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How not to be a pro-2A gun store
- Thread starter milktree
- Start date
Ugh, that’s an infuriating violation on so many levels. The store/owner reporting a non-issue, and idiot police if they shared unredacted info as the author claims.
But these actions specifically violate laws and enumerated rights. How does that reflect a racist system rather than just a couple racist/idiot individualS?
But these actions specifically violate laws and enumerated rights. How does that reflect a racist system rather than just a couple racist/idiot individualS?
Wow. That's just really shameful.
Looks like they've closed off their Facebook page....
Looks like they've closed off their Facebook page....
IMHO file this under gun parlor, NSF, Ted The Rat, etc. If I was going to make a WAG the other possibility is the shop f***ed something up and used the "calling the kopsch" thing as a cover for it, not much different than "I was cleaning my gun and it went off" etc. Some nipple head shop owners think it will "save" them if they try an ass covering move like calling the kopsch on someone..... reminds me a lot of the NSF ratting incident. (reading between the lines, its pretty obvious someone in the shop f***ed something up, so they ratted on the guy/his kid to "save face" with the ATF.
That's a good point.
Here's some thoughts:
One angle is that the cops didn't tell them to go away. "why are you telling us this? Did he break any laws?"
Another angle is that it reflects systemic racism that the shop thought it was reasonable to behave that way, *and* they believed they wouldn't get called out for being shitheads for doing it. i.e.: Doing a racist thing is one thing, but doing a racist thing and assuming you'll get away with it without anyone calling you on it is indicative of a racist system.
Normally it wouldn't surprise me if the cops just documented everything as part of their due diligence, made a record, and then told the gun store owner exactly that. Perhaps they did. This journalist wouldn't be inclined to share it since it doesn't fit his desired narrative. And I can't find any other outlets reporting the story to investigate further. But then police sharing unredacted info, as the journalist claims, makes it harder to give benefit of the doubt. Can't judge either way without further info.
So this gun shop owner did something racist. Does that mean gun shop owners generally are racist, i.e. their "system"? Could this patron go to most gun stores and get the same treatment? If so, that reflects a systemic problem.
I wouldn't lump all blacks or whites into some category because an individual from either group did something. I've been treated poorly at a restaurant, but it didn't reflect anything about that system. Likewise this gun store owner's conduct says nothing about others. Unless this experience is encouraged by unequal representation under law or is the common experience in similar businesses, it only says something about the individual involved.
they are probably Democrats, 'dem folks have long history keeping blacks disarmed and racist AF. For bonus points, shop owner is probably a Clinton donor, you watch, once dirty laundry comes out you'll see I'm right.
We've had threads on here recently of people expressing various levels of "non-enthusiasm" for African-American-led firearms-involved marches, activities, etc.
So, it's not really surprising that some people who claim to support 2A only truly support it for certain types of people. It is not unique to 2A, either.
They are, thankfully, very much the minority of 2A folks.
So, it's not really surprising that some people who claim to support 2A only truly support it for certain types of people. It is not unique to 2A, either.
They are, thankfully, very much the minority of 2A folks.
eboos
NES Member
Its not even a 2A thing. Lets face it. There are several people here who are simply racist. I'm not talking about resisting the whole PC/woke crap, I am talking about flat out racism.
The "system" I imagined was the shop, the cops, the local community, and the shop's customers.
It never occurred to me that "gun shop owners" would be a relevant group here, since there is so much variation, not least of which is geography. It's not like there's a club of gun shop owners that meetings and a newsletter.
The media coverage of these events and marches varied quite differently depending on the organizers. Months back the March in MI was called subversive and organized by White Supremist groups to threaten the current Gov. The march at Stone Mountain received no such labeling. Yet both had a total absence of any violence and only a few odd balls that got out of line.
So when the author claims to show evidence of systemic racism, is he intending to only comment on central Arkansas?
I take this as his attempt to add justification to cries of nationwide/societal systemic racism by saying "this is how it works." And I find this anecdotal evidence lacking when applied to the nation since it only reflects a few individuals.
I'm reflexively skeptical because these people are demanding systemic changes which directly impact me. But all I see here is evidence for reform in one individual, or shop, or maybe town.
Most people that rattle on about racists all around them are whiter than Casper the ghost and grew up in a 90%+ white town.
eboos
NES Member
You are probably right about that, but that doesn't change the fact that there are several true and unapologetic racists here. Take this as just a microcosm of the right as a whole: there is a small (hopefully) but very loud number of unabashed racists (and generally ignorant bigots of all flavors) among us. If we cannot accept that truth and try to fix it we will always be seen as the group wishing to exclude based on race, ethnicity, religion, sexual preference etc.
Let’s not forget gun stores who actively manage to the expectations of anti-gun politicians in neighboring states.
Two of my favorite Wisconsin gun shops basically pissed on Illinois gun laws. They followed federal and WI law to the letter. I spent all my pennies there when I was a WI resident and made sure to spend anything I could when I lived in the cesspool.
Two of my favorite Wisconsin gun shops basically pissed on Illinois gun laws. They followed federal and WI law to the letter. I spent all my pennies there when I was a WI resident and made sure to spend anything I could when I lived in the cesspool.
The left is 100x more racist than the right they just do it under the guise of "fighting racism". I don't see a racist problem on the right, I see a massive racist problem on the left, as a matter of fact, its their entire political platform.
71montess
NES Member
And the first to
yell flat out racist are almost always liberal Democrat or sympathizers.
eboos
NES Member
You are absolutely correct about the problem on the left. Their biggest problem with racism is they can't even see that they are racist because they think, and I do actually think they think it, that they are helping others. The problem is the "help" they are providing is further creating a system of government dependency which the Ds are only too happy to perpetuate because it keeps them in power. They justify it using the same thought processes that kept the freedmen down during the reconstruction period, such as not being intelligent enough to know this or that.
Racism on the right may not be as wide spread, but it is much more in your face. Racists on the right do not try to hide their racism. However I must confess a thought: I wonder if they really truly are racists and not just ignorant effing morons. By this I mean: do they just dislike people of various classes, or do they just use classifications as a means to articulate the fact that they really just don't like anyone.
Racism in my opinion does not fall into "right" or "left" leaning politics. It's an "individual event". I've talked with and heard comments from conservatives and liberals / Dems and Republicans that are flat out racist. In other words......your comment "I don't see a racist problem on the right" is kind of strange to me. You don't think there are every day right wing people that are racist? There are a handful right here on NES that are.
Do you have a TV or a computer? I only see one political group on TV/Web going on and on about race and they aren't righties. Where did I say there are no everyday racist righties?
Who cares though? My real question is WTF are you going to do about it? If some guy holds a door for a black woman but says to himself in his head, " Say thank you, you smelly ******." How are you ever going to stop that? Police thought? Re-education camps? Some people just don't like others, nothing you can do about that. This is a dog chasing its tail problem. I don't understand the end-game, everyone holding hands singing Koombiya in a countryless world? It is such a retarded debate.
Humans are racist, we stick to our kind, we used to call them countries. Humans are attracted to other humans that look like themselves, sound like themselves etc., none of that is racist. Every animal sticks to its herd.
Let's say we get Hispanics, Whites, Blacks, all of them to hold hands and sing Koombiya. There is no more racism, dogs are living with cats, everyone is happy. Well, you still have to deal with the Chinese, and those racist f***s hate everyone.
Knowing the press like we do, I hope someone may consider the possibilty that there might be more to the story than reported.
If the guy was a real racist , he has the right to refuse anyone he chooses .
He didn't have to sell them anything.
It might be entirely possible that the guy overheard something that made him say , "Oh shit" after the sale.
If it was you and you heard some guy say to his buddy like , "Now the bitch is going to get it. " "Or " We're gonna pop some whitey's ass this weekend " as they are walking out the door , you might be a bit concerned .
And what's the first question that gets asked when something does happen ? "Where did he get the gun ? "
Automatically going for RACIST based on what some d-bag reporter spun into a story isn't too swift because we all know how honest the press it when it comes to anything gun.
If the guy was a real racist , he has the right to refuse anyone he chooses .
He didn't have to sell them anything.
It might be entirely possible that the guy overheard something that made him say , "Oh shit" after the sale.
If it was you and you heard some guy say to his buddy like , "Now the bitch is going to get it. " "Or " We're gonna pop some whitey's ass this weekend " as they are walking out the door , you might be a bit concerned .
And what's the first question that gets asked when something does happen ? "Where did he get the gun ? "
Automatically going for RACIST based on what some d-bag reporter spun into a story isn't too swift because we all know how honest the press it when it comes to anything gun.
You're making a lot of good points. Thank you for making me hone my position.
I don't think it's reasonable to try to narrow "the system" down to an individual, or discrete group of people, or discrete geographical area.
Just like it's not reasonable to think about anti-gun sentiment as an individual, or "all auto mechanics" or "greater Boston area" The sentiment is, more or less, everywhere. The degree varies across people and regions, but anywhere you go someone could talk about "reasonable gun control" and *someone* would agree, and *everyone* would know what you're talking about.
That's what's so insidious about institutionalized thought: It's kinda everywhere to some degree, which makes eliminating it really hard. It's especially hard to convince someone they're a gun confiscating statist if they actually believe that "common sense gun law" isn't complete bullshit.
My reading of the author was more about, "it's everywhere, you're soaking in it, here's an example."
Go ahead and try to convince a racist that he's racist. It's really hard, because he doesn't believe it.
AHM
NES Member
Or the shop is already in deep trouble with the cops,
who have provided them with a laundry list
of what kind of customers they want to know about.
(I don't think that was an angle to any of the celebrated cases
that you listed, but I could be wrong).
I'm not making an excuse; I'm jus' sayin' the store might have been flipped hard.
Wow. They are learning from The Gun Parlor.
Wildin’ Out: Local Gun Store Shows How Systemic Racism Works
Rights are negotiable if you're Black and go into Wildman Arms in Bentonwww.bluehogreport.com
EJFudd
NES Member
The shop's side of the story if anyone cares...
"Wildman Arms is a veteran owned and operated, small family business that cares about all our customers. We firmly believe that every American should enjoy their Second Amendment rights. We also pride ourselves on always following the law. Some people on the internet are spreading false rumors about our company. If you hear one of these false rumors, we want you to know the truth.
We serve people of all races and are proud to have a diverse customer base. In early June, we sold a gun to an African American man. He met all the legal requirements and we are always happy to sell our products to lawful buyers. He was one of many gun sales during another busy day.
Later that day, a state police investigator came to our building and said he was investigating this person and asked us for detailed information about him, including surveillance video of the transaction. This was a surprise to us, because we didn’t make any complaint about the man to law enforcement or anyone else. But, as a federally licensed firearms dealer, we are required to fully cooperate with all law enforcement investigations, and we did so.
A few weeks later, the same buyer came in to buy another weapon. We already knew law enforcement had been investigating him and we’d since learned that the address information he put on his firearms paperwork was incorrect. With those two legal concerns in mind, we denied the second sale, which we’re required to do if we believe that someone may be disqualified from buying a gun under federal law.
Those are the facts. The allegations that race or the recent protests about race relations had something to do this situation are hateful and false. We are an equal opportunity business and we reject racism.
Sadly, voices of hate on the internet – many of whom oppose gun stores and our strong support for the Second Amendment – are spreading lies and calling for people to target our employees and our store. This type of behavior reflects poorly on those doing it and doesn’t represent American or Arkansas values.
We want everyone, of all races, religions, etc. to know that we welcome your business at Wildman Arms."
"Wildman Arms is a veteran owned and operated, small family business that cares about all our customers. We firmly believe that every American should enjoy their Second Amendment rights. We also pride ourselves on always following the law. Some people on the internet are spreading false rumors about our company. If you hear one of these false rumors, we want you to know the truth.
We serve people of all races and are proud to have a diverse customer base. In early June, we sold a gun to an African American man. He met all the legal requirements and we are always happy to sell our products to lawful buyers. He was one of many gun sales during another busy day.
Later that day, a state police investigator came to our building and said he was investigating this person and asked us for detailed information about him, including surveillance video of the transaction. This was a surprise to us, because we didn’t make any complaint about the man to law enforcement or anyone else. But, as a federally licensed firearms dealer, we are required to fully cooperate with all law enforcement investigations, and we did so.
A few weeks later, the same buyer came in to buy another weapon. We already knew law enforcement had been investigating him and we’d since learned that the address information he put on his firearms paperwork was incorrect. With those two legal concerns in mind, we denied the second sale, which we’re required to do if we believe that someone may be disqualified from buying a gun under federal law.
Those are the facts. The allegations that race or the recent protests about race relations had something to do this situation are hateful and false. We are an equal opportunity business and we reject racism.
Sadly, voices of hate on the internet – many of whom oppose gun stores and our strong support for the Second Amendment – are spreading lies and calling for people to target our employees and our store. This type of behavior reflects poorly on those doing it and doesn’t represent American or Arkansas values.
We want everyone, of all races, religions, etc. to know that we welcome your business at Wildman Arms."
Dennis in MA
NES Member
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Systemic problems don't have to be with the entire system. The "system" can be "that specific gun store." Just sayin.
Well that adds an interesting tack to it. I wonder if he can sue the reporter for libel or slander or whatever. I know I would. I'd take his 92 Chevy Chevette and his pet cat Mr. Measles.
