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I admit, I Know Squat About Glocks

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Secesh

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I've never owned, fired or held one. 1911's are pretty much the only thing I've owned. However I was reading a thread on an automotive forum dealing with buying a new 1911. One of the comments was as follows:

A good friend of mine is a competitive shooter and he competes with Wilson Combat pistols. If he were to be able to choose only one gun to carry for the rest of his days he said he would choose a Glock for their reliability in harsh conditions.

I couldn't help but wonder just how the 1911 has managed to make it through almost a century of every combat condition possible. Was it luck?
 
I couldn't help but wonder just how the 1911 has managed to make it through almost a century of every combat condition possible. Was it luck?
Click to expand...

Well, Glocks haven't been around for 100 years yet so we can't say Glocks lack of a century long record proves anything.
 
Gee, 1911 vs Glock it’s not something I’ve ever considered before. :)

Good luck!


Respectfully,

jkelly
 
Glocks and 1911s each have distinct advantages not enjoyed by the other - which is why I have several of each :).
 
Rob Boudrie said:
Glocks and 1911s each have distinct advantages not enjoyed by the other - which is why I have several of each :).
Click to expand...

A+, that comment is generally the main thing missing in every Glock vs. 1911 thread.

The 1911 has endured for such a long period of time because it is a testament to engineering and in over 100 years very little has changed with it. Cant say that about a lot of things.

Glocks are great guns as well for all of your SHTF, carry, drop from a helicopter needs...it is the foundation for the newer age of firerms.

But you really cannot compare the two of them, though many do.
 
Quite impressive. I can't explain all of this, but I can offer two observations that might be of interest.

At the time the GM was being designed, reliability and accuracy were considered a trade-off, based on barrel bushing clearance. Make it loose and the pistol will accept more crud without failing; make it tight and the pistol will shoot tighter groups.

What the modern bushingless designs have demonstrated (or at least some of them), is that you can do both. The muzzle is fairly loose in the slide for crud tolerance, but the effect of the recoil spring is to force the muzzle down into what is (if you examine it real carefully) a wide V-notch, so that it tends to end up in the same place notwithstanding the wide forward end tolerance. Sort of like the old V-notch "spool" mounts used with B&L externally-adjusted rifle scopes in the 60s and 70s. See http://www.hegibbs.com/scopes.htm Riding a round object in a V-notch is a time-honored machinist's technique for jig repeatability.

Second, the Glock has one advantage over, say, the SIG for this type of testing. It is striker fired and, therefore, has no external hammer that must be able to slip into its recess in the rear of the slide in order to whack the pin. The external hammer can be a focal point of dropped-in-the-field crud-induced failures to fire.
 
M1911 said:
The obligatory 1911 versus Glock bashing thread, round 3075. This should be fun.

[popcorn]
Click to expand...

Believe me, I have a lock oiled and ready for this thread (no offense to the original poster).

Rob Boudrie said:
Glocks and 1911s each have distinct advantages not enjoyed by the other - which is why I have several of each :).
Click to expand...

EXACTLY!!! Let's all try to get along. The 1911s and Glocks in my safe don't fight. The 1911 is my favorite auto to shoot, the Glock is my favorite one to carry.
 
Glock vs. 1911

The Glock is the AK47 of the handgun world. They are reliable and take incredible abuse and keep functioning. Easy to field strip and clean. Very user friendly. If I could only have one handgun it would be a Glock. The new M&P shows promise but it`s to new to judge it`s reliability vs. a Glock. I own a G22 & G23, a M&P40 and a S&W 1911.
 
Same for me. 1911's feel right in my hand. they're really easy to shoot.

I like glocks, too, though. I like everything that goes 'bang'.
 
I also weigh in favoring the Glock. I readily admit that the bulk of 1911's (with some notable exceptions) are much finer pieces of hardware in the build quality and accuracy dept, but for SHTF/Home defense/Zombie attack etc, I'll take my Glock(s) any day of the week.

Oddly enough, I've had extraordinary bad luck with almost every 1911 I've ever picked up. I've shot a few Para's (owned the atrocious Warthog), at least two Smiths and one or two others, and I only remember one gun successfully making it through a full mag without jamming. I know this may not be the norm, but it certainly gives me pause when shooting another one (let alone ever considering owning one).

FWIW, the one 1911 that I've shot that actually worked was Eddie Coyle's, and it was pleasant to shoot.

YMWILLV, I'm quite sure.

Just my .02.
 
Fooped said:
Oddly enough, I've had extraordinary bad luck with almost every 1911 I've ever picked up. I've shot a few Para's (owned the atrocious Warthog), at least two Smiths and one or two others, and I only remember one gun successfully making it through a full mag without jamming. I know this may not be the norm,
Click to expand...

Definitely not the norm. Note that I'm no fan of Para's -- I've got an early P14 that is troublesome. But even it is far more reliable than you describe.
 
I like them both. I started with a 1911 and heard all the stuff about grip angles being different and screwing up your grip. When I decided to get a Glock I found I could pick up either gun easily and have no problem getting right on target.
 
Junglerott said:
I like them both. I started with a 1911 and heard all the stuff about grip angles being different and screwing up your grip. When I decided to get a Glock I found I could pick up either gun easily and have no problem getting right on target.
Click to expand...

I find I have the problem when shooting quickly (e.g., IDPA qualification). I'm very used to the 1911. When I do a failure drill with a Glock and push it, shooting quickly, I tend to miss high. That's not surprise, since the Glock grip angle is larger than the 1911s.

Just to be clear, I'm not saying that the Glock grip angle is wrong. What I'm saying is that I'm used to the 1911's grip angle, so I get messed up with the Glock grip angle.
 
I'm in the love both camp, then again I own an AR and an AK as well.

IMG_0007.jpg
 
Fooped said:
Oddly enough, I've had extraordinary bad luck with almost every 1911 I've ever picked up. I've shot a few Para's (owned the atrocious Warthog)...
Click to expand...

I'd take a spork with a rubber band over a Para. Horrid customer service, bad mags, bad steel, dog_dropping QA and support... yeah.
 
I own three 1911s (two internal extractor Kimbers, and an AO/Caspian
mutt gun) a bunch of HKs, and a bunch of SigSauer products, and a
few S+Ws. Two of the 1911s are the only guns I've ever had
catostrophics on. (eg, a failure that would require field stripping,
and sometimes worse, level of repair. )

By the numbers, I've seen more broken 1911s than anything else
out there. That being said.... I acknowledge that there are big
REASONS behind that....

-There are a buttload of 1911s, and virtually all of them are
different in some way or another. Even same models from the
factory can be different.

-Some manufacturers have what I consider junk designs and
poor parts quality/QC. (No, I'm not going to elaborate- I don't
want to pour more gas on THAT fire. [laugh] )

-50% of them are customized. Even when mods are done
right, some mods can compromise reliability. Anecdotally,
guns that get further away from the 5" JMB 1911A1 pattern
usually get less reliable.

-There are like 30 kinds of magazines, and only a half a dozen
types/brands which aren't junk. Also, using the wrong mag
with the wrong ammo can cause problems. Finding the mags
your particular gun prefers is paramount.

-1911s are maintenance sensitive, especially on anything that
is REALLY tight. Any lacking in this department will result in
jams/failures. I think some guns are designed a little TOO tight
for the sake of slightly reducing the group size at some really
long range.

The problem with all of the above, is that it makes it VERY
difficult to truly apply a "reliability blanket statement" to
1911s.... 1911s, as a class, are not a "monolithic" kind of
design. Chances are if you own a factory G21 it isn't much
different from your friend's G21 across town. The same
can't be said for a 1911. You might have a springfield, and
your buddy has an AO, or any number of other sub-brands,
etc. Everybody and his brothers uncle makes a 1911, only
Glocks make Glocks, etc.

I know people who have had flawless 1911s, and those who
have gotten so pissed off at them they'd swear to never buy
one again. I think the former fibs a lot and the latter just
has had a streak of bad luck. You can find a lot of either with
any handgun design. In the latter group, I've also seen a lot
of problem resolution that was approached the wrong way. (eg,
IMO, with a 1911, it is best to find a gunsmith that knows what
they're doing, sending it back to the factory, is shot in the
dark with many intermittent problems. A good gunsmith can
also replace many compromise parts that are in some 1911s. )

Just my .02.... I like 1911s... and I will likely buy more... they
have features that you simply cannot get in any other handgun-
especially the trigger, grip angle, and point-ability.

That being said, if the S hits the F, I'm grabbing a Sig or an HK,
or my G20, first. My gut instinct tells me that all of those
will work when called upon, with minimal BS. The only 1911 that I
had, that I -really- trusted was my Colt Delta Elite that I had sold
awhile ago. I do have a newer Kimber Series 70 type of gun
in the safe, though. The thing is just barely broken in, though,
and I'm not quite at my required "trust" level with it yet.

-Mike
 
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It seems to me that the most frequently cited reason for not liking a Glock (other than the foolish "plastic" argument) is that the grip angle is not as good as that of a 1911.

Why doesn't Glock change the grip angle if there are so many complaints?
 
O/U said:
It seems to me that the most frequently cited reason for not liking a Glock (other than the foolish "plastic" argument) is that the grip angle is not as good as that of a 1911.

Why doesn't Glock change the grip angle if there are so many complaints?
Click to expand...

Because there are probably an equal number of people that prefer it.
 
O/U said:
It seems to me that the most frequently cited reason for not liking a Glock (other than the foolish "plastic" argument) is that the grip angle is not as good as that of a 1911.
Click to expand...
I don't know anyone who says that the Glock grip angle "is not as good as that of a 1911". The grip angle is fine. It is just different. I suspect that folks who spend as much time shooting a Glock as I've spent shooting a 1911 may find that the 1911 shoots low for them, just as I find the Glock shoots high for me. If I stopped shooting 1911s and starting exclusively shooting my Glocks, I'm sure that I'd get used to the Glock grip angle. It's switching between the two that I find to be an issue.

But if you want a Glock with a 1911 grip angle, look at http://www.ccfraceframes.com/home.php

Bigger issues for me than the Glock grip angle are 1) the mushy trigger feel, and 2) the grip circumference is just a bit too big for my hands.

Given the how many Glocks are sold each year, I think Glock would say that he got the angle just right. I think Glock is just now starting to feel the heat, now that S&W and others have finally come up with viable plastic-framed guns.
 
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