Gold and silver prices are down

Win said:
I have a lot of EPIVX and EPASX. I'm hoping that money from domestic equities moves into foreign equities rather than people pulling money out of all equities but what do I know?
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I think Schiff has structered these funds so that they will benefit as the dollar weakens. But because they're made up of foreign stocks, when the global stock market tanks, they tank also. So they might get cheap when the market tanks, but you certainly want to be in before the Fed rolls out QE Infinity, which could happen at any time.

In fact, the new Fed Chairman Powell aluded to more QE on Monday, which is why stocks are way up the last 2 days.
 
After seeing a few videos of some counterfeit coins, some of those in convincing slabs, I bought one of these. I've started to go through my collection. Haven't found any fakes yet. Cool machine though. Not cheap but if it saves you from one fake 1 ounce gold it's paid for itself.

ProPMV.jpg
 
Win said:
After seeing a few videos of some counterfeit coins, some of those in convincing slabs, I bought one of these. I've started to go through my collection. Haven't found any fakes yet. Cool machine though. Not cheap but if it saves you from one fake 1 ounce gold it's paid for itself.

ProPMV.jpg
Click to expand...

Link to where you bought it
 
Win said:
After seeing a few videos of some counterfeit coins, some of those in convincing slabs, I bought one of these. I've started to go through my collection. Haven't found any fakes yet. Cool machine though. Not cheap but if it saves you from one fake 1 ounce gold it's paid for itself.

ProPMV.jpg
Click to expand...

I wonder if you get a gold coin in the mail from a big vendor and you think it's fake, will they honor the return? I noticed some of them say you have 2 days within receipt to dispute it. So I don't really want to go back and check. :)
 
Haha. That's the first thing my wife asked me - if I could send back coins I've purchased previously. I think with purely bullion coins we'd be out of luck but reputable numismatists at least say that they will accept returns if the coin is found to be fake at any time.
 
Curious if it works with other PM's?

thx

Rich

Win said:
After seeing a few videos of some counterfeit coins, some of those in convincing slabs, I bought one of these. I've started to go through my collection. Haven't found any fakes yet. Cool machine though. Not cheap but if it saves you from one fake 1 ounce gold it's paid for itself.

ProPMV.jpg
Click to expand...
 
Varmint said:
I wonder if you get a gold coin in the mail from a big vendor and you think it's fake, will they honor the return? I noticed some of them say you have 2 days within receipt to dispute it. So I don't really want to go back and check. :)
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I think the question becomes how do you test it without removing it from packaging. And once removed from their packaging, if any, how do you prove it was the coin they shipped to you? That's right... you can't.

You can go on Alibaba and buy fake gold coins all day:

Fake Gold Coins-Fake Gold Coins Manufacturers, Suppliers and Exporters on Alibaba.comMetal Crafts

So the vendors need to be extremely careful with their return policies. The same crowd that ruined LL Bean's very generous return policy would clearly game the coin dealers as well.

But I also think it speaks to having a relationship with one or two vendors. If you have a track record with them and then suddenly find a clunker there'll be a bit more inclined to believe you.

FYI I believe PCGS, and maybe NGC, will back any counterfeit coins that they certify. But, of course, there are fake PCGS certified coins inside fake PCGS containers sold by the crooks. Sometimes you can't win!

Just deal with reputable vendors. That's the best you can do.
 
Yes the precious metal verifier pro works on Silver, Gold, Platinum and some other metals. It even adjusts for pure bullion coins, 90% pure coins etc. Of note - it will also work even if the coin is in a holder. There are some informative videos here
Sigma Metalytics - PMV PRO Videos

Both NGC and PCGS are certified coins meaning that both NGC and PCGS will refund the owner the value of the coin if it is fake, doctored, or over graded on the holder.

Agree regarding reputable vendors and coin dealers. Even if you have to spend a couple of extra dollars it has always been worth it in my experience.
 
Win,
Start a small service where you charge short money to test member's PM's.
Especially if they were bought from a questionable source.
You will make your money back ASAP.
 
Win said:
That's not a bad idea. I guess I would have to think about where exactly I could do that.
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Start with friends. Then when interested, post on NES as a service.

Gold is where the value of your tester really comes into its own. I would pay a guy $10-$20 bucks to test it in front of me if I was buying local from a private seller.

Silver, not so cost-effective.

And remember, it's your machine. Make them come to you...
 
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richc said:
Curious if it works with other PM's?

thx

Rich
Click to expand...

Looks to me like the $500 one just measures resistivity, while the $1200 one compares resistivity to specific weight and dimensions - you could probably fool the first type by making the coin thinner or smaller than it's supposed to be? Just a guess.

Should work with any metal, probably just needs pre-stored standards for each metal, which I'm sure it has.
 
Varmint said:
Looks to me like the $500 one just measures resistivity, while the $1200 one compares resistivity to specific weight and dimensions - you could probably fool the first type by making the coin thinner or smaller than it's supposed to be? Just a guess.

Should work with any metal, probably just needs pre-stored standards for each metal, which I'm sure it has.
Click to expand...

The original precious metal verifier, the one that sells around $500 does just measure resistivity but it also only measures resistivity of the surface metal. The precious metal verifier pro, the $1,200 one, is a new upgraded model which gives both the surface resistivity and resistivity all the way through the coin or bar. The pro model also measures for appropriate dimensions.

Bourbon party sounds fun. The unit is fairly small and light and comes in a hard case so it travels well.
 
This weekend I've received a lot of email offers for gold slightly over Friday's spot close. Generally these are driven by the sellers thinking prices are heading down shortly thereafter.

We'll see... YMMV.
 
Didn't Archimedes come up with the way to figure out if the crown was made of solid gold? Just drop it in a graduated cylinder and see how much water it displaces. Eureka! Unless there's something that's denser and also cheaper than gold (hint, Tungsten).
 
hminsky said:
Didn't Archimedes come up with the way to figure out if the crown was made of solid gold? Just drop it in a graduated cylinder and see how much water it displaces. Eureka! Unless there's something that's denser and also cheaper than gold (hint, Tungsten).
Click to expand...

What's his NES user name?

:)
 
richc said:
This weekend I've received a lot of email offers for gold slightly over Friday's spot close. Generally these are driven by the sellers thinking prices are heading down shortly thereafter.

We'll see... YMMV.
Click to expand...

Dollar looks like it bottomed short term, I think gold will drop short term, gonna buy more as it goes down.
 
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hminsky said:
Didn't Archimedes come up with the way to figure out if the crown was made of solid gold? Just drop it in a graduated cylinder and see how much water it displaces. Eureka! Unless there's something that's denser and also cheaper than gold (hint, Tungsten).
Click to expand...
The specific density of tungsten is so close to that of gold, you would find the archimedes principle a difficult test.
 
Au=19.3 gm/cm^3; W=19.25 gm/cm^3

(19.3-19.25)/19.3=.26%. That's a bit small to accurately measure archimedes style with small quantities. Also, consider the difference will be a bit smaller than that since the counterfeits will be only part W.

And then there is This Chinese Company Proudly Sells Tungsten-Filled Gold Bars. This Chinese company is obviously targeting the fraud market, since weight equivalence is not a requirement for either of their stated "legit purposes".

There is a federal hobby protection act that requires all replica collectible coins to bear the word "copy", but I don't think there is any law outlawing counterfeit gold bars per-se unless someone is caught in the act of using them in a fraud.
 

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