I Need NICS Appeal / VAF UPIN Advice

[TimMcG74]

I am hoping some fellow NES'ers can provide some insight on a problem I have. I recently got my LTC-A after an appeal to the Licensing Review Board. I tried to buy my first handgun this weekend (which was a mint condition used Walther P99c at a great price) ; NICS came back with a delay, then a denial. Clearly, (and I should have anticipated this) NICS does not talk to the Massachusetts Criminal Records Board, who have restored my firearms rights in Massachusetts. Of course, my next course of action is to buy something FTF.

So, I understand how to appeal this denial, and I also understand how to apply for a VAF UPIN. What isn't clear to me is if I have to appeal the denial sucessfully before I apply for a VAF UPIN.


Thoughts on this?


Thanks for your input.

 

[waltherlover]

I can only tell you that having gone through the VAF process (I would get delay, but no deny), it was pretty painless. I sent in the form, a letter, and the fingerprint cards. About six weeks later, I got my UPIN and it's worked like a champ ever since.

You may want to try to actually contact someone in NICS, or the FBI. You might call an ATF field agent in Boston and ask if they know anything about it, or maybe have a contact for you.

Also, you might be federally prohibited from buying guns, even though you are legal in MA. See the sticky about "Are you a federally prohibited person" in the MA gun laws area. Many people get FIDs in MA after waiting five years after their conviction, only to get charged federally when they bought a firearms. It's a slippery slope. The fact that you were denied could be a very bad thing in that regard.

There's a good bit in that sticky that explains the difference in felony definitions Fed vs. State, etc. You might also want to consider (your probably already have) hiring a firearms lawyer to straighten this out. The only good thing about the federal regulations is they are very clear, unlike our wonderful state laws and regulations (many of which you can't easily obtain).

You might also want to have this thread moved to MA, since you're in the general laws area, and I don't think anyone goes there - I may be wrong, though. Since you are really more concerned now with your federal issues, you should do some googling and see what you can find, you can't be the only person that's been stuck in this rut. You might also try some of the other (numerous) gun forums - again, you're in the federal realm now rather than state specific.

I will conclude this by pointing out that I am not a lawyer, just one that pays close attention to firearms laws. You really have to in MA, or you'll break a law without knowing it.

 

[lord1234]

worst comes to worst call Jesse.

 

[terraformer]

I knew this was going to be an issue the other day when I pointed it out, but I didn't know the answer on what you needed specifically and hoped someone else did or that ATF would have the info you need in their application docs. You definitely need the UPIN (that's the appeal file for them to put your letter of restoration in) so at least do that one. You may also need to do the appeal in this case because you were denied. Did you call ATF or your attorney?

 

[terraformer]

Also, you might be federally prohibited from buying guns.

He's not. Everything else in your post doesn't apply. He posted recently that his rights were restored fully.

 

[terraformer]

Can I apply for the VAF the same time I am appealing a NICS deny? You must first appeal your NICS denial decision. After the successful completion of your appeal, you will then be notified if you are a good candidate for the VAF. If you are a good candidate for the VAF, a VAF packet will be sent to you along with the overturn response letter and overturn appeal certificate.

http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/nics/appeals/nics-appeals-process/appeal-faq.pdf
Google is your friend. You definitely need both and in the order of Appeal and then UPIN. Go to the FFL and get the denial number (blah-blah-N something or other) ASAP so it is easy to find.

 

[waltherlover]

He's not. Everything else in your post doesn't apply. He posted recently that his rights were restored fully.

Right restored fully in MA - but the Feds look at things a bit differently. Definitely worth a call to the ATF as a start, and maybe the FBI. IIRC, the FBI does the NICS checks.

Read the sticky in the MA laws forum...

 

[TimMcG74]

Right restored fully in MA - but the Feds look at things a bit differently. Definitely worth a call to the ATF as a start, and maybe the FBI. IIRC, the FBI does the NICS checks.

Read the sticky in the MA laws forum...

I read that sticky before I went through my appeal, but thank you. Jesse represented me during that process, and I plan to run this question by him if can't find an answer on my own. My understanding is that the Feds recognize a restoration of rights by the Mass FLRB, I am just not clear on how to demonstrate that I have been granted relief. I am going to call customer service tomorrow.

 

[terraformer]

Right restored fully in MA - but the Feds look at things a bit differently. Definitely worth a call to the ATF as a start, and maybe the FBI. IIRC, the FBI does the NICS checks.

Read the sticky in the MA laws forum...

From everything he has said here, he is good to go with his appeal. He has another thread here where he detailed what he did to get his rights restored. They are fully restored by the state he lives and was convicted in which makes things nice and simple. So he has his federal rights restored.

 

[terraformer]

I read that sticky before I went through my appeal, but thank you. Jesse represented me during that process, and I plan to run this question by him if can't find an answer on my own. My understanding is that the Feds recognize a restoration of rights by the Mass FLRB, I am just not clear on how to demonstrate that I have been granted relief. I am going to call customer service tomorrow.

They didn't give you a letter? I thought they give a letter detailing their decision. That should be what you need. But do call and ask ATF. They would know best. Good luck.

 

[TimMcG74]

Thank you, Terra for your great advice on both this and my previous thread. I have a detailed letter from the FLRB that states that my rights have been restored, and I assumed that my recourse was to send that to the Feds, I just wasn't sure if I needed to appeal THEN appply for UPIN, or if applying for UPIN with the inclusion of my proof of restoration was enough. Like I said, I have some calls to make tomorrow. I just wanted to make sure I was as informed as possible beforehand.

 

[Len-2A Training]

Do both at the same time. You can be sure that two different departments handle these issues . . . after all it is the gov't and efficiency isn't even in their dictionaries.

Good luck.

 

[TimMcG74]

I just talked to NICS customer service and they advised me to go through the appeals process first, and then apply for a VAF UPIN. Apparently, applying for both at the same time could result in erroneous info in my UPIN file. The back log right now is 118 days.

 

[spinto]

I just talked to NICS customer service and they advised me to go through the appeals process first, and then apply for a VAF UPIN. Apparently, applying for both at the same time could result in erroneous info in my UPIN file. The back log right now is 118 days.

Did you ever get this worked out? I'm in the same situation. Let me know if your appeal ever went through.