dcmdon
NES Member
This!!!! is very telling. Because free food from the state is a right.
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6 month LTC renewal!!
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This!!!! is very telling. Because free food from the state is a right.
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This is a very disgusting and scary situation for all of us. We are essentially law abiding citizens being turned into criminals by a broken system. Where the heck are organizations such as the NRA, GOAL, etc.? This does not seem to be isolated to one or two individuals, but rather seems to be the norm, which should make it a high priority for pro 2A organizations since the stakes are so high.
Honest question... do people stop carrying once they pass the 90 day period?
Honest question... do people stop carrying once they pass the 90 day period?
dcmdon
NES Member
It depends whether you are a sheep or not.
I think its up to every person with a LTC or FID to approach their PD 6 months before expiration to begin the process. If they are denied the opportunity to apply 6 months prior to expiration, they should get it in writing, or go in person and get an audio recording of it. There is no law prohibiting you from recording the interaction. They are recording it, you might as well be.
As has been show time and time again, the state isn't actually backed up. The problem is the local issuing authorities. It only took me about a month to get my LTC in Arlington last year. I can't speak to their lead time now. But back then there were others reporting multi-month waits.
Is there any law that sets how far in advance you can begin the process? Or is it up to the local PD?
Don
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dcmdon
NES Member
Did you tell them when it expired? Did you convey to them the urgency of the situation? If you don't tell them this, they can't help you.
Did you get an appointment? When is it for? Most PDs can squeeze you in immediately if necessary. If they want to.
When I purchased a residence in MA I made it clear that I was coming in with firearms and had a limited amount of time to get my LTC. I was offered an interview within 5 days, I couldn't make that one, but ended up getting an appt within 10 days of my call. I was courteous, professional, and absolute with my request. I started by stating the law.
"I know I only have 60 days to get my LTC and don't want any trouble, so I wanted to get things moving. Its important to me to follow the law. I also noticed the law gives you 40 days to issue me the license so I don't want any trouble".
In your case you could say something like "I know I have a 90 day grace period, but from what I've read it can take longer. I don't want any trouble so I'd appreciate if you could squeeze me in some time."
dcmdon
NES Member
I don't think they will. They could not care less.
Did you ever get a reminder letter?
No pic's , prints or Constitutional rights involved. Hell it's only money they're giving away.
jpdopes
NES Member
You get the 90 day grace period after expiration only if you apply before the expiration date. So, just make sure to get that appointment before the end of Sep. and you'll be fine.
I'm guessing there's no FIFO tracking system in place.
If what was relayed to me is true, that current backlog is at about 20,000 apps, and it takes 15 minutes per app...
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If you're one of the "paper" LTC holders, good luck with getting anywhere by calling. "I can't find you in the system."
If someone applies for renewal before the expiration date, they should, by law, receive their renewal (or be denied) within 40 days. If the 90 day grace period runs out because the state/town can't be bothered to do their job, that is not the person's fault.
The law is written in such a way that the situation being agonized over in this thread should never happen. It is no wonder that the law does not address it, since we know that government bureaucracies are the very picture of efficiency.
I'm pretty sure any case brought against someone in that situation would be a slam dunk win for the defendant, and might set an uncomfortable precedent for the state.
The law is written in such a way that the situation being agonized over in this thread should never happen. It is no wonder that the law does not address it, since we know that government bureaucracies are the very picture of efficiency.
I'm pretty sure any case brought against someone in that situation would be a slam dunk win for the defendant, and might set an uncomfortable precedent for the state.
dcmdon
NES Member
Lies
WallHack
Banned
I live in Spencer, they're pretty good with issuances and renewals. Took 7 weeks for my LTC to be issued last September, took 8 weeks for my MG license to be issued in April.
It might be the state.
It might be the state.
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It's within 30 days of the move IIRC
The law requires you to notify within 30 days. If you don't, you're handing them a reason to revoke or deny.
I waited until the last minute, but I submitted the renewal application before the expiration date. They didn't photograph or fingerprint me until a week or two after the expiration date though. Would this cause a problem? They didn't say there was any problem, and they cashed my check.
dcmdon
NES Member
It got lost because they sat on it for so long. The PD usually sits on it before sending it out. Not after it gets back.
I contacted GOAL about an issue - NEVER heard back from them - I don't think the help you unless you fork over cash to be a member first.
Where I live in MA, the wait is less than 60 days - Class A -Unrestricted. This was recent - and there was a backlog of 4 weeks - took a total of 6 weeks b/c the Chief was on vaca and he reviews all.
However, I was warned by the clerk at the PD that the new incoming chief coming in MAY change the LTC laws in my town - and start denying renewals - not directly but but NOT RESPONDING, using the "backlog" excuse.
My question - can the town come get your firearms if they become gun-free town - like they have in Carver MA???? (My best friend had his 2 "known" handguns taken by the Carver cops - Carver has a "no possession" ordinance/law. Not sure how they can do this - I never researched it - but he DID lose his guns - simply b/c he moved there from another city in MA and they were registered in MA.)
How the hell can we maintain our constitutional rights in MA?
Why bother buying a handgun in MA if we risk it getting seized?
As a former LEO from another state, I am completely baffled.
Private reply if necessary. Please.
Thanks.
Where I live in MA, the wait is less than 60 days - Class A -Unrestricted. This was recent - and there was a backlog of 4 weeks - took a total of 6 weeks b/c the Chief was on vaca and he reviews all.
However, I was warned by the clerk at the PD that the new incoming chief coming in MAY change the LTC laws in my town - and start denying renewals - not directly but but NOT RESPONDING, using the "backlog" excuse.
My question - can the town come get your firearms if they become gun-free town - like they have in Carver MA???? (My best friend had his 2 "known" handguns taken by the Carver cops - Carver has a "no possession" ordinance/law. Not sure how they can do this - I never researched it - but he DID lose his guns - simply b/c he moved there from another city in MA and they were registered in MA.)
How the hell can we maintain our constitutional rights in MA?
Why bother buying a handgun in MA if we risk it getting seized?
As a former LEO from another state, I am completely baffled.
Private reply if necessary. Please.
Thanks.
Holy shit, they actualy came and got his guns because they decided they didn't want him to have them anymore????
You would think some advocates like the NRA would jump all over that crap and sue the town into non-existance!
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My town just cashed my check....hopefully the mailman brings my LTC A!
You would think some advocates like the NRA would jump all over that crap and sue the town into non-existance!
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My town just cashed my check....hopefully the mailman brings my LTC A!
Just did some quick research on the whole Carver MA issue. They are pretty straightforward about semantics when answering questions on the LTC apps. SInce the cops never explained in detail why they took his guns, other than that the Chief of Police didn't issue LTC's in his town - based on the 4 websites I read (2 of them private citizens, 2 of them govt) was probably how he answered questions on the LTC form.
I didn't get into accessing town ordinances - but towns CAN enact ordinances that differ from state law, just as states can enact laws that differ form federal law (see, i.e., marijuana laws, gay marriage, etc.)
His mistake was applying for a renewal in Carver....
I didn't get into accessing town ordinances - but towns CAN enact ordinances that differ from state law, just as states can enact laws that differ form federal law (see, i.e., marijuana laws, gay marriage, etc.)
His mistake was applying for a renewal in Carver....
dcmdon
NES Member
Its very simple. If they refuse to renew your LTC then you move them out of MA during the grace period. You either keep them out of state or sell them.
If he moved within MA from a green town to a red town, or if the town changes based on a new chief, you still don't have a problem until you are up for renewal. But again, you will know ahead of time.
Your friend had to have missed warning signs for the cops to have shown up at his door. Did he try to get them transferred to a FFL so he could at least sell them?
Don
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I dont know what kind of guns he has, but at least some of the long guns can be kept on a FID, which is a shall issue license.
Is an FA-10 sale made 50 days into your grace period legal?
Thanks for the input - it good to discuss this stuff - no one I know personally can address this stuff so I appreciate the helpful comments and ideas.
(At all times I am referring to handguns - long guns...meh. If I lived in the country and not the city, that would be a different story.
Green Town? Red Town?
No - he didn't get a lawyer - too expensive. He did talk to one. Its not like a case Jim Sokolove would take on contingency
He had handguns - again - only 2 that were registered those those were the 2 he lost. He no longer lives in Carver so having a registered firearm is not an issue anymore as he has a LTC once again in his new town that place obviously hasn't yet succeeded from the Union as Carver has.
So...basically what you are telling me is that MA wins no matter what - by forcing you to register every gun, they literally force you to get rid of your handguns if the new Chief decides not to issue LTC (Class A) anymore...how is that OK? The local PD then knows you have firearms in your home and you no longer have a valid LTC. Which technically means, I am not allowed to have them in my home. Period. Right? Isn't that what I am reading in all these forums that discuss this issue?
Again I ponder, why the heck go out of state to buy if you have to fill out a MA transfer form (basically telling MA what you have) before the out of state dealer will give you the handgun? Prices are the same - any small difference or alleged savings in tax is automatically negated by the astronomical gas prices....
I guess b/c I am not a good ol' MA boy I don't know the answer.....
(At all times I am referring to handguns - long guns...meh. If I lived in the country and not the city, that would be a different story.
Green Town? Red Town?
No - he didn't get a lawyer - too expensive. He did talk to one. Its not like a case Jim Sokolove would take on contingency
He had handguns - again - only 2 that were registered those those were the 2 he lost. He no longer lives in Carver so having a registered firearm is not an issue anymore as he has a LTC once again in his new town that place obviously hasn't yet succeeded from the Union as Carver has.
So...basically what you are telling me is that MA wins no matter what - by forcing you to register every gun, they literally force you to get rid of your handguns if the new Chief decides not to issue LTC (Class A) anymore...how is that OK? The local PD then knows you have firearms in your home and you no longer have a valid LTC. Which technically means, I am not allowed to have them in my home. Period. Right? Isn't that what I am reading in all these forums that discuss this issue?
Again I ponder, why the heck go out of state to buy if you have to fill out a MA transfer form (basically telling MA what you have) before the out of state dealer will give you the handgun? Prices are the same - any small difference or alleged savings in tax is automatically negated by the astronomical gas prices....
I guess b/c I am not a good ol' MA boy I don't know the answer.....
http://www.northeastshooters.com/vb...guide-gun-rights-your-massachusetts-town.html
Correct, possession of guns in MA requires a license, period. The type of guns you can possess, and whether you are allowed to carry a concealed handgun, are both based on the type of license you have.
Actually, handguns must (by federal law) be transferred to you by a dealer in your state of residence. You can't just go out of state and buy a handgun. The out of state dealer would have to send the handgun to a MA dealer. When the MA dealer transfers the gun to you, they perform the normal Federal background check based on the 4473 form you fill out. They also do the MA "paperwork" (usually via a computer) which records the transfer. It is effectively a registration, since now they know that Gun XYZ with serial number 123 was transferred to you.
Renewal appointment in Lowell on July 15....."Should take about 3 months."
1-Called Chelsea today, September 10....."Still under review at Lowell PD."
2-Called Lowell PD....."We sent it to Chelsea back in July. Taking about 4 months. Chelsea always tells you they didn't get it yet!"
3-Called Chelsea back....."We don't have it. Lowell has to run a full background check, etc, etc."
1-Called Chelsea today, September 10....."Still under review at Lowell PD."
2-Called Lowell PD....."We sent it to Chelsea back in July. Taking about 4 months. Chelsea always tells you they didn't get it yet!"
3-Called Chelsea back....."We don't have it. Lowell has to run a full background check, etc, etc."
This shit will NEVER stop unless EVERYONE who is past the 90 day mark (or 40) starts serving EVERY police department AND the CHSB with a lawsuit.
The legislature will not help you. Therefore the only peaceful means of redress left is to sue the departments in court.
The Police Chief is the proper party to sue. You only have 90 days from the date of denial to file. The denial occurs if they don't give it to you in 40 days. Basically, you have to file between 40 and 130 days after you apply.
