Getting an LTC in MA - not the quickest thing to do...

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tfourunner

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Let's start with a comparable story. A guy who works for me lives in RHode Island. One day he decided he wanted to buy a gun, but he didn't have a license. So he goes to a gun store in RI, fills out a 10 minute form, pays 25 bucks or something and buys some guns - 1 of which was a Bushmaster .223....he was shooting the same day the notion to do so struck him.

Now me. I am in MA. I decide I want to buy a gun. I am no slacker so I start the process of getting the license. First take a training course - I guess that is a good idea, but at any rate there is $90 and 2 weeks waiting trying to get in a course. Then drop off the form at the police station so they can run a background check and drop another $100 on the application fee. Then I have to come back only on Tuesdays, between 8 and 3. So I have to take some time off from work to go. Then I go in, wait for 45 minutes for the guy before me to get done and then I go in 45 minutes later after getting finger printed and photographed we are done. I am thinking...where is my LTC. Then he says that now they send all my paper work to the state police so they can process it...and it will take 2-4 weeks to hear back from them. Of course it took 4 weeks. What gives? Why all this bureacracy? It completely baffles me. Is my experience unique or did all you have to go through it too?
 
Welcome to the world of MA politics and BS. Yes - we all have suffered the same consequences. However, you were lucky - it only took 4 weeks to get you license. Some folks are still waiting after 2 months. Pathetic, isn't it?
 
For MA you are unique if it only took you:

- 2 trips to the PD,
- "only" 6 weeks!

Truthfully the system is designed to punish the legal folks, make people want to give up, make it as difficult as possible.

When my renewal takes only ~4 weeks from beginning to end, I feel blessed! My Wife's renewal took 3 full months from the time she dropped off the paperwork and had her "interview"!
 
I don't remember the timing, but renewing in Marlboro and going up to an LTC ALP took me only 2 trips. I don't recall that it was a real long process, either.

'Course, it was my second time since I moved into town. That may have had something to do with it. I will say that the firearms officer in Marlboro is... uh... a bit brusque in manner. But I did get an ALP, so I don't have a problem with brusque.

Ross
 
Your lucky it took only 4 weeks. Glenn's took almost 4 month. Still haven't gotten Alan's FID card,and me last year took 9 months.
 
In my town it was pretty smooth. I had to make an appt. with a sgt or higher rank, pring the completed app., 4 pics run my prints, and a quyick interview. He told me 4-6 weeks, came in just shy of 5.
 
It didn't take that long for me to get my Class A LTC, but that's only because I threw a bitch-fit, threw my weight and NY attitude around and pushed my way into the system despite the issuing LEO telling me that for my purposes all I needed was a FID.

Ofcourse I don't have an unrestricted Class A. Sporting and Target means no concealed unless you're willing to lose your license all together.

However, I'm moving to a different town in October and my lawyer friend who lives in the same town, who is also an NRA cert instructor, says that I should be able to reapply to get the restrictions lifted. He used to have Hunting and Target before he moved there.

Wish me luck
 
4 weeks!!!

You should run down immediately and kiss the chief, (On second though, strike that; might not be "suitable".) Four months for a renewal is far from uncommon. I contantly give thanks that I live in a town with a sane chief. I picked up the application for my last renewal from the desk one evening after work, stopped by the next morning to get printed, and dropped everything off with the dispatcher around 2AM that night (next morning?). I did this about 3 months before my birthday in an attempt to avoid a lapse. About a week before my birthday, they phoned to say that I could come in and pick it up any time. They had thoughtfully post-dated it to my birthday so that I'd get the full term on it.

Ken
 
Yeah,Glenn and Alan both did theirs before their birthdays. It was right after we got back from Alan's graduation from Basic/AIT. Alan's I figure there is no excuse since it's an FID. Thankfully I have a few more years to go, and you can bet I will have it in way early this time.
 
Mine was pretty painless as well.

75 for the class.
35 for the pictures and prints. I snuck in right before it was bumped up to 100 bucks. And I'm lucky enough that it's going to be 100 for six years when I renew next year.

About 5 weeks I think until I got the call that it was in. No Restrictions.

The only times that I went to the police station was to pick up the app, drop off the all, and pick up the LTC. Three times total.
 
C-pher said:
75 for the class.
35 for the pictures and prints.
Click to expand...

I went and took the Personal Protection class at Riverside before I put in my application for renewal, and the gun officer told me I should have saved my money because I'd taken the class in Worcester 5 years previously - he didn't think I needed to take anything again.

'Course, the class was worth the price just for the education and the chance to hear Jesse Cohen lecture on the legalities, so I don't think it was a waste at all!

Ross
 
Yea this is for renewals in a gun friendly town too! Not right.
There is a section in the law (LenS correct me if I interpert this wrong)
that says they have to notify you if you are approved within 30 days. (from the state) I will see if I can find that section again.
It is BS and the paperwork suffle.
(

(e) Within seven days of the receipt of a completed application for a license to carry or possess firearms, or renewal of same, the licensing authority shall forward one copy of the application and one copy of the applicant's fingerprints to the colonel of state police, who shall within 30 days advise the licensing authority, in writing, of any disqualifying criminal record of the applicant arising from within or without the commonwealth and whether there is reason to believe that the applicant is disqualified for any of the foregoing reasons from possessing a license to carry or possess firearms. In searching for any disqualifying history of the applicant, the colonel shall utilize, or cause to be utilized, files maintained by the department of probation and statewide and nationwide criminal justice, warrant and protection order information systems and files including, but not limited to, the National Instant Criminal Background Check System. The colonel shall inquire of the commissioner of the department of mental health relative to whether the applicant is disqualified from being so licensed. If the information available to the colonel does not indicate that the possession of a firearm or large capacity firearm by the applicant would be in violation of state or federal law, he shall certify such fact, in writing, to the licensing authority within said 30 day period.

The licensing authority may also make inquiries concerning the applicant to: (i) the executive director of the criminal history systems board relative to any disqualifying condition and records of purchases, sales, rentals, leases and transfers of weapons or ammunition concerning the applicant; (ii) the commissioner of probation relative to any record contained within the department of probation or the statewide domestic violence record keeping system concerning the applicant; and (iii) the commissioner of the department of mental health relative to whether the applicant is a suitable person to possess firearms or is not a suitable person to possess firearms. The director or commissioner to whom the licensing authority makes such inquiry shall provide prompt and full cooperation for that purpose in any investigation of the applicant.

The licensing authority shall, within 40 days from the date of application, either approve the application and issue the license or deny the application and notify the applicant of the reason for such denial in writing; provided, however, that no such license shall be issued unless the colonel has certified, in writing, that the information available to him does not indicate that the possession of a firearm or large capacity firearm by the applicant would be in violation of state or federal law.

So I read this as get off the pot or piss after 40 days? (IE they have to issue you one after 40 days unless you are disqualed.)
Not that we can call them on this as they have the power to disqualify us.
[twisted]
 
I moved into RI from MA so I lost my MA class A LTC, but I went out to the gun shop too, filled out the easiest multiple choice test I ever took with no ID, it was free also, I got my blue card and can buy guns and transport them. I do not get it at all, no background checks, no prints, no SSN, nothing, I didn't even have a RI drivers license, but when you want to carry legally forget it won't happen here without a good reason like liquor store owner or something, but not for a resident that would like the priveledge. How can they basically give away guns to anyone, but when you want to carry legally they close the door on ya. At least in MA it may take a month but you can get a LTC.
 
Glenn,

Regrettably your interpretation is only partly correct.

- They are SUPPOSED to deny or issue within 40 days . . . BUT the legislature put NO PENALTY for ignoring that law, so they do neither with impunity.

- I am personally unaware of any effective law that actually penalizes any government body for not keeping their end of the bargain (law)! Not counting civil lawsuits, where they drag it on for years and the taxpayers pick up all costs for their incompetence, IF you get a judgment that actually stands thru all the appeals.

- Only common citizens can actually be penalized for not following the law.

- If you push the 40-day deadline, many chiefs will "fold" and give you a denial! So, even if you win on the deadline, you will lose!

- I am unaware of any chief that will issue on Day 40 (compliant with the law) if they haven't heard from BOP, DMH, etc. They can legally do so, but they just won't do it for liability reasons.

- If you push government to give you reasons in writing, all you will get is a PC sanitized BS statement. Even true for big business. . . I learned this lesson the hard way some 34 years ago when I turned MasterCard in for some documented fraudulent practices (Boston Globe Spotlight report), moved to CT and applied for a new MC . . . answered honestly that I had had a MC with account number (account fully paid every month) and was denied-reason given "I had just moved to CT" . . . yup to take a good paying engineering job after graduating college! Went across the street to another bank and denied ever having a MC, got one issued 2 weeks later. Real reason was that when I spoke with the manager of the MC division here in MA I told him that I was reporting him/them for consumer fraud to the AG's office and he stated "perhaps we should cancel your account" to which I responded "perhaps you should", paid my bill in full and stopped using the card. So when CT bank checked I was labeled a "troublemaker" and denied. Real reasons are NEVER put down in writing unless it is so iron-clad that they can't get in trouble for it. Same deal with local chiefs . . . cause him grief and you are "unsuitable" and almost any MA judge will uphold that!
 
Boston and Brookline require shooting test.

Some places require letters from doctors.

Some places require letters of recommendation.

Ross, glad you liked that class. Was the first time i met Darius and Jesse when I went to their offices to set up that class. It's so hard to run good personal protection classes with everyone so busy. Getting lega experts, the low light experts, police officers to give their views, etc. I suppose you could skimp, but who wants that?

By the way, our Saturday Home Firearm Safety class (minimum requirements for license) is only $50 for non members.

Last I knew, in Marlborough, first time license applicants had to come take one of our classes and then take the Worcester class. Everyon I've talked to that has done that says that Worcester didn't add anything new, and didn't cover nearly what we did. (shorter class, so that makes sense)

By the way, when asked under oath, no official has ever stated that the license and registration information that the state spends MILLIONS every year on has ever been a decisive or meaningful piece of evidence in solving a crime. Surely, if such data was helping to solve crimes, the anit's would have obviously promoted it and you'd have seen it plasterd over the Mass Pike. Instead, you get off the cuff remarks that "it is useful in investigations". Want to know how we help fund more real crime prevention? Get rid of the money wasted on programs that can not prove their worth.

Too bad we can't get school civics classes to try to remove bad laws from the books instead of having the Official State Zipper or something useless.
 
LenS I know It just pisses me off.
They should be held to the same standard as we are, when you go in 3 months early for your renewal and it still takes 8-9 months (like it did for the wife) it is BS. Clean records . I come back on a NICS check faster than anyone. (as stated by several dealers I have been run through.)

As for my Son's FID he is in the guard, getting a securtiy clearance
heading to Iraq and the jerks are still taking thier time. ARRRGGGHHHH.
 
Wildweasel said:
As for my Son's FID he is in the guard, getting a securtiy clearance
heading to Iraq and the jerks are still taking thier time. ARRRGGGHHHH.
Click to expand...

Isn't that just a pisser for you. They should've processed him with a full Carry Permit, signed by the Governor, and in less than a week. Along with a letter of thanks.

Airline security searches are no better. My brother-in-law came home on R&R from Kuwait in April. I made the mistake of wearing BDU's when I saw him off at the airport. Guess who they checked closest and made us take our boots off? Right, the 2 people least likely to damage the damned airplane, 2 National Guardsmen in uniform, one in BDU's, one in DCU's, both NCO's.
 
LenS said:
Glenn,

Regrettably your interpretation is only partly correct.

- They are SUPPOSED to deny or issue within 40 days . . . BUT the legislature put NO PENALTY for ignoring that law, so they do neither with impunity.

- I am personally unaware of any effective law that actually penalizes any government body for not keeping their end of the bargain (law)! Not counting civil lawsuits, where they drag it on for years and the taxpayers pick up all costs for their incompetence, IF you get a judgment that actually stands thru all the appeals.

- Only common citizens can actually be penalized for not following the law.

- If you push the 40-day deadline, many chiefs will "fold" and give you a denial! So, even if you win on the deadline, you will lose!

- I am unaware of any chief that will issue on Day 40 (compliant with the law) if they haven't heard from BOP, DMH, etc. They can legally do so, but they just won't do it for liability reasons.

- If you push government to give you reasons in writing, all you will get is a PC sanitized BS statement. Even true for big business. . . I learned this lesson the hard way some 34 years ago when I turned MasterCard in for some documented fraudulent practices (Boston Globe Spotlight report), moved to CT and applied for a new MC . . . answered honestly that I had had a MC with account number (account fully paid every month) and was denied-reason given "I had just moved to CT" . . . yup to take a good paying engineering job after graduating college! Went across the street to another bank and denied ever having a MC, got one issued 2 weeks later. Real reason was that when I spoke with the manager of the MC division here in MA I told him that I was reporting him/them for consumer fraud to the AG's office and he stated "perhaps we should cancel your account" to which I responded "perhaps you should", paid my bill in full and stopped using the card. So when CT bank checked I was labeled a "troublemaker" and denied. Real reasons are NEVER put down in writing unless it is so iron-clad that they can't get in trouble for it. Same deal with local chiefs . . . cause him grief and you are "unsuitable" and almost any MA judge will uphold that!
Click to expand...


This should go in the "What can GOAL do for me?" poll post.
 
i guess i'm the odd one. my ltc a flp took like 1-2 wks, renewal took 3-4 wks. and my reason was "sporting, self protection" that's it. of course, i'm a townie. my grandmother lives in town, my dad does, and i grew up here. i went to school with the sgt. who does licensing "the chief signs" and he went to school with my aunt. we chatted a bit, the " how;s the family?" and such and i was on my way. they even recamended a former sgt. for the safety course, i scheduled a personal class with him at my convenience.

jack
 
I wish it was 4 weeks here in Boston..I do it 2 months before my birthday so its ready and to boot in boston at before you renew you have to go to the Boston police range to qualify.
 
I filed early to renew my license in Norton. When the LTC came back, it was for only 5 years because I filed to soon. When I pointed it out to the Lieutenant, he insisted on taking the permit back, and reissuing one with a complete 6 year term.

I didn't want to "rock the boat", a permit in hand is better than one on the way I figured, but sure enough, he had the corrected permit to me in 3 weeks, good for 6 years, ALP.

I have found both the Chief and his issuing Lieutenant and past sergeants in Norton to be reasonable and fair since the new Chief became in charge.

After having a bad experience about ten years ago, I now keep an FID card and a LTC, with overlapping dates, to make sure I never have to surrender my firearms if a LTC permit gets delayed due to clerical error or state policy. It lets me rest easier, though I do pay extra for that.
 

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