The U.N. is coming for your guns - Update #402

Did they go door to door to collect them yesterday or the day before? I ask because I was out of town.

Should I box my guns up and send them somewhere? Anyone have an address?

Seriously, though, the UN is not going to collect firearms in the US by going door to door. It's just not gonna happen so all you warriors can stand down.

On the other hand I wouldn't be surprised to see them limit the import and export of firearms through treaty.
 
Fixxah said:
No, your knees are bad. It will be prone by drone. Bad knees blow.
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You're probably right, a drone will get me first. BUT I have a 1 WATT laser that I can belt carry that can take out the optics. Let them **** with that shit. Now if I could just find a plasma weapon in the 40 watt range that was legal in MA, I'd be all set. [wink]
 
Mr Weebles said:
On the other hand I wouldn't be surprised to see them limit the import and export of firearms through treaty.
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THAT I see in the near future. Very near future.

This a cautionary warning...

We have a lawless bunch in power and they know we are armed. What will they be like when we are unarmed?
 
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Mr Weebles said:
On the other hand I wouldn't be surprised to see them limit the import and export of firearms through treaty.
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we don't need the UN for that. We have the ATF doing that on whimsy already. Remember when gun parts kits were $120 in 2003? Well, GW Bush (who so many worship on here) decided that he was going to give a reach around to state side firearm manufacturers and, though written mandate, decided to "further enforce" legaleze by over enforcing language and defining cut junk parts as "machine guns."

Now you can't import parts kits with barrels. And Barry is more than happy to keep this trend going. So no, we don't need the UN to limit import and export. We already have an organization with clout in our country who will do that before any foreign force decides that they should do it or not.

The UN is irrelevant in our nation. This thread sucks.
 
Running UN joke while overseas: "All UN vehicles have a blast radius of 100 meters."

No one takes the UN seriously. Even countries that desperately need aid or protection generally don't take the UN seriously. Kosovo, a place that had a civil war and a genocide had both belligerents of that war attacking the UN years after it ended. The only group of people that the Serbians and Albanians seemed to hate more than the UN were the Roma.
 
exodious said:
Even governments that don't take the UN seriously are still willing to use it as a tool to further their own agendas.
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yeah, but who's going to enforce it? the police? the guard?

the army hates the UN. the police in a lot of areas wouldn't be interested or willing. this country has to many gun owners for a gun confiscation to happen quickly.


If they do take guns away, I suspect it will be through a wave of steep disqualifications, with crimes that have nothing to do with violence being a cause to have your guns take away. Similar to how a DUI results in a LTC loss in MA. It could be something like a moving violation being grounds for suitability. I could see that happening if the gun grabbers got enough traction and power.
 
Dench said:
If they do take guns away, I suspect it will be through a wave of steep disqualifications, with crimes that have nothing to do with violence being a cause to have your guns take away. Similar to how a DUI results in a LTC loss in MA. It could be something like a moving violation being grounds for suitability. I could see that happening if the gun grabbers got enough traction and power.
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Problem with that is very few states have MA style discretionary licensing for mere ownership. Heck, even in NY you don't need permission to own a long gun and can't be found "unsuitable" other than by being a federally prohibited person. I think the federal criteria for a prohibited person would have to change...which I suppose is certainly possible.
 
They (the news outlets and the NRA) been prattling about this ****ing treaty for like 5 years now. It's still in the same state it was back then. Lots of puffery, no traction, and no chance of being ratified in the US.

Meanwhile the feds are doing stuff like MRP forms that actually are damaging our rights.....

-Mike
 
Dench said:
yeah, but who's going to enforce it? the police? the guard?

the army hates the UN. the police in a lot of areas wouldn't be interested or willing. this country has to many gun owners for a gun confiscation to happen quickly.


If they do take guns away, I suspect it will be through a wave of steep disqualifications, with crimes that have nothing to do with violence being a cause to have your guns take away. Similar to how a DUI results in a LTC loss in MA. It could be something like a moving violation being grounds for suitability. I could see that happening if the gun grabbers got enough traction and power.
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Like I said before, the police and Guard have already shown they are more than willing to confiscate peoples firearms. People have too much blind faith in the military / police. In the end, they will do what they're told and you ARE the enemy. They'll just give gun owners who resist an evil name like "insurgent" or "domestic terrorist" and the sheeple will demand your head on a stick.
 
Tape Measure Pickle Wheel said:
Like I said before, the police and Guard have already shown they are more than willing to confiscate peoples firearms. People have too much blind faith in the military / police. In the end, they will do what they're told and you ARE the enemy. They'll just give gun owners who resist an evil name like "insurgent" or "domestic terrorist" and the sheeple will demand your head on a stick.
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On a small scale, you're absolutely right. There will be, as above described, a bunch of brainwashed 19yr old kids fresh out of training ready and eager to strip you of your rights. However, in very short order the resistance to these confiscations will make a great many of them reconsider. Once the guys in charge on a local level realize what's going on and refuse to issue their men an unlawful order, I suspect you'll see many good men on OUR side, rather than the wrong side.

In the interest of full disclosure, I've never had the honor of serving. However, I know plenty who have, and to a man every one of them that's old enough to shave every day would refuse to comply with a nationwide door to door confiscation.
 
Tape Measure Pickle Wheel said:
Like I said before, the police and Guard have already shown they are more than willing to confiscate peoples firearms. People have too much blind faith in the military / police. In the end, they will do what they're told and you ARE the enemy. They'll just give gun owners who resist an evil name like "insurgent" or "domestic terrorist" and the sheeple will demand your head on a stick.
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While I don't disagree with your position based on historic observations, I hope you realize that some of the people you say will be confiscating your guns are posting in this thread.
 
pernox said:
On a small scale, you're absolutely right. There will be, as above described, a bunch of brainwashed 19yr old kids fresh out of training ready and eager to strip you of your rights. However, in very short order the resistance to these confiscations will make a great many of them reconsider. Once the guys in charge on a local level realize what's going on and refuse to issue their men an unlawful order, I suspect you'll see many good men on OUR side, rather than the wrong side.

In the interest of full disclosure, I've never had the honor of serving. However, I know plenty who have, and to a man every one of them that's old enough to shave every day would refuse to comply with a nationwide door to door confiscation.
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But like the brainwashed 19 year olds, there are a lot more kinds of soldiers that will follow orders. There's the family man with 5 kids and a wife who cannot afford to be thrown in jail for insubordination. The cowards that are too fearful to stand up. The guys who just want power, etc). I hate to be the guy that brings up the Nazis, but do you think the Germans thought their troops would follow orders to round up and kill millions of people? Herd mentality is VERY powerful.

I'm sure back in '93-'94 there were people saying they'd go down in a hail of gunfire if Clinton tried to take their guns, and many Molon Labes were said... but in the end everyone complied, and watched all the fun stuff disappear from store shelves. Many people were probably thrilled, as their pre-ban ARs and magazines just doubled in value. What I'm getting at is people are quick to talk big, but when it comes to that moment, most people will fold.

ochmude said:
While I don't disagree with your position based on historic observations, I hope you realize that some of the people you say will be confiscating your guns are posting in this thread.
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Are we all so sensitive we cannot speak our minds? I'm being civil and saying what I believe based on facts.
 
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Tape Measure Pickle Wheel said:
Are we all so sensitive we cannot speak our minds? I'm being civil and saying what I believe based on facts.
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Umm, I'm being completely civil as well, aren't I?

EDIT: Maybe you're reading something into my post that isn't there. I'm just going off your join date, post count, and the fact that I don't recall you posting a whole lot and thinking that you might not "know", so to speak, many of the people who frequent this forum. I was literally just informing you that there are LEO's and service members, to include guardsmen, posting in this thread. You are still free to say whatever you want, I certainly am not taking offense. Really, what I was getting at, is that when you say "they'll take our guns", you are actually saying "you'll take our guns". I'm just trying to humanize the argument to make it more real. The "military" isn't a living thing and it can't take your guns. Real people, some of whom are posting in this thread, would be the one's to have to physically take your guns away. Instead of making this an "us" vs. "faceless evil entity" kind of situation, I think we'd be better served to make it an "us" vs. "people who really are a lot like us" kind of situation.
 
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Zepp said:
Stupid question I know we are a member nation of the UN, how soild is their pull(politically here). If the senator s shot this down could the UN enforce it with sanctions/troops :). Or is the UN just a bunch of folks we politely tolerate and help.
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Not only tolerate and help, but also harbor, in NYC.


Garys said:
OTOH, the US could decline to fund the UN, which would just about gut it's budget. ...
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NOW we're talking. Follow the money!



Zepp said:
... in the end everyone complied, and watched all the fun stuff disappear from store shelves. ... What I'm getting at is people are quick to talk big, but when it comes to that moment, most people will fold. ...
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Wouldn't you say that "moment" has already come and gone several times around, and continues?
 
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Tape Measure Pickle Wheel said:
Like I said before, the police and Guard have already shown they are more than willing to confiscate peoples firearms. People have too much blind faith in the military / police. In the end, they will do what they're told and you ARE the enemy. They'll just give gun owners who resist an evil name like "insurgent" or "domestic terrorist" and the sheeple will demand your head on a stick.
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If the mandate and law comes directly from the UN i suspect it wont happen. I think for the guard to do this on mass scale it would require action from the US federal .gov via a US passed law, not international.
 
Tape Measure Pickle Wheel said:
But like the brainwashed 19 year olds, there are a lot more kinds of soldiers that will follow orders. There's the family man with 5 kids and a wife who cannot afford to be thrown in jail for insubordination. The cowards that are too fearful to stand up. The guys who just want power, etc). I hate to be the guy that brings up the Nazis, but do you think the Germans thought their troops would follow orders to round up and kill millions of people? Herd mentality is VERY powerful.
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This is true.

However, Germany prior to Nazi rule was nothing like America prior to this hypothetical situation. There is a shooting culture here, and a culture of freedom, that may be unique in the world's history. Guns are part of who we are as a country. Guns are part of who we are as a culture. We may be (haven't looked it up - speculating based on reasonable assumptions) the only place in the world where civilian gun ownership dwarfs that of our military and police force. This is something that's in our blood, in our attitude, and in the hearts of more than enough people to make it a VASTLY different situation than a bedraggled, defeated country living under severe international sanction.

Outside of major metropolitan areas - within which I concede you would likely see compliance and many people handing over what guns they may have - the whole country is a gun country. Resistance of the people outside of big cities would be painful, long, and fruitless for any nation - even our own - stupid enough to necessitate it.

I'm sure back in '93-'94 there were people saying they'd go down in a hail of gunfire if Clinton tried to take their guns, and many Molon Labes were said... but in the end everyone complied, and watched all the fun stuff disappear from store shelves. Many people were probably thrilled, as their pre-ban ARs and magazines just doubled in value. What I'm getting at is people are quick to talk big, but when it comes to that moment, most people will fold. *snip*
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Store shelves and your safe are two different things.
 
ochmude said:
It was the "are we all so sensitive we cannot speak our minds" part that I was more responding to. I'm not sure how I conveyed that message to you from my post that you quoted, but I apologize for doing so. It was not my intention.
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Oh I said that because I thought your post was a warning of a shitstorm to come. My mistake. [laugh]

Dench said:
If the mandate and law comes directly from the UN i suspect it wont happen. I think for the guard to do this on mass scale it would require action from the US federal .gov via a US passed law, not international.
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I agree it would need to come from the US and not the UN. The US would have to issue the order to comply with the UN law.

pernox said:
This is true.

However, Germany prior to Nazi rule was nothing like America prior to this hypothetical situation. There is a shooting culture here, and a culture of freedom, that may be unique in the world's history. Guns are part of who we are as a country. Guns are part of who we are as a culture. We may be (haven't looked it up - speculating based on reasonable assumptions) the only place in the world where civilian gun ownership dwarfs that of our military and police force. This is something that's in our blood, in our attitude, and in the hearts of more than enough people to make it a VASTLY different situation than a bedraggled, defeated country living under severe international sanction.

Outside of major metropolitan areas - within which I concede you would likely see compliance and many people handing over what guns they may have - the whole country is a gun country. Resistance of the people outside of big cities would be painful, long, and fruitless for any nation - even our own - stupid enough to necessitate it.



Store shelves and your safe are two different things.
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Nazi Germany and the United States are very different, but I also didn't say they would do the same thing. German troops rounded up millions of people and killed them... is it so unbelievable that U.S. troops would willingly round up guns, an inanimate object? The average person (including troops) isn't a die-hard Constitutionalist like many people here. How many people do you know that can rattle off the entire Bill of Rights? I don't know many that could.


pernox said:
Store shelves and your safe are two different things.
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Exactly my point, and why I feel a total gun ban would go into effect with little issue. A law could go into effect that says no gun can have a capacity higher than 2 rounds, and most people would think "Damn, good thing I got my 17 rounders then". Just look around the forums for posts by Mass. residents. I can't enter a thread without seeing words like illegal, compliance, AWB, banned, etc. I've never heard of a militia group battling it out in Mass for their gun rights.

You don't have to ban the gun or gun ownership, just restrict everything related to firearms so tightly that owning one is nearly impossible. Ban the import, export, manufacture, and sale of all guns and gun accessories like pistol grips, "high capacity" magazines, barrel shrouds, collapsible stocks, etc. and it will most likely be ruled Constitutional. The Second Amendment doesn't say we have the right to manufacture guns...
 
exodious said:
It's implied, isn't it? How do you keep and bear something that you can't make?

I realize you're probably referring to how the DB's in power would like to interpret it...
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Common sense would say it is an implied right, but when have the antis ever shown an ounce of common sense? The second amendment is frustrating because almost every major law in the U.S. takes up hundreds of pages in order to close every tiny loophole, but the most important amendment (IMO) is a single sentence. If someone wanted to get rid of our gun rights, they only need to interpret it in a way that suits them... Kind of like the antis that say by "People" the founders meant a militia like the National Guard, and it doesn't apply to civilians. I'm honestly surprised that a huge tax on ammo or a ban on import/export and manufacture hasn't been attempted yet.

I almost with I could go back in time and urge Madison to spend more than 15 seconds writing this amendment.
 

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