullet trap is getting f***ed up. So you have a dude with a baggie of rifle ammo and both stick to a magnet. You going to trust the guy that its only "bi metal" or not? Nobody has time to cut open a bullet to find out. For places that have bullet traps, it's far easier to just ban rifle ammo that a magnet sticks to.

 

[AHM]

No they don't like incendiary ammo either.

It was a facetious allusion to this pinhead:


Only the fact that I'd read once before about the unburned powder thing
(without even a cite to an instance) kept my reply light and airy.

 

[jkelly1229]

It was a facetious allusion to this pinhead:


Only the fact that I'd read once before about the unburned powder thing
(without even a cite to an instance) kept my reply light and airy.

They would get really pissy if you started lighting off tracers lol.

 

[scheming]

Dracut on target

I'd say it's because they don't like sorting out the steel and aluminum but realize that those two cartridges are most always steel case so allow it.

Kinda dumb as they sell Red Army in 9mm, which is steel cased. So buy ammo from us, but you can't use it on our range...

 

[drgrant]

Kinda dumb as they sell Red Army in 9mm, which is steel cased. So buy ammo from us, but you can't use it on our range...

Someone else said they allow it now.

 

[BOOTKNIFEFAN]

In what context? Where did you copy-paste that from?

Certain cartridges and guns work best with steel cases, like 7.62x39, 7.62x54r, 7.92x57, 5.45x39, and 9x18. In other guns, steel can cause issues.

I ran steel cased ammo through my .223 Savage Axis without a single problem.

 

[mac1911]

I ran steel cased ammo through my .223 Savage Axis without a single problem.

Well except one problem, consistent accuracy!

 

[556USER]

That is from a local range. It says no steel case unless it is in that caliber. Steel case is not allowed at the range in other calibers for some reason. If it is bad for the range why is it allowed for that round.

Probably guys who make the rules there have lots of those calibers in steel so they made a rule which insures that THEY can shoot THEIR ammo. LOL

 

[mac1911]

Kinda dumb as they sell Red Army in 9mm, which is steel cased. So buy ammo from us, but you can't use it on our range...

If they sell it they know what it is. Red Army may not use steel jackets.

 

[mac1911]

The steel used is soft as shit.
Theres another video out there also i just cant find it. The steel jackets are soft too. Will it wear out a barrel faster than copper? At the price point if your shooting enough to wear out your barrel , what does it matter. The money you save can easily buy a new barrel.
if your worried about barrel wear you should shoot low pressure cast loads like 22lr

View: https://youtu.be/qBAh_8usXBI

 

[BOOTKNIFEFAN]

Well except one problem, consistent accuracy!

Got me on paper. Fine-tuned with Federal M193 55 grain ball.

 

[LuvDog]

Do they allow you to pick up your spent cases? If not, then I'd find another range. Or only use cases that have been loaded many times and are ready for scrap anyway

 

[whacko]

That's why these indoor ranges have these rules - they sell the brass cases to be commercial reloads or melted down or whatever.

The indoor ranges I've been to usually politely ask if I want to keep the brass and or have a rule that anything that goes beyond the firing line is theirs. Which I'm cool with because of safety issues - there's always that one person who'll try to scrounge brass on a hot range.

Had a guy at the range one time using one of those pincher things old people use to reach the top cabinets....to reach forward of the firing line while the line was hot. He was reaching WAY over the line and someone called cease fire and asked him to stop because he was well leaned way over....so safety.....and also distracting to shooters. A small argument ensued.....and and finally decided to back down and wait for a cold range to collect his brass. It was funny to watch.

 

[firestorm]

Again.....the post is a about steel CASE ammo not steel or bimetal projectiles.

Your point a out steel projos does not apply here.

I have heard that the issue with ranges who prohibit this stuff is they don't want their ROs to have to make decisions, so anything a magnet sticks to is out. Since the case is steel, the magnet sticks and it's a no go. This way you don't have some minimum wage moron making decisions based on how hard the magnet sticks or if it really is the bullet it is sticking to rather than the case and have some a**h*** shooting steel core or AP and wrecking up the backstop.

 

[scheming]

If they sell it they know what it is. Red Army may not use steel jackets.

We're talking about steel CASE not jackets. RAS is definitely steel cased.

 

[AHM]

We're talking about steel CASE not jackets. RAS is definitely steel cased.

Maybe I'm easily impressed,
but an ammo brand Reasonable Articulable Suspicion
sounds pretty kickass.

 

[mac1911]

We're talking about steel CASE not jackets. RAS is definitely steel cased.

Right , i get it. But if a range bans steel cased ammo BUT will let you buy steel cased ammo from them they know is not steel jacket then I can see that.
Anyhow clubs/ranges make up their own rules. Dont like the rules dont go or become active in rules committee at your club.

clubs/ranges that blanket ban steel ammo is usually because the dont allow steel core or AP ammo. Its just easier to blanket ban stuff that attracts a magnet vs figuring out if its the case , jacket or core.

the aluminum case? Does aluminum cased ammo generally come with bimetal jackets? If not they just dont want to sort the shit so they get a better price at the scrap yard

is there alot of brass cased ammo with bimetal jackets? Only stuff I have come across is M2 ball HXP ?

 

[Deleted member 67409]

is there alot of brass cased ammo with bimetal jackets? Only stuff I have come across is M2 ball HXP ?

M80 or L2A2 7.62 NATO can be bimetal. American Eagle/Federal, PMC (Korean) surplus, Malay L2A2.

 

[mac1911]

M80 or L2A2 7.62 NATO can be bimetal. American Eagle/Federal, PMC (Korean) surplus, Malay L2A2.

Dont shoot much if any 7.62 Nato M80
I run reloads with sierra or nosler bullets in my 308 garand and M1a

 

[rscalzo]

How does a steel CASE chew up steel plates or cause ricochet? The case is steel not necessarily the projo.

Not necessarily. A lot of steel cased ammo has a bullet that can be picked up by a magnet. So the bullet is not lead but something probably much harder.

 

[whacko]

Not necessarily. A lot of steel cased ammo has a bullet that can be picked up by a magnet. So the bullet is not lead but something probably much harder.

Right. And there is a crap ton of steel case ammobthay doesn't have a bimetal or steel core projo as well. Tula, red army standard, and silver bear have standard copper jacketed lead and steel case. Your a little late to the party anyway......your exact statatemet you've made here has been hashed out on this post.....like 3 times already.

 

[mac1911]

Not necessarily. A lot of steel cased ammo has a bullet that can be picked up by a magnet. So the bullet is not lead but something probably much harder.

Theres also bullets out there with zinc jackets,
If steel jacketed is damaging your plates you have crappy steel plates or your using the wrong steel at the wrong distance with ammo not rated for the plate to begin with.

 

[bmac10]

Some outdoor private clubs don’t appreciate steel cases either. I was told It chews up the steel (cuz bi-metal) and has a higher chance of ricochet. My club has magnets here and there to check for bi-metal bullets. Not sure if true or not because I see steel cases every time I’m there.

I think you are talking about steel core, not steel cases