Zastava M70

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papijoe

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Looking for some advice from the AK gurus. Apparently I'm not the only one starting to get nervous about gun bans and the AKs of better repute seem to be getting snapped up. My favorite shop has a couple of Zastavas. I couldn't find too much online about them. At $525 they are cheap compared the Saigas I've seen lately. There are still some WASR 10s available. Any guidance greatly appreciated
 
I have no idea about m70s, but yugo chicks are hot:

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and I really hope this is one is a dude:

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it could be you bro ... [grin]
 
I looked at a Zastava yesterday in NH. It is much better quality then the WASR, but lower quality than the Saiga. For the money, I think it's a great gun. They were out of stock, or I'd have bought one.
 
imho, an ak is an ak. I have had a few and they've all been the same in functionality, literally. Just stay away from the Egyptian ones.
 
Are you thinking of pullman arms? The zastavas are only single stack. They will mill them out to be double stack for you. I took a look at them before I bought my SGL and they seemed nice. Never shot one so can't really speak about performance but seemed pretty solid from a once over stand point. Can't comment on WASR's but picked on up and put it down pretty much it.
 
Yes that's where I saw them. I'll talk to them about that option but thinking now it might be better to wait until the Saigas are back in stock. Just hoping the prices don't go up again. Thanks Panda!
 
I just got a N-Pap...Sold my SGL and wanted another AK. For the money the fit and finish of the N-Pap was very good. The furniture was polymer and the milled mag well to accept double stack mags was very clean. I took it home, field stripped it and gave it a good cleaning. I was very impressed with the finish and mill work, it did not look butchered at all. For 599 you cant go wrong.
 
DSCN3176.jpg i just got a npap underfolder off of atlantic. one of the best aks ive owned and ive had a good number. finish is great and rifle is straight and built the right way.
 
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AK/Commie gun collecter checking in. Below is from an AK buying guide for newbies. Great info and should help narrow things down for you. Just for the love of God don't get a tacticrap AK with a bunch of polymer stuff

So you want to buy an AK and don't know where to start?

The options can be broken down into two categories of variants: The original 7.62X39 AKM variants OR the "new" 5.45X39 AK-74 variants. There are AKs in 5.56x45 NATO but I have zero experience with those and cannot give advice on them, nor would I recommend them because for the AK platform, the 7.62X39 and 5.45X39 variants are king.

My personal recommendation for everyone who asks is to get your first AK in 7.62x39. The magazines for this caliber AK are cheaper, the ammunition is more widely available, the round is much stronger and it is better than the AK-74 (in 5.45x39) in most ways that a civilian would use a rifle. Other than accuracy beyond 200 yards and controllability under full auto fire, there are no other benefits to the 5.45x39 cartridge over the 7.62x39.

If you decide to buy an AKM in 7.62x39, then these are my recommendations:

1. The Molot VEPR is regarded by many as the king of AKM rifles. It is built on a Russian receiver and a Russian barrel, with the more minor parts being American to fulfill 922r requirements. The receiver that the VEPR uses is an RPK (LMG) 1.5mm receiver. Typically, VEPRs come with the 20" or 23" barrel although there are 16.5" versions as well. The standard AKM is built on a 1mm receiver with a 16.3" barrel. But since the Molot factory specialized in building machine guns during the Soviet Union, it now builds all of its rifles on the 1.5mm RPK light machine gun receiver (because machine guns need heavier receivers to handle more punishment). The benefit of a heavy receiver and a longer barrel is that the gun will not over heat during rapid and prolonged firing. The longer barrel also makes the gun more accurate. The con is that this makes for a noticeably heavier gun, so if you are a skinny bastard, you may want to take this into consideration. The going price for a Molot VEPR is $850 - $1,300 but it is well worth the price and the gun will definitely outlive you if you keep up with maintenance. Either of these will do:
http://www.atlanticfirearms.com/comp....html?Itemid=0

http://www.atlanticfirearms.com/comp...d2-detail.html

2. The Izmash Saiga comes in at second place. Izmash Saigas are built on a standard 1mm AKM receiver and they come with the standard 16.3" barrel. These rifles are built at the famous Izmash plant in Izhevsk, Russia. They come into the US in their 10 round "Sporter" configuration and then an American armory opens up the magazine well so that it can accept standard 30 round magazines. Unlike the VEPRs which are imported and reconfigured by one company (MOLOT USA LTD), the Saigas are reconfigured by several companies, so quality will vary depending on who did the reconfiguration. You should look to buy it from a reputable builder/distributor, such as Atlantic Firearms: http://www.atlanticfirearms.com/comp...od-detail.html Arsenal also makes very good Saiga conversions and KVar is also a reputable distributor.

The biggest difference between the Saiga and the VEPR is that the Saiga is built on a standard 1mm receiver, whereas (as previous mentioned) the VEPR is built on an RPK 1.5mm receiver. This is because in the Soviet Union, the Izmash plant's primary weapons building function was to build AKM assault rifles, not light/heavy machine guns as was Molot. The main benefit of the lighter receiver and shorter barrel is less weight and more maneuverability with the shorter barrel. The con is that the receiver cannot handle as much punishment with excessive use. In my opinion, in the ways that a civilian would use a rifle, the Saiga is just as good as a VEPR, maybe even better because of the weight reduction.

3. In third place comes the Arsenal line of AKMs. You can explore the options here: http://www.arsenalinc.com/usa/ It is built on a Bulgarian receiver with a standard AKM barrel. Arsenals are right up there with VEPRs and Saigas. The differences between an Arsenal and a Saiga are few and a far apart so I won't go further into it. Prices vary but usually Arsenals cost $1,000+.

4. In fourth place comes the Yugoslavian/Serbian Zastava line of AKs. They run for $550+. They have been as low as $399 this year on JG Sales. If you can find a second or third generation NPAP or OPAP, they are the best because they come with the double stack bolts. The gen 1s come with a single stack bolt (assembly flaw by Century Arms) and the ugly dust cover optic mount. I would stay away from those and stick with the current generation (gen 3). The NPAP comes with a standard 1mm receiver, while the OPAP comes with a heavy 1.6mm receiver, RPK trunnion and heavy barrel. The OPAP can definitely handle rapid firing better than a standard AK, I own one and have dumped 300 rounds through it consecutively without an issue. Although it is noticeably heavier than the NPAP which is a standard size AK. The reason why the OPAP comes with the 1.6mm receiver is because the original Yugoslavian M70 had a grenade launcher option, so they needed to a heavy receiver to tolerate that much pressure. The major drawback to the Zastava line of AKs is that they do not come with chrome lined barrels, so if you are shooting corrosive ammo, it will corrode your barrel if you don't clean it immediately after shooting. But as long as you clean your gun, even with corrosive ammo, either of these two will serve you good.

There is also the M70 under folder. It is not a "pure" AK like the aforementioned AKs because it uses an American made receiver and barrel. The most complex part of building an AK rifle is the barrel and stock assembly. I personally prefer that this be done at Zastava, Izmash, Molot or some other place that has experience with building these rifles. This is the main reason why the top 4 (above) are all built in foreign countries. The biggest drawback to an American made receiver is that it's built by people who have far less experience than the people at Zastava, Izmash or Molot. So they may take shortcuts with the parts assembly process and lo and behold, your Wasr is now a very expensive parts kit. Century Arms parts kits rifles are built by Century's subcontractors. We don't know who builds them or how much experience they have. So if you have a rifle that's built on an American receiver, it came in as a parts kit and then Century's subcontractor builds it into a rifle. You may get a great rifle and you may get a dud. This is why I always suggest getting a foreign made AK, one where the trunnion, stock and barrel assembly was done in the country of origin. Over the last 10 years, there have probably been more manufacturing flaws made by American AK builders than in the last 60 years in the USSR/Russia. Everything from canted sights (a result of a poor barrel/front trunnion assembly job) on the Wasr, to the single stack bolt on the first gen PAP, to the Waffen Werks AK74 having too tight of tolerances, and so on. But back to the M70... If you can get an M70 that was built in Yugoslavia and came in with the original receiver assembly, then get it. If it comes in as a parts kit and was built by century, then I cannot guarantee anything.

The above 4 are the best on the market. You won't go wrong with any of them. There are "better" AKs out there built by Krebs Custom, Red Jacket, and Rifle Dynamics. These are all great AK builders but I did not put them on the list because of their price. To tell you the truth, you won't get much more out of a Rifle Dynamics built AK that costs $2,000+ over an OPAP that's $500. They're both going to be roughly the same in terms of what they were designed to do.
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Full thread: http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=158411763&highlight=official+igmann+AK+buying+guide

Hope this helps
 
One of the worst buyers guides for AK's I've ever seen.
Soldier415 said:
AK/Commie gun collecter checking in. Below is from an AK buying guide for newbies. Great info and should help narrow things down for you. Just for the love of God don't get a tacticrap AK with a bunch of polymer stuff



Full thread: [/FONT][/COLOR]http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=158411763&highlight=official+igmann+AK+buying+guide

Hope this helps
Click to expand...
 
I agree. From what I understand, they are the most true to the originals for that reason. Whole factories had their equipment dismantled and shipped over to Egypt. Then they were set up and trained under Russian tutelage.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Soldier415 said:
Why do you say that?
Click to expand...

There are a lot of flaws in that guide and some info that isn't true.

My biggest gripe about the Yugo rifles is the butt stock. Not sure why but they're usually beefy and don't have the same feel as shooting a standard AK. Could be from Yugoslavia adding grenade launchers on they're rifles but from the 59/66 SKS to their AKs, the stocks are bulked up.

Factor in that, all the problems people have had with Century's work, and I'd pick a professionally converted Saiga for my first AK if I was looking.

If you want a good buyer's guide, use the search feature for some old posts from flintoid.
 
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Bought an N-Pap took it to the range put 2 mags through it and the next day was lucky enough to trade it for what I paid. The cheek slap was so bad I couldn't even shoot it on my shoulder. I love AKs but am now kicking myself for selling my arsenal. Stupid bills. Haha
 
Kisspik002 said:
Bought an N-Pap took it to the range put 2 mags through it and the next day was lucky enough to trade it for what I paid. The cheek slap was so bad I couldn't even shoot it on my shoulder. I love AKs but am now kicking myself for selling my arsenal. Stupid bills. Haha
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I have a few emails from people when I was looking for a a SAM7, I ordered 1 already but can send you his info. It's new never fired for 1150 in Mass...
 
That's not a bad price at all. I appreciate the heads up. Unfortunately I have some bills to cover first. Thanks again
 
For a unique AK variant with the worst finish ever put on a firearm there is the AMD-65. It is built on a Hungarian FEG receiver.
 
Buy an IZ-132 aka Saiga Sportster and a conversion kit from Carolina Shooters. Don't forget the bullet guide. In about 4 hours you can do the conversion. B&K runs group buys on the IZ all the time, watch for them. And Brian is a great guy.

Sent from the depths of Hell with TapaTalk V2
 
mikelawtown said:
how's the finish? I'm worried how long it will last as I hear from others that it scratches easy. I'm on the hunt for an SGL21 also. The SAM needs a Bitch
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The finish on SAM7 is beautiful, but as to it's durability I don't know. It goes from safe to range back to safe so it doesn't get beat on. One thing I did notice is the recoil impulse is a lot different from the SAM7 as opposed to my WASR, the SAM is much smoother and softer as opposed to the Romanian bitch slap the WASR gives. I just chalk it up to the SAM being better fitted and a bit heavier that the WASR.

The SAM7 is a nice rifle but it's definitely overpriced IMO, they have gone up quite a bit since I bought mine and even then I probably overpaid. You pay for that milled reciever lol..
 
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1903Collector said:
The finish on SAM7 is beautiful, but as to it's durability I don't know. It goes from safe to range back to safe so it doesn't get beat on. One thing I did notice is the recoil impulse is a lot different from the SAM7 as opposed to my WASR, the SAM is much smoother and softer as opposed to the Romanian bitch slap the WASR gives. I just chalk it up to the SAM being better fitted and a bit heavier that the WASR.

The SAM7 is a nice rifle but it's definitely overpriced IMO, they have gone up quite a bit since I bought mine and even then I probably overpaid. You pay for that milled reciever lol..
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I's being shipped to 1776 for the pin/weld. I paid 1100.00 New so I think I did ok. But still on the hunt for the SGL21 also. My price was 850.00 new for 1 but they can't get them new anymore. K-Var also told me that they don't carry anymore.
 
mikelawtown said:
I's being shipped to 1776 for the pin/weld. I paid 1100.00 New so I think I did ok. But still on the hunt for the SGL21 also. My price was 850.00 new for 1 but they can't get them new anymore. K-Var also told me that they don't carry anymore.
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Get it thru Atlantic? That's where I got mine from.
 
Finish on mine is very nice and has not scratched easily. It is more of a paint- not bluing or parkerizing.
 

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