is the 12ga an option?

[FPrice]

I do not have a long gun of any sort. I've always been a handgun guy. Civil unrest has forced me to do a new analysis. I know I need something. I just don't know enough about long guns to know what I need.

Your best bet may be to make friends with a few long-gun owners and try out their toys.

 

[SHOCKNAWE]

I do not have a long gun of any sort. I've always been a handgun guy. Civil unrest has forced me to do a new analysis. I know I need something. I just don't know enough about long guns to know what I need.

Honestly you could get a very serviceable Shotgun for short money, I’d get one of those immediately and research Semi Auto Carbine/Rifle options and go from there.

 

[PappyM3]

You would think that if shotguns were preferable in urban combat, there'd be a big push for shotgun training in the Marines. Has there been?

View attachment 389478

Eh, Marine Corps shotgun training quality heavily depends on the school/instructors. Sometimes you’ll get silly stuff like this:

 

[Buck F]

I do not have a long gun of any sort. I've always been a handgun guy. Civil unrest has forced me to do a new analysis. I know I need something. I just don't know enough about long guns to know what I need.

If you're getting something for civil unrest, get a rifle, particularly if you're not overly experienced w/ long guns. A 12 Gauge has a lot of recoil, particularly for someone who hasn't shot one much. First shot may be ok but good luck getting the second one on target. Ballistically you don't gain much, if anything, and you give up capacity, accuracy, distance & handling (particularly if you go w/ a pump). Think about Kyle Rittenhouse on the ground w/ a pump, it may have been a very different outcome. Rifle Vs Shotgun? Rifle wins every time.

The AR15 is easy to shoot, particularly for beginners. It's modular, there are plenty of options, it's great from 5 yards and 200 yards (hopefully you'll never need that). The AK is a good option as is the Mini14. Shotgun spread is overrated, anywhere within a legitimate self defense distance and you're probably looking at a fist sized pattern. You're not going to take out multiple attackers w/ one round nor are you going to be any more successful shooting form the hip than you will with a rifle.

 

[Climbnsink]

The likelihood of one of us ending up in the streets with antifa and having prior choice of longarm is pretty darn nonexistent. If you don't have any long guns the advice to get a basic shotgun is great. Figure out a battle(ish) rifle after. 20 gauge is plenty killy, 410 slugs have similar muzzle energy to 44 magnums. Not saying buy a smaller gun(cause I think that is against the rules) but if you end up with something smaller than a 12 it will still work. The other option for a get it now long gun would be a 10/22 not very high on the killy scale(good enough for the IDF anti riot cops) still a good thing to have laying around. Plenty useful even if the world turns peaceful.

 

[Emacs]

I think if you reframe it as "how many rounds do I need in a gunfight," the question answers itself.

 

[Talon3]

I believe accuracy will trump platform, get a 10/22, grab a Mosin, sks, m1, ar, ak, .410, 12g, 10g, go handgun plastic, or steel, .380, 9mm, .40, .45. Each will have pros and cons given a specific scenario. When all is said and done, its going to be using the platform you have ready access to at the moment the situation presents itself. The cover in the area that can be used. The accuracy of the shooter and platform working together. The ammo power, load and projectile. What it strikes armor, heavy winter clothing, summer clothing, bare skin. Step 1 get a gun. Step 2 train and try different loads of ammo to find what works best. Not necessarily powerful, but what recoil is best for the shooter, with the fastest target requisition, while hitting the aimed at target.
Rifle would be my first choice something in 5.56 easy to carry plenty of extra mags. Weight is not fatiguing, good sling setup. Next id prefer a handgun 9 with hollow points for real up close combat. Shot gun would be a bunkered type defensive choice. Think zombie apocalypse in a 2nd fl or higher position covering an entrance while team members searched for loot in the building. Spraying down buck shot, in effect holding back a group while the team arrived with rifles for precision work. Make no mistake gun fights would have a huge psychological effect. A crowd seeing the devastating damage may or may not retreat. Some may even be further encouraged to fight.
No matter what you get train as you would fight, so you fight like you trained. Practice early and often. Practice off hand and one hand weak and strong in case your wounded.

 

[GML]

Good afternoon, braintrust. In all of these clips and pics of both antifa and the conservatives, I see alot of ar's and ak's and some other rifles. It seems from all the pics that the environment in which conflict would occur is urban; short distances and buildings etc. Would a good old 12 ga be effective in this environment?

Let's hear it please. Pro's and con's

Shotgun would not be my first choice outside the home. Inside the home, 12ga is definitely my first choice.

 

[Quite_Exasperated]

The bureau still issues and trains with shotguns...mighty intimidating in CQ and hard to miss..

 

[frenchman]

IMO, can't really beat a 300 blacky with a 8.5-11 inch barrel for HD. Hits harder than 5.56, is quick around the corner, 30rd capacity, low recoil, and no need for a stamp if you throw a brace on. Put a LAW folder on it, and the folded (but not shootable) package is well below 20 inches. Or go all out (and don't you think I haven't thought about it) and get one of the Brownell's TRN180 upper/lower kits, and have a folder that can fire when folded. Badass.

 

[PappyM3]

IMO, can't really beat a 300 blacky with a 8.5-11 inch barrel for HD. Hits harder than 5.56, is quick around the corner, 30rd capacity, low recoil, and no need for a stamp if you throw a brace on. Put a LAW folder on it, and the folded (but not shootable) package is well below 20 inches. Or go all out (and don't you think I haven't thought about it) and get one of the Brownell's TRN180 upper/lower kits, and have a folder that can fire when folded. Badass.

I’m starting to get enticed into building a Preban lower with a foldy stock and an MCX upper with a few barrels, including a 6.75” or 8” 300blk. ... but they’re fleeting in availability now. Brownells 180 is another option, but I think their shortest 300 blk is 10.3”.

 

[frenchman]

Yeah, well, for now, all 300BO ammo seems to have a unicorn dick core, because it's unobtainium. My 8.5 with LAW device works like a Thai hooker, but I keep my last 250 rounds for the zombies. It's just a truck gun tho. Everything else is 5.56 or 6.5 CM, which are infinitely easier to feed right now

 

[Mtn_Guy]

Very common. Over-sexualized by a more experienced older but still young woman who gets to club and bang all the guys she wants, while you’re still a young teen and most of the normal girls in your grade are prudes...besides the chicks with issues giving it away and hooking up with them would be social suicide. So you are caught between a rock and a hard place dependent upon the older woman for affection and passion while she uses that an exerts her dominance over you and plays mind games with you. It’s good when it starts but then it takes its toll psychologically and physically, as you’re still a young kid and can’t give the older woman all that she wants sexually, she’s been playing the long game the whole time and waiting for you to get sprung.

ETA: This is kind of like the Finch from American Pie syndrome when he hooks up with Stifler’s mom, but its also a very common phenomenon.

I recently did an analysis of the area around my house to really see what was really in my line of fire, especially if I had to use a long gun.

By my rough estimate there are houses in about 300 degrees of a circular pattern around my house that are within a fastball distance of me. The other 60 degrees are clear (within sight) but not all offer clear paths to my house without a lot of clearing.

For this reason I am leaning towards my 870 (7+1) with 00 Buck and a large capacity pistol on my hip. I will still keep my carbine ready for real SHTF scenarios,

YMMV.

This may not be the "best" video, but it's an example of what is out there.

How has no one commented yet on this guy in the video being such a Mall Ninja wing-nut?

 

[Mtn_Guy]

As for the long gun debate, I vote you get BOTH. You can get a used Maverick 88 for short money and find a few boxes of shells to practice with while robbing your kid’s piggy bank and searching the couch cushions for enough coin to buy 5.56 ammo... which will cost you as much as a low-end AR at this point.

AKs tend to have more felt recoil than the AR platform and AR parts tend to be more common to source, so since you’re newer to long guns I’d tell you to pick up an AR with a decent iron sights or optic and get out and train with it