Gold and silver prices are down

[Win]

Preface: I will always continue to buy and value precious metals. With that said, I think folks around the world have become so confused by fiat currencies that they fail to see the value in actual money. If you look at the balance sheet and debt of the US, you wouldn't imagine that the issuer's currency would be worth much (not to mention that they wouldn't be able to borrow - but they are!) This common thinking that currency doesn't itself need to have any inherent value is also seen in the cryptocurrencies. It's not much a stretch to go from fiat currency to cryptocurrency. I don't think you would be able to move people from 64 and earlier silver and gold money to cryptocurrency but the fiat currency intermediary made it possible for people to see cryptocurrency as actual money. Many people now believe that there is value in having ownership in the latest block of one of the over 1,300 cryptocurrency blockchains. Some of those folks will laugh at the idea of the cryptokitties having value but I don't see why. What would be the difference in owning the current block of a cryptocurrency as opposed to the latest block of the cryptocat or owning nothing at all for that matter? None of those items have any inherent value. None of those items have the same immutable and valuable properties of precious metals. I don't know that the time will again come where people understand what money is. That time may have passed.

 

[richc]

If you look at the balance sheet and debt of the US, you wouldn't imagine that the issuer's currency would be worth much (not to mention that they wouldn't be able to borrow - but they are!)

"China is reportedly thinking of halting US Treasury purchases and that's worrying markets right now"

China is reportedly thinking of halting US Treasury purchases and that's worrying markets right now

 

[browncoat]

Preface: I will always continue to buy and value precious metals. With that said, I think folks around the world have become so confused by fiat currencies that they fail to see the value in actual money. If you look at the balance sheet and debt of the US, you wouldn't imagine that the issuer's currency would be worth much (not to mention that they wouldn't be able to borrow - but they are!) This common thinking that currency doesn't itself need to have any inherent value is also seen in the cryptocurrencies. It's not much a stretch to go from fiat currency to cryptocurrency. I don't think you would be able to move people from 64 and earlier silver and gold money to cryptocurrency but the fiat currency intermediary made it possible for people to see cryptocurrency as actual money. Many people now believe that there is value in having ownership in the latest block of one of the over 1,300 cryptocurrency blockchains. Some of those folks will laugh at the idea of the cryptokitties having value but I don't see why. What would be the difference in owning the current block of a cryptocurrency as opposed to the latest block of the cryptocat or owning nothing at all for that matter? None of those items have any inherent value. None of those items have the same immutable and valuable properties of precious metals. I don't know that the time will again come where people understand what money is. That time may have passed.

If you ask a Keynesian, the debt is a valuable product of our economy.

 

[Varmint]

Preface: I will always continue to buy and value precious metals. With that said, I think folks around the world have become so confused by fiat currencies that they fail to see the value in actual money. If you look at the balance sheet and debt of the US, you wouldn't imagine that the issuer's currency would be worth much (not to mention that they wouldn't be able to borrow - but they are!) This common thinking that currency doesn't itself need to have any inherent value is also seen in the cryptocurrencies. It's not much a stretch to go from fiat currency to cryptocurrency. I don't think you would be able to move people from 64 and earlier silver and gold money to cryptocurrency but the fiat currency intermediary made it possible for people to see cryptocurrency as actual money. Many people now believe that there is value in having ownership in the latest block of one of the over 1,300 cryptocurrency blockchains. Some of those folks will laugh at the idea of the cryptokitties having value but I don't see why. What would be the difference in owning the current block of a cryptocurrency as opposed to the latest block of the cryptocat or owning nothing at all for that matter? None of those items have any inherent value. None of those items have the same immutable and valuable properties of precious metals. I don't know that the time will again come where people understand what money is. That time may have passed.

good points.

One main difference today is that cryptocurrencies could drop in value 90%, and anyone who didn't own it, wouldn't notice. If a fiat currency like the dollar dropped 90%, everyone would be affected. So until cryptocurrencies become the primary currency somewhere, they won't be equivalent to fiat currency.

So most people don't even think of cryptocurrencies, other than as another bubble they're missing out on, not unlike Pets.com.

 

[enbloc]

If you believe in technicals, possible to see some volatility in gold prices near term.

I do not apply technical research and data to PMs, only for the stocks I hold. I treat PMs more like "preps".
If you truly trust the "Don't put all your eggs in one basket" theory, PMs fit in nicely... and in the end, may be the only eggs left.

 

[Varmint]

I think we may look back on this time as the last chance to get gold in particular at reasonable prices. With the dollar tanking and inflation about to take off, the Fed may soon reverse course, which will trigger a gold explosion like in 2011. And this time no one will believe the Fed when they pretend to taper in the future.

 

[Win]

They're moving. I jumped in and bought some more gold.

 

[Varmint]

They're moving. I jumped in and bought some more gold.

I bought some ETFs in my 401k to guard against inflation and crashing dollar - GLD, SLV, precious metals and some international stock fund meant to hedge against weak US dollar.

Best I could do, can't buy physical PMs with my 401k. (don't think so, anyway)

I bought a bunch of physical gold/silver in december when prices were low, so kind of tapped out for now.

 

[Win]

I've been doing that as well. Taking gains from my 401K and moving them to QGLDX (Fidelity gold bullion fund) and SGGDX (First Eagle Gold Class A - a gold mining mutual fund).

The new weak dollar policy sounds like it's going to be terrible for not only the dollar but also, by extension, treasuries, and ultimately the stock market.

 

[Varmint]

I've been doing that as well. Taking gains from my 401K and moving them to QGLDX (Fidelity gold bullion fund) and SGGDX (First Eagle Gold Class A - a gold mining mutual fund).

The new weak dollar policy sounds like it's going to be terrible for not only the dollar but also, by extension, treasuries, and ultimately the stock market.

Do you have Fidelity? I noticed a while ago they have Brokeragelink, which lets you buy basically anything. Check out VGPMX, I think they're pretty much the best PM/mining fund.

Yeah, i think the stock market is cheering weak dollar cause they think it's good for exports (true). But they're not thinking about the effect of inflation, which will force the Fed to raise rates (killing the stock market), or reverse course and go QE (killing the dollar).

A weak dollar is going to make US Treasuries a losing bet, the Fed will be the only buyer of Treasuries.

 

[Win]

Do you have Fidelity? I noticed a while ago they have Brokeragelink, which lets you buy basically anything. Check out VGPMX, I think they're pretty much the best PM/mining fund.

Yeah, i think the stock market is cheering weak dollar cause they think it's good for exports (true). But they're not thinking about the effect of inflation, which will force the Fed to raise rates (killing the stock market), or reverse course and go QE (killing the dollar).

A weak dollar is going to make US Treasuries a losing bet, the Fed will be the only buyer of Treasuries.

Yes - Fidelity. I use the brokerage link to buy those two mutual funds that I mentioned. The brokerage link doesn't allow me to buy everything for some reason. Might be a setting from my company? I'm not sure. I will look into VGPMX. Thanks!

 

[radioman]

I guess you know your old when you can remember buying and selling gold for 90 bucks an ounce.

 

[NHCraigT]

I guess you know your old when you can remember buying and selling gold for 90 bucks an ounce.

That would be better-said, if it where only the "buying" that was the memory .... and there was no "selling" yet involved.

 

[Varmint]

Yes - Fidelity. I use the brokerage link to buy those two mutual funds that I mentioned. The brokerage link doesn't allow me to buy everything for some reason. Might be a setting from my company? I'm not sure. I will look into VGPMX. Thanks!

Interesting, I haven't tried buying that much, mine could be the same. I just bought some of EPIVX (class I to avoid the 4.5% fee) - it's Peter Schiff's international fund, which is designed to protect against dollar crashing. Probably will suck but I figure what the heck.

This is my old company's 401k, the new one totally sucks, I can't even put the money in cash(money market), it's some kind of bond fund, cause the return (3%) is too high to really be a money market.

 

[Varmint]

I guess you know your old when you can remember buying and selling gold for 90 bucks an ounce.

That was a brief moment in 1973 when it went from $64 to $106 and never went back. My parents bought some pos Chevy Citation, and could have bought 100 ounces of gold instead. Oops.

Good illustration of how the US government has destroyed the value of our dollars.

 

[enbloc]

Thanks Nixon...

 

[ASHDUMP]

So you guys are buying paper gold and silver? I thought that was taboo?

 

[Win]

So you guys are buying paper gold and silver? I thought that was taboo?

I only had money in physical gold and silver until this year. I try to keep PMs at around 10% of my portfolio but with the way the market moved I don’t have enough cash to get to that level. I therefor moved some equity mutual funds to PM mutual funds.

 

[Varmint]

So you guys are buying paper gold and silver? I thought that was taboo?

With 401k funds - I'm buying paper gold with digital savings.

I mainly do 401k to reduce my taxes. I'd rather have cash, but the tax savings are too good to pass up.

 

[Varmint]

I only had money in physical gold and silver until this year. I try to keep PMs at around 10% of my portfolio but with the way the market moved I don’t have enough cash to get to that level. I therefor moved some equity mutual funds to PM mutual funds.

Right, if you have any money in the stock/bond bubble, absolutely move it to things like PM funds (or miner funds), even energy stock funds or emerging market/international funds - anything that'll be ok when the dollar crashes.

I mean, it's possible the stock market will do ok in a dollar crash, but if bond crash/inflation take down the economy, even the Fed won't be able to keep the market this high.

 

[Win]

Interesting, I haven't tried buying that much, mine could be the same. I just bought some of EPIVX (class I to avoid the 4.5% fee) - it's Peter Schiff's international fund, which is designed to protect against dollar crashing. Probably will suck but I figure what the heck.

This is my old company's 401k, the new one totally sucks, I can't even put the money in cash(money market), it's some kind of bond fund, cause the return (3%) is too high to really be a money market.

EPASX looks tempting albeit riskier. Did you have anything against that fund?

 

[Varmint]

EPASX looks tempting albeit riskier. Did you have anything against that fund?

No, I might buy some of that too. It seemed the EPIVX is managed by Schiff himself, at least it mentions his name. Not sure about the others.

I know his track record hasn't been good for years, but his funds all seem to be predicated on his prediction of dollar crash, so the dollar hasn't really gone down til the last few months (and his funds have gone way up as the dollar went down, so at least you know they seem to work).

 

[Win]

No, I might buy some of that too. It seemed the EPIVX is managed by Schiff himself, at least it mentions his name. Not sure about the others.

I know his track record hasn't been good for years, but his funds all seem to be predicated on his prediction of dollar crash, so the dollar hasn't really gone down til the last few months (and his funds have gone way up as the dollar went down, so at least you know they seem to work).

Right. I listen to Peter Schiff’s podcasts so I know exactly what you mean

 

[Varmint]

Right. I listen to Peter Schiff’s podcasts so I know exactly what you mean

He's great - most of the similar speakers (Jim Rickards for example) sound so repetitive and self-absorbed I can't listen to them, but Schiff is really easy to listen to, and he really explains things well - many of these guys are just like "you have to believe me cause I'm smart" and they don't try to explain the logic.

 

[Varmint]

Higher interest rates are pushing down gold. Retarded but I'll take it, I want to keep buying at the lower prices!

 

[ASHDUMP]

Higher interest rates are pushing down gold. Retarded but I'll take it, I want to keep buying at the lower prices!

I need a few years of cheaper gold and silver....

 

[Varmint]

While I think gold/silver is on a downward trend at the moment, there are some good Ebay Bucks deals today, gotta use the app to get 8%:

20 ASEs for $368
2017 1 Troy oz. American Silver Eagle - Roll of 20 Coins SKU44365 | eBay

Ten 2 oz Queen's Beasts for $374
Roll of 10 -2018 Britain 2 oz Silver Queen's Beasts Unicorn of Scotland SKU49477 | eBay

$20 Liberty Gold Double Eagle AU for $1202 which is $80 under spot.
SPECIAL PRICE! $20 Liberty Gold Double Eagle AU (Random Year) - SKU #132973 | eBay

 

[Win]

EPASX, EPIVX, Gold, Silver and Platinum all solid the last couple of days but there is still time to buy before any big moves

 

[Varmint]

EPASX, EPIVX, Gold, Silver and Platinum all solid the last couple of days but there is still time to buy before any big moves

I bought some EPIVX but now I think if stocks crash, EPIVX is gonna crash also, so I'm holding off on that. Buying GLD and miners though. Hope we get a pullback!

 

[Win]

I have a lot of EPIVX and EPASX. I'm hoping that money from domestic equities moves into foreign equities rather than people pulling money out of all equities but what do I know?