New Roster is up!!

P365 was probably due to the setbacks they suffered in Jan. Next list, I guess. :(

That and Sig is already preparing the 365 with the MA Compliant safety. It has a look like the switch that Dr. Frankenstein throws in the classic movie. It's more of a switch with a gun attached to it. LOL

(Just kidding - there is no safety switch that I know of. Of course I still can't figure out why they put one on the P320.)
 
igrace7092 said:
Does this mean 1. You don't have to be police to buy one and 2. Did the value of these just plummet after I paid a premium for one?
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No, glocks have been on for a while. For a dealer to sell you one they need to be on the roster AND meet the EOPS safety guidelines. No dealer will sell you a new one because they don’t meet the EOPS safety features (they said the loaded chamber indicator isn’t indicator-y enough). No change.

Dennis in MA said:
Of course I still can't figure out why they put one on the P320.
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The Army contract required one, and they designed the FCU to have it easily removable for the civilian market. Just as easy to add it back in to sell to MA.
 
uwaeve said:
No, glocks have been on for a while. For a dealer to sell you one they need to be on the roster AND meet the EOPS safety guidelines. No dealer will sell you a new one because they don’t meet the EOPS safety features (they said the loaded chamber indicator isn’t indicator-y enough). No change.



The Army contract required one, and they designed the FCU to have it easily removable for the civilian market. Just as easy to add it back in to sell to MA.
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There is no requirement that I know of to have a safety on a striker fire autoloading pistol in mass to make "the list". M and p pistols are on the bullshit list with.....and without the safety.
 
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whacko said:
Another common error I hear all the time is that there is a requirement for the mass list that a striker fired pistol have a manual safety. There is no such requirement.
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Yup, and Glocks are a prime example of that. Just can't buy em cos the AGs got a hair across their ass about them.
 
I don't know what the magic voodoo is to not get shut down for selling certain guns as a dealer. However, if you look at the guns we are talking about, they have some sort of external safety mechanism: the VP9 has a trigger leaf and the M&P has the two-piece pivoting trigger safety. The P320 has neither, so it stands to reason that they would add an external safety in the simplest way possible: re-instate it from the FCU designed for the Army contract. I realize the EOPS safety regulations say nothing about an external safety, but this feels intuitively like the route that is being taken: inclusion of some sort of external safety that is either defeated or disabled.

A lot of it seems to be subjective/political anyhow. Like the determination that the chamber loaded indicator is not indicative enough seems like a simple way to just ban the most popular handgun in the world.
 
uwaeve said:
No, glocks have been on for a while. For a dealer to sell you one they need to be on the roster AND meet the EOPS safety guidelines. No dealer will sell you a new one because they don’t meet the EOPS safety features (they said the loaded chamber indicator isn’t indicator-y enough). No change.



The Army contract required one, and they designed the FCU to have it easily removable for the civilian market. Just as easy to add it back in to sell to MA.
Click to expand...

Varmint said:
Army requested it I think.
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I meant no idea why SIG would offer THAT pistol versus the other ones. Maybe because it was the only single-sized gun they had in the 320 line? Hard to have to submit a full/compact/subcompact if you only have a compact. 19th century rules for 21st century guns. :(
 
whacko said:
Another common error I hear all the time is that there is a requirement for the mass list that a striker fired pistol have a manual safety. There is no such requirement.
Click to expand...
The EOPS list which is the list that actually exists you are completely correct. The requirements for testing are all called out in MGL chp 140 sec 123.

The issue is the AG CMRs that govern consumer practices. They want a number of things, of which the key two are to paraphrase "average 5yr old cant fire" and "loaded chamber indicator".

Glocks run afoul of the LCI requirement. Dont ask for objective reasoning; there is none.

To deal with the 5yr old rule you have some options. One is multiple actions required to fire. A safety constitutes multiple actions. Another is a 10lb trigger. That S&W puts a safety AND a 10lb trigger on their compliant guns escapes me.
 
Dennis in MA said:
I meant no idea why SIG would offer THAT pistol versus the other ones. Maybe because it was the only single-sized gun they had in the 320 line? Hard to have to submit a full/compact/subcompact if you only have a compact. 19th century rules for 21st century guns. :(
Click to expand...

Apparently there is a market in MA for having a safety on a striker fired gun. Even though the regular P320 non-safety version was available at the same time, some posters here were excited about the safety version.
shrg-1.gif
 
CrackPot said:
The EOPS list which is the list that actually exists you are completely correct. The requirements for testing are all called out in MGL chp 140 sec 123.

The issue is the AG CMRs that govern consumer practices. They want a number of things, of which the key two are to paraphrase "average 5yr old cant fire" and "loaded chamber indicator".

Glocks run afoul of the LCI requirement. Dont ask for objective reasoning; there is none.

To deal with the 5yr old rule you have some options. One is multiple actions required to fire. A safety constitutes multiple actions. Another is a 10lb trigger. That S&W puts a safety AND a 10lb trigger on their compliant guns escapes me.
Click to expand...

I'm quite confident my 4 year old could fire a VP9. There's no point looking for logic in the AG's actions.
 
TomMontana said:
Apparently there is a market in MA for having a safety on a striker fired gun. Even though the regular P320 non-safety version was available at the same time, some posters here were excited about the safety version.
shrg-1.gif
Click to expand...
Well....like I said...there are mass gun owners that think ansemi auto has to have a manual safety by law.

Case in point....I brought my new in box m and p 45 to the club the day I bought it a few years ago. A couple of fellers were there already shooting. I unboxed it to get ready to try it out and the usual "hey whatcagot there" conversation ensued. They took a look and one says "wow no safety...in mass you better not get caught with that"! I gave em the wtf look and he says.......you have to have a manual safety on a semi auto in mass it's illegal without one. I tried for about a minute to splain it to them......but they wanted nothing of it.
 
Wait. You peeps have seen safety-free MA-approved P320's???? Months ago, I looked high and low. All anyone had in MA were 9mm C's with the abomination safety.
 
Dennis in MA said:
Wait. You peeps have seen safety-free MA-approved P320's???? Months ago, I looked high and low. All anyone had in MA were 9mm C's with the abomination safety.
Click to expand...
The p320 is on the list. So good from that perspective. To meet the AG CMRs it needs an LCI and something to deal with the 5yr old rule. Given the single piece trigger and < 10lbs the only way is a manual safety. The "official" MA compliant p320 has an LCI and a safety. No non-MA versions of the p320 have the LCI. Black and white compliance with law and AG means only the sig identified compliant version with safety and LCI is sellable by a dealer unless someone does some parts juggling of some sort.

Of course since you can get new glocks in MA, I am sure you can get a p320 w/o a safety...
 

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