.380 showdown: S&W Bodyguard vs Ruger LCP

AF83 said:
I pocket carry my BG on a pretty consistent basis. I bring it to the range now and again just to keep it running. I have not had one single issue with it. I pulled the trigger and it went bang then spit out a case and put a fresh round in. I've put about 250 round through it. As far the trigger being long and hard I agree but I don't mind it being it is a pocket gun and I carry chambered and safety off. This isn't a 25yd range gun. It's an up close life saver. It doesn't require a super light trigger.
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I hope you continue to have flawless performance with yours. Ours didn't start acting up until well after 250 rounds.
 
Hooper said:
Really well done! Thanks for the excellent write up and photos! BTW, the Sig P238 beats them both on every level [smile]
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No joke, but the 238 and the Kahr P380 beat them both TREMENDOUSLY on one level - shootability.

The Sig and the Kahr are both a pleasure to shoot. The same can't be said for either the Ruger or the Smith. I'd never carry a 238 because I'm left handed and there's no safety for me. I've also decided that I'm only going to carry DAO guns. But thats me. Its a really great gun.

One other thing. The recoil spring on the Sig feels like its about half the strength of the Kahrs. Any adult has enough hand strength to work the Sig slide. Thats not so for the Kahr.
 
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Thanks for the writeup, been thinking about one of these for a while. May have to get one for x-mas, I haven't bought anything gun related in over 2 months. [shocked]

The LCP looks a bit smaller/smoother for concealing. Def not a range gun. Did get to shoot a mag full of a friends BG. Asked me if I wanted to shoot any more.... no thanks.
 
cbrxx said:
The LCP looks a bit smaller/smoother for concealing. Def not a range gun. Did get to shoot a mag full of a friends BG. Asked me if I wanted to shoot any more.... no thanks.
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If you hated the BG, you should shoot the LCP before you buy.

The trigger is slightly better, but everything else (sights, ergonomics, etc) is worse.

Out of 350+ rounds i have had 1 light primer strike with the BG (on target ammo, none on 100+ rds of carry ammo) and no other malfunctions. The galloway parts the OP used short stroke the hammer and cause failures.

Admittedly, i don't have a ton of rounds through the gun, but i didn't buy it for the range either. That said, it's surprisingly accurate at the range, and i shoot it much better than i ever shot the LCP.
 
Squib308 said:
i would sell them all and get a kahr CW380 or P380
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I'm the owner of a P380 and a Glock G42.

I got rid of my LCP and bought a P380 after shooting another member's Kahr. The LCP is no fun to shoot. Its a bit snappy and the trigger is no fun. The Kahr is much tamer and the trigger is enjoyable to run.

However, the Kahr is still reasonably difficult to shoot well at anything beyond conversational distances. I takes the same kind of dedicated practice that a J Frame requires. The problem is in the tiny grip. When fired 2 handed slowly, it is incredibly accurate. The Kahr is also finicky about ammo. It likes ammo on the higher end of the power scale and when run with what it likes, it totally reliable. But my Kahr was not something I'd trust until it had 200+ rounds through it and I'd found what it liked.

The glock is a little bit of a different beast. I got it originally for my wife to carry. She shoots a G34 very well, but has a difficult time with a G26 or even a G19 mainly because she's not good with recoil. Eventually, she'll get better but in the mean time its difficult for her to carry a G34 around.

I may have done a review of a 42 at some point on NES, maybe even in this thread. Well, that gun, I ended up selling to my father. So today I went to the range with another new G42 to test. This one didn't go as smoothly as the first. For the first mag, it choked on federal and CCI. Amazingly, its first mag of Tulamo ran perfectly. So I shot 2 more mags, durring which time I could feel the gun change how it ran. The rounds ejected farther and the gun seemed to settle in over the course of the first 3 mags of Tulamo, which seemed hottter than the other ball ammo.

Then I went back to the federl and it ran flawlessly, then back to the CCI and again no problems. This whole time, I was shooting at a 6" paper plate hung at 30', and even when doing double taps, both rounds landed on the plate.

The gun was very controllable with the stock mag. But it was even better when using the mag with a Pierce extension attached to it. With the pierce extension it was almost like shooting a .22. Recoil is but a small fraction of what you feel with a Ruger LCP. If you are someone who believes that shot placement is more important than caliber, then this is a great choice.

As it is, I still shoot my Kahr P9 just as well as the 42. But I shoot the 42 much much better than I shoot the Kahr P380.
For me, the Glock is a bit too big for pocket carry. So it doesn't really have a place in my carry rotation.

(It is still SUBSTANTIALLY less bulky than a Kahr PM9)

If I'm not pocket carrying (P380) then the P9 is small enough to wear with any untucked shirt OWB.

But if I was recoil shy, the much much lighter recoil of the G42 would make it a very attractive option for holstered carry

As it is, I'd say the G42 is probably the best defensive gun I've ever shot for people who are recoil sensitive.

Don

p.s. Oh and once it had ;20 rounds through it, the 42 would digest anything you could feed it. Including Federal HST and Winchester Ranger hollowpoint.

p.p.s. One other thing. The recoil spring on the G42 is fairly light. Which again is a help for smaller, weaker people. My wife can shoot the P380 OK. But she has difficulty with its stiff recoil spring when it comes to manipulating the gun. With the lighter recoil spring, she should be able to run the 42 easily.

p.p.s. In summary.

LCP - No fun to shoot. Takes practice to shoot well.
P380 - Fun to shoot. Takes practice to shoot well. Easier to shoot with the +1 extended mag.
G42 - So easy and fun to shoot, you will find yourself bringing it to the range often.
 
This review has a basic flaw, which is that it compares a modified BG380 to a stock LCP.

I also have a BG380 and i bought the Galloway kit.

I believe its the Galloway kit which is unreliable, not the BG. I had all sorts of trouble with the Galloway kit to the point that I finally removed it. It is unreliable. I didn't get light strikes, instead the trigger bar was not always engaging the hammer. Sometimes it did, sometimes it didnt. It rendered the firearm useless.

I have since uninstalled the Galloway kit. While I am back to the long trigger pull, it has been reliable for me in this manner. Reliable means I went through about two boxes of ammo with no issues. I know thats not a lot, but I could barely get through a magazines worth of ammo with the Galloway without at least one if not multiple failures.

For me the longer trigger pull makes it less accurate, but I think you may have arrived at a different conclusion had you just compared the two firearms factory stock.
 
Great point. And the LCP's trigger is no joy to use either.

I may not have said it in my brief review of the Kahr and Glock in post #40 of this thread, but I really think that their triggers are part of the reason they are so much more shootable.

Think of it thisway, all of these guns have little, short, skinny grips. They're not exactly the best size and shape to resist the torque that a trigger that is not squeezed perfectly to the rear can impart. Softer, smoother trigger means less torque and better accuracy when shot the way these gun are often shot, fast and with one hand.
 
Great thread. My only experience with these mouse guns has been with the two BGs that I've owned, and the various posts have reviewed it well enough that I have nothing to add other than my belief that the light strikes mentioned in the review were most likely caused by the Galloway kit. Its basic physics and that kit is trading off some of the motion of the hammer in return for a shorter trigger pull. Less movement on the hammer means less momentum, unless you are increasing the hammer spring, which in turn could make the trigger even harder to pull, even though its shorter, and still might not 100% cure the light strikes due to the reduced travel. With that being said, I will never use those parts in mine, but would certainly polish up any contact points to smooth it a bit if I ever get around to disassembling it. The mag guts kit should be OK though, and that is certainly worth doing to get a bit more capacity. I sold my original BG with the laser mainly because I had a carry gun that I could shoot much better and has an amazing trigger (SR9c), as well as having higher capacity and and arguably more effective round, but the big trade off is size and weight, which is no big deal in the winter, but for me personally is a huge deal in the warmer months. For that, the BG is incredibly hard to beat, especially if you live in MA, and don't want to pay a huge markup for something off list. Yes, the trigger completely sucks, but as others have mentioned, it is NOT a range gun, and for its intended use, is perfectly usable. I don't mind the longer DA pull because I carry it without the safety. Since I found the laser awkward to use on my original, I opted for the new M&P version this time since it would shave a bit of bulk and weight off an already easy to conceal package, so why not? I don't have both guns to compare, but I believe that the trigger is still the same (no improvement for those wondering). This gun definitely fills a much needed spot in my carry rotation because it allows me to have a gun with me when I otherwise wouldn't because of comfort, or concealability issues. When I sold the original it was in the winter and by Spring I found myself quickly missing it and remembering why I had bought it in the first place. If I ever get around to finding a decently priced p938, I may try to use that in place of the BG just because I prefer 9mm, not because I have any doubts my Critical Defense HPs won't do the job, but because you have to pay almost the price of .45 to practice with .380 (when you can even find it!), and that pisses me off. Since I have other 9mm guns and its usually easy to find, I'd rather just consolidate and have a smaller carry that I won't mind practicing with at the range.
 
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Nicely done. While your article is great as far as it goes, it really would have been even more informative if you had included the Keltec P3AT along with those other two. The Keltec, after all, was the progenitor of this family of now familiar lightweight, polymer defensive handguns. The two you’ve reviewed came far after the Keltec was in the market place. Obviously they have been well accepted since there are so many being designed anymore.

Most of the points you’ve presented would apply to the Keltec, too. These little pocket pistols are strictly for defensive and close quarters situations. Even at 7 yards there is no aim, really. You shoot instinctively rather than gathering a sight-picture. Also, someone made a point about this not being a “girl’s gun”. More importantly, you have to have a good grip on all three of these little demons and if you’re weak-wristed, they will not be easy to control. They do require practice, especially from a draw situation.

I carry my Keltec for a couple of reasons:

First, someone made the comment about having it in your pocket rather than your 454 Casul in the safe. Precisely correct. I carry my Keltec 100% of the time. It’s with me whenever my wallet is in my pocket. Even if, in cold weather, I carry a pistol on my belt under a sweatshirt, the Keltec seems to always be in my pocket, too.

Second, it’s extremely concealable. I run it typically in my pants pocket with no one being the wiser but that requires a daily blowing out of the pocket lint. I can even carry it in a pair of shorts that way, even a bathing suit. All three pistols would do the same. I also, however, do have a holster for it that I bought on line. It’s the one that looks like a phone case and it sits seductively on my belt when I’m dressed, right out in the open. No one has EVER asked me if that’s a gun holster since pretty much everyone has something on their belt anymore. Wonderful design.

Third, regarding the laser, I must tell you that Crimson Trace’s laser designed for these mini-pistols is an amazing tool and, I think, required addition to these handguns. No, I don’t expect to hit the target where the laser is pointed. That would take way too much concentration and time to aim. Rather, what the laser brings to the party is that it’s intimidating to have a red dot on your chest while someone is pointing a gun….ANY gun at you. There have been plenty of stories about just that red dot dissuading a bad gun from going further. And, the Crimson Trace unit blends in with the Keltec and the other two cousin small frame handguns perfectly. The ‘trigger” for it requires no thinking as it’s right in front of the trigger guard and your hand will naturally turn on the momentary switch. In an emergency situation the laser becomes superfluous but not in your way. Maybe, however, it does give pause to a bad guy from making the next move. Also, to be honest, if you’re shooting that little pistol at a weird angle as opposed to being able to set up with the perfect isosceles stance, that laser will come in handy in showing you where you’re muzzle is pointing.

Fourth, it’s a DAO machine. I ALWAYS carry with one on the chamber so no racking of the slide or flipping any safeties requires. Draw, pull trigger. It’s incredibly safe and ready to go at all times.

I’m a huge fan of these pistols and my Keltec in particular. They give me a level of confidence that I can carry something this small that can do so much for me if called on. I do practice with it any time and every time I’m at the range. Typically I’ll simply stand facing the target and practice slipping my hand into my pocket, producing the Keltec and pulling the trigger twice in one smooth motion. That’s they way I suspect it would be put into use. A bad guy will never suspect a pistol could be concealed that way so the element of surprise would be on my side to be sure. The laser comes on as I hold the trigger guard, too. One more factor in my favor.

Thanks for taking the time to put that review together.
 
I've held a BG380 but never fired one. From all the reviews I've read about the two guns it seems I made the right choice buying the LCP. I've had it for a few years and it gets carried at work, and sometimes in the Summer if I'm jogging in the woods. That's about it. I've put about 150 rounds through it without a hiccup.
 
As much as i like to ridicule the BG380, mine has fire a few hundred rounds flawless. No malfunctions from start to round 200ish...respectable for a mouse gun. It also eats any ammo, cheap FMJ, HP whatever. I have heard horror stories about the BG380 but mine is a keeper.....however the kahr 380's just feel and shoot amazing so I prefer them any day.
 
Cabinetman- the Keltec is basically a Ruger.

Or more accurately, the Ruger is basically a Keltec with better QC. As a small dealer, I've sold about a dozen Kel-Tecs, about half of them have had to go back to correct something. And about half of those had to go back twice. (or more)

If you look at a Ruger and a kelTec side by side with the slides off, they are basically the same gun. Its clear Ruger knocked off the P3AT.

In my mind, a proper functioning KelTec and a Ruger are effectively the same gun. They both shoot the same and recoil the same. In summary, they are both the smallest (except for a Seecamp) and lightest .380s you can buy. But neither is a joy to shoot.

Don
 
The Ruger LCP is the non-shit version of the P3AT. If you get lucky and you get a P3AT that runs right, you have what amounts to 95% of an LCP.

-Mike
 
45collector said:
My LCP doesn't get shot for joy. It's gets shot for a periodic check of proficiency and familiarity. [wink]

Now my father's (RIP) Colt Official Police .38spl that he carried long before I was born, that gets shot for joy and nostalgia.
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That's fine.

But when you have a gun thats nearly as small, but is fun to shoot, you will shoot it more. And you will become more proficient.

I had a LCP for about 4 years. I have no serious complaints other than that it was no fun to shoot.

My P380 is enjoyable to shoot. I've gone through more .380 in the last year I've had the Kahr than I did in the 4 years I had the Ruger.

Now that I've added a G42 to the mix (see review previous page), I'm definitely going to go through more .380. Fortunately a member was kind enough to GIVE me about 1500 pieces of .380 brass in exchange for my making a $60 donation to Comm2A. A win win for all.

$10 for a new turret for my Lee classic cast and $30 for dies and I'm making .380 at about $5.50 per box.

In the unlikely event I'm going through so much that the Lee at about 120 rounds per hour is not enough, I can always spend the $150 it will cost for a proper caliber conversion for my Dillon 650.
 
I'm most assuredly agree that shooting these little monsters is NOT a way to have a lot of fun at the range. To keep their size small, they have little weight to help tame the recoil and if you have meathook hands like me, it all but disappears into the palm of your hand. Still I can manage to hit moa side-of-a-barn with it, enough to be satisfied that center-mass anything will suffice. That's the beauty of these tiny pistols. So, I practice with it as much as possible figuring that I won't be surprised when or if the time came to make it happen. I'll repeat, however, that the laser ADDS a lot to these guns. The Ruger uses the same model Crimson Trace as the Keltec, I believe.

Rome
 
Thats kindof my point. The P380 and G42 are not monsters. They are pussycats.

I'd even go so far as to say that the G42 is one of the tamest centerfire handguns I've ever shot. On par with a 686 revolver shooting .38 spcl wadcutters.
 
This is an awesome post! Ive been watching youtube videos, on a regular basis, comparing these two pistols and this is by far the best review. Great Job
 
I love my M&P BG380. I've had 0 issues with it. I think when they did the original Bodyguard, there were some issues. Once they made it to the "M&P Bodyguard 380", they revised the issues to make it more reliable. The trigger still sucks, but I have no problems shooting 12" steel plates at 25 yards with +P ammo. My BG380 has been my EDC since I purchased it. It is so small that it just disappears when carried IWB. I also pocket carry depending on what I wear. As I said in my first sentence, I love this gun. especially since I paid $280 for it new
 
No problems with my M&P BG380. I had a chance and bought a CW380 to replace it for no reason other than I have a nice PM9 but the thing was a huge POS after the "break in" period. Back with the BG380. I will only carry a BG380 and a 642 in my pocket. These are point and shoot guns, not comfortable to shoot range guns. I never understood the bad trigger argument for a small self defense gun. If you needed to use the gun for self defense whether it's a 1 pound or 18 pound trigger, you're going to be pulling it so hard with the adrenaline running off the charts.


I carry and highly recommend a c3tatical solutions kydex pocket holster with my BG380.
 

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