2023 MA Gun Ban: House has engrossed H.4139, waiting on Senate

[VetteGirlMA]

If he kills the green agenda and EV subsidies, I will be happy.

As far as spending, there is not a single person in Washington (R or D) that is serious about reducing debt and spending. So no matter who we get, sh*t will blow up economically.

But, there is a difference how it blows up. EV and the green BS deal are just really bad for everyone.

There isn't a politician anywhere inside the borders of this country that will acknowledge to the people that the neverending spending party is over. As far as the green agenda, all the leftists have to deal is appeal to Trump's vanity, make him a gold plated Trump themed solar panel for Mar-A-Lago and it will continue on like nothing ever happened. There is no one committed to doing the task of reducing the size and scope of the government primarily because the people inside it right now are turning government into bureaucratic dynasties.

 

[VetteGirlMA]

Just to stop the over regulation of government is a plus. Reversing EPA and climate alarmist policies it would be far better than DemocRATS.


Haa! Broc and me on same page.

I'll make a wager right here and now that Trump will do nothing and will brag about doing nothing and calling it 'the big win'. This election is going to suck bad.

 

[71montess]

I'll make a wager right here and now that Trump will do nothing and will brag about doing nothing and calling it 'the big win'. This election is going to suck bad.

I prefer to have a positive attitude. We can have a beer if I'm wrong.

 

[VetteGirlMA]

I prefer to have a positive attitude. We can have a beer if I'm wrong.

The problem is lacking foresight all we will have is the history left behind meaning wading through 4 more years of Trump. However he did serve in the office for 4 years already so we know what kind of presidency we will get. I think a lot of republicans are going to be holding their noses voting for the uniparty Trump platform this year because he's going to end up picking an establishment republican that appeals to democrats to peel away votes from Biden. Anti-2A votes will definitely be on the table. I can't wait for the gotcha moment when Trump signs it and he will. After the election blows over these same republicans will end up bitching about the uniparty.

 

[Broc]

Can we go back to this bill?

NES has Trump discussions all over.

 

[hunt4riches]

The problem is lacking foresight all we will have is the history left behind meaning wading through 4 more years of Trump. However he did serve in the office for 4 years already so we know what kind of presidency we will get. I think a lot of republicans are going to be holding their noses voting for the uniparty Trump platform this year because he's going to end up picking an establishment republican that appeals to democrats to peel away votes from Biden. Anti-2A votes will definitely be on the table. I can't wait for the gotcha moment when Trump signs it and he will. After the election blows over these same republicans will end up bitching about the uniparty.

That's just it... he's done after this one way or the other. If elected, he can work with impunity as there will be no Trump 28. He could pass a super-AWB just as easy as he could use a heavy fist at the border with door-to-door deportations. If he does that, this bill becomes moot. We're all ready less than a dozen rino votes away from it nationally.

 

[mothybee]

WOW! How about the powerball number for this week.

 

[CatSnoutSoup]

What are the odds the Senate version of the bill also contains the language about requesting a serial number (read: permission) from the state for a PMF?

Given the "ghost gun" misinformation campaign I am going to guess it is nearly a sure thing it will be included.

Dispite the fact they have no apparatus or funding to make it a reality.

 

[Rocky Mosasaurus]

Have they

What are the odds the Senate version of the bill also contains the language about requesting a serial number (read: permission) from the state for a PMF?

Given the "ghost gun" misinformation campaign I am going to guess it is nearly a sure thing it will be included.

Dispite the fact they have no apparatus or funding to make it a reality.

Extremely likely.

All of the points touched upon by speakers from the open session a couple months ago will be targets. This includes everything from semis, ghost guns (GASP), The Mill, and everything in between that GOAL has been trying to protect.

 

[p..]

What are the odds the Senate version of the bill also contains the language about requesting a serial number (read: permission) from the state for a PMF?

Given the "ghost gun" misinformation campaign I am going to guess it is nearly a sure thing it will be included.

Dispite the fact they have no apparatus or funding to make it a reality.

My completely off the cuff opinion with nothing concrete at all to base it on is they will find a mechanism to pull federal info on 100% receivers purchased through FFLs and create a state database after seeing what happened with Illinois registration. Yes, I know that's two kinds of illegal but it won't surprise be one bit.

As for 80% or 3D, I'm pretty sure that's already covered. As soon as you get it to the point where it functions, they want it registered through the portal.

 

[Mesatchornug]

As for 80% or 3D, I'm pretty sure that's already covered. As soon as you get it to the point where it functions, they want it registered through the portal.

they can [want] in one hand and shit in the other...

 

[CatSnoutSoup]

As for 80% or 3D, I'm pretty sure that's already covered. As soon as you get it to the point where it functions, they want it registered through the portal.

Sorry, we know what the current law is regarding a PMF. Are you saying that you believe that the senators will look at it as 'good enough' and ignore the language that is in the House bill?

 

[p..]

Sorry, we know what the current law is regarding a PMF. Are you saying that you believe that the senators will look at it as 'good enough' and ignore the language that is in the House bill?

I suspect they aren't going to wait for the owner to register a completed firearm. I suspect they will attempt to compile a registry of parts.

I will be happy to be wrong.

 

[CatSnoutSoup]

I suspect they will attempt to compile a registry of parts.

How does that work?

 

[OnTheRoad]

How does that work?

It won't, but that's never stopped them before.

 

[Rocky Mosasaurus]

How does that work?

Shaking on the tree of all manufacturers and postal services for shipping and handling logs. Some companies telling them to get f***ed and others complying out of fear of retaliation or some form of dirt they have exposed and want to cover their asses over. Real Orwellian Shit.

 

[Joeldiaz]

Texted Senator Velis this morning asking for a timeline. He said "soon", "as early as next week". They are having a meeting today at 11 on the bill. He told me to text him later today and he will be able to provide a better timeline.

Any update on that timeline?

 

[CrackPot]

What are the odds the Senate version of the bill also contains the language about requesting a serial number (read: permission) from the state for a PMF?

Given the "ghost gun" misinformation campaign I am going to guess it is nearly a sure thing it will be included.

Dispite the fact they have no apparatus or funding to make it a reality.

What is amusing is the language in the house bill for this. pages and pages when they can do this in ONE SENTENCE. "All unserialized firearms must be serialized by a FFL within 7 days" or some such bullshit. Instead they have 1/16" font size, .003 inches deep engraving, request serial number, etc.

Federal regulation already covers ALL of this including making it traceable when ANY FFL touches a PMF. RDSKEY-unique where RDSKEY is the first 3 and last 5 of the FFL# and unique is unique to that FFL. Then its traceable as you check that FFLs books and bam, you know who he transferred it to. Yet again the state writing gun legislation with no clue what is already out there and how it works.

 

[Broc]

Shaking on the tree of all manufacturers and postal services for shipping and handling logs. Some companies telling them to get f***ed and others complying out of fear of retaliation or some form of dirt they have exposed and want to cover their asses over. Real Orwellian Shit.

You really think they have the capacity to do this?

 

[Rocky Mosasaurus]

You really think they have the capacity to do this?

Probably not but they'll make an attempt and overtime their efforts will yield some results. It doesn't really matter if they get concrete results as long as they get a few unlucky bastards and make an example of them to scare others. It's worked on a surface level here with manufacturers shipping to MA, there's no reason to think they can't dig a little deeper to take it a step further.

 

[Broc]

Probably not but they'll make an attempt and overtime their efforts will yield some results. It doesn't really matter if they get concrete results as long as they get a few unlucky bastards and make an example of them to scare others. It's worked on a surface level here with manufacturers shipping to MA, there's no reason to think they can't dig a little deeper to take it a step further.

It hasn't worked.
They haven't made an example of anyone.

 

[Picton]

It hasn't worked.
They haven't made an example of anyone.

Yep.

To be fair, they hardly need to; we live in a world that shit its pants when Healy ran an ad, so they're likely to count on a similar "enforcement mechanism" here.

Meaning, they'll pass what they pass and then sit back and forget they passed it, knowing 90% of the gun owners here will comply. They'll never prosecute because they know that'll lead to the whole edifice crumbling down.

 

[Rocky Mosasaurus]

Yep.

To be fair, they hardly need to; we live in a world that shit its pants when Healy ran an ad, so they're likely to count on a similar "enforcement mechanism" here.

Meaning, they'll pass what they pass and then sit back and forget they passed it, knowing 90% of the gun owners here will comply. They'll never prosecute because they know that'll lead to the whole edifice crumbling down.

^this

 

[thorin]

Can we go back to this bill?

NES has Trump discussions all over.

Amen! There are plenty of Trump threads, or P250 threads or whatever. Do people just respond to whatever is the newest post without regard to the topic?

Not seeing much regarding this new Senate bill. They must be playing it very close to the vest. Not going to be good for us after hearing about the AGO briefing the Senate about their wish list

 

[Broc]

Do people just respond to whatever is the newest post without regard to the topic?

You must be new to NES.

 

[drgrant]

If the cops come to your house and your don't have what they are looking for - they will tear out your walls and rip apart your house until they are happy.

And, if they find anything that is NOT registered - you'll be charged with illegal guns too.

Like that AR your built from a stripped lower and never FA10'd.

You'll be going to prison for a long time.

Who is going to pay for that?

The thing you're talking about requires the allocation of literally millions of dollars.

I realize your business is peddling fear but the reality is in this state the government is slothful as it is shitty. There are thousands of people "riding dirty" as violators in hardcore AWB states right now. Could they get picked off? Maybe. But TPTB doesn't want to pay for that shit. Even in California where they actually fund that stuff, they chose the least politically offensive option which was to harass prohibited persons that got a gun before they became marked as such.

Also you're forgetting a crucial part of the whole thing.... in Mass registration is not compulsory so it's kind of difficult to use records or lack thereof of any kind of a evidence that somebody actually possesses a presumed firearm. Now that said if they wanted to start doing that they could actually change the system and make a full-blown compulsory registration system which would allow them to do what you're describing to do rather easily but the system is definitely not anywhere near there yet. Guess what, that costs money, too.

If I was going to place bets on any of this legislation 98% of it is going to be basically virtue signaling like basically the rest of the entirety of mass gun law is and has been for the past like 50 years or whatever. Tack ons to make people extra miserable. Meanwhile they talk a big game but there are still guys with lifetime FIDs and safes full of guns they got 100 yrs ago.

 

[DW357]

Not going to be good for us after hearing about the AGO briefing the Senate about their wish list

forgive my ignorance but where was this discussed/mentioned?

 

[thorin]

You must be new to NES.

If I wanted to get pedantic about it this thread is technically a dupe of a thread I started in April 2023 Massachusetts "Omnibus" gun bill

forgive my ignorance but where was this discussed/mentioned?

"Members of Attorney General Andrea Campbell’s office and the Executive Office of Public Safety and Security covered the intricacies of firearms, including describing different parts of weapons to senators, Senate Majority Leader Cindy Creem told reporters on her way out of the meeting.
The private discussion took place only days after Senate President Karen Spilka said the chamber would offer up its own firearms-related reform bill by the end of January, a response to a proposal the House approved last year after some controversy."

MA Senate Democrats getting handle on gun reform bill promised by end of January

Senate Democrats on Beacon Hill moved closer to getting a handle on what a promised gun reform bill could look like during an hours-long, closed-door meeting Wednesday where lawmakers heard present…

www.bostonherald.com

 

[alx]

I suspect they aren't going to wait for the owner to register a completed firearm. I suspect they will attempt to compile a registry of parts.

I will be happy to be wrong.

I assume that would be on some other planet though? Because on ours the guberment is not exactly a datamining powerhouse nor they have the skillset to become one in the foreseeable future.

There is no quick and dirty information- based way of evaluating if a person has enough parts to build a functional gun so I believe this is not the path they will take. I do not know for sure what they will do, but whatever it is it will not involve heavy data processing on the back end.

My take is they will simply try to ban anything and everything in sight (which 4139 is attempting) and hope that when they have a person of interest they can overwhelm him/her (financially) by sheer legal garbage volume until something sticks and they sink the poor guy/ gal.

My 2 cents...

 

[waehrik]

If he kills the green agenda and EV subsidies, I will be happy.

As far as spending, there is not a single person in Washington (R or D) that is serious about reducing debt and spending. So no matter who we get, sh*t will blow up economically.

But, there is a difference how it blows up. EV and the green BS deal are just really bad for everyone.

How do you feel about bringing manufacturing back to the US? Because that's one thing that Trump always talked about but aside from a few tariffs didn't do a whole lot about. Unlike the way the current EV subsidies are structured. There are very strict qualifications in the IRA for when a vehicle is determined worthy of the credits. In order to be eligible at all it has to have been assembled in North America. Very few vehicles are currently eligible due to that restriction. BUT you may notice that just about every single foreign owned car company has a manufacturing plant under construction right now so that they will be able to meet that requirement in the next few years. I'd say that's money very well spent on blue collar workers and local engineering jobs. Even Chinese owned Volvo/Polestar have a plant under construction currently.

If that's true, then half of the credit ($3,750) is granted if the battery minerals were "extracted or processed in the United States or a U.S. free-trade agreement partner or recycled in North America." The second half of the credit requires that "battery’s components that are manufactured or assembled in North America." Good. Keep industry local and with our trade partners. What's so bad about that? It keeps our allies strong while spending very minimal money in the process and money that goes right back to taxpayers. And each of those two categories has a percentage that has to be met to qualify. It's why some Teslas fell off the eligibility list in 2024 because they weren't able to meet the increased 50% requirement. That goes all the way up to 80% in 2027 and 100% for batteries in 2029. All North American labor close to home. But you might say that's a problem because it includes Mexico and Canada. So what? We want a strong Mexico so people stop coming over the border from there and take the easier route and just stay. It's a long trip through so if Mexico becomes more prosperous we have less illegal immigration to deal with.

Win-win for short money and no military involvement. It's really a well targeted funding for local industry expansion. Unlike the CHIPS act where we're just paying giant companies to build factories here directly but US citizens don't directly get that funding back.