the town of west boylston is unbelievable

[Coyote33]

Let's also keep in mind that our goal should be to have a civil and respectful discussion. ...

Meanwhile, their goal is to close down the range, no holds barred. How bad is this wanted?

 

[Darksideblues42]

Meanwhile, their goal is to close down the range, no holds barred. How bad is this wanted?

My point is that by being civil and having a meaningful and respectful dialog with everyone, we stand a better chance to get people who may be on the fence with regards to firearm ownership AND the lawful shooting of them to see us as the rational, reasonable, and respectful adults we are.

Resorting to emotional arguments, or seeking to intimidate or bully people to see things our way will not help with winning hearts and minds.

 

[noxin]

My point is that by being civil and having a meaningful and respectful dialog with everyone, we stand a better chance to get people who may be on the fence with regards to firearm ownership AND the lawful shooting of them to see us as the rational, reasonable, and respectful adults we are.

Resorting to emotional arguments, or seeking to intimidate or bully people to see things our way will not help with winning hearts and minds.

Yeah, because that's worked so well in the past

 

[namedpipes]

My point is that by being civil and having a meaningful and respectful dialog with everyone, we stand a better chance to get people who may be on the fence with regards to firearm ownership AND the lawful shooting of them to see us as the rational, reasonable, and respectful adults we are.

Resorting to emotional arguments, or seeking to intimidate or bully people to see things our way will not help with winning hearts and minds.

I don't think anyone here is (seriously) suggesting we call them names or post meme pics of them with Hitler mustaches drawn on.

But educating the town on what it will COST them if they continue to illegally harass Wayne is NOT intimidation or bullying. Actually it is a kindness. He may have just saved the town a couple hundred grand between the costs of defending themselves in a lawsuit and the inevitable settlement / judgement.

Playing nice has been demonstrated to be a losing strategy over and over and it is the reason you have your handgun hidden under your clothes and you avoid letting your co-workers and neighbors know you have icky, evil, black guns.

Wayne should stay strong, stern and unyielding. Polite about it, sure, but he should not give an INCH.

 

[swatgig]

Hello Everyone, Waynes granddaughter here. He wanted everyone to know thank you for the constant support! He wants everyone to know that we are having a barbecue to celebrate this long journey! Sunday May 29th from noon-till whenever! Bring your favorite dish of food and your own beer! It's going to be a great time !

Has Wayne retracted his "No Sunday Shooting" appeasement offer, since it did not appease the antis?

 

[drgrant]

My point is that by being civil and having a meaningful and respectful dialog with everyone, we stand a better chance to get people who may be on the fence with regards to firearm ownership AND the lawful shooting of them to see us as the rational, reasonable, and respectful adults we are.

Resorting to emotional arguments, or seeking to intimidate or bully people to see things our way will not help with winning hearts and minds.

This isn't some kind of broad spectrum political battle, its a fight against a small band of moonbats trying to shut down a guy's gun range. There is no such thing as a respectful dialogue with those people. That said, giving them too much attention is a bad thing.

 

[free]

Ignore and discount their reach and impact at your peril.

That said, of course.

 

[Amputee Marksman]

My point is that by being civil and having a meaningful and respectful dialog with everyone, we stand a better chance to get people who may be on the fence with regards to firearm ownership AND the lawful shooting of them to see us as the rational, reasonable, and respectful adults we are.

Resorting to emotional arguments, or seeking to intimidate or bully people to see things our way will not help with winning hearts and minds.

Never bring a knife to a gunfight.

It appears to me they are attempting to intimidate and bully Wayne who is only exercising his 2A rights so why in turn should they be afforded meaningful and respectful dialog when they refuse to offer the same.

 

[Darksideblues42]

Never bring a knife to a gunfight.

It appears to me they are attempting to intimidate and bully Wayne who is only exercising his 2A rights so why in turn should they be afforded meaningful and respectful dialog when they refuse to offer the same.

Flame me for it if you must, but I have had much more success using logic and measured reasoning in my debats with anti folks than letting their position get me emotionally charged and flipping the whole argument to arm waving, finger pointing, and raised voices.

We are all ambassadors of shooting sports and the Second Amendment. I firmly believe that more progress can be made changing minds by having conversations with people, rather than shouting matches.

 

[namedpipes]

Nobody is flaming you, just explaining in a polite and rational manner why your approach is wrong.

 

[Amputee Marksman]

Flame me for it if you must, but I have had much more success using logic and measured reasoning in my debats with anti folks than letting their position get me emotionally charged and flipping the whole argument to arm waving, finger pointing, and raised voices.

We are all ambassadors of shooting sports and the Second Amendment. I firmly believe that more progress can be made changing minds by having conversations with people, rather than shouting matches.

I am not flaming you. I am also not advocating to go postal, start screaming and insult them. A soon as you insult or call the other person names you have lost the debate. It is not easy for me to describe exactly what I mean but is somewhere between polite and cordial and raving lunatic.

I understand your comment on ambassador of the sport however also realize that it is damn near impossible to change the mind of a lot of people. You need to identify them and not waste your time and effort on them.

 

[Darksideblues42]

I am not flaming you. I am also not advocating to go postal, start screaming and insult them. A soon as you insult or call the other person names you have lost the debate. It is not easy for me to describe exactly what I mean but is somewhere between polite and cordial and raving lunatic.

I understand your comment on ambassador of the sport however also realize that it is damn near impossible to change the mind of a lot of people. You need to identify them and not waste your time and effort on them.

I agree on the waste of time, I am more concerned with the moderate folks who might be on the fence, the people who are the neighbors of the vocal few. Those folks who have only heard one side of the discussion, that we are brash, inconsiderate, and selfish people who don't care about our public image.

 

[falcon123]

Kelly,

Be careful. The CCWB might try to tie the BBQ to the gun shop, and claim he's running a restaurant too!

Paul

What kind of restaurant asks the guests to bring their own food and drink?

 

[local1445]

These people will not be deterred. They want to shut down the range no matter what the cost. I believe they have to sue the town to overturn the selectmen's ruling from the 21st meeting. In order to sue Wayne's they have to go thru the towns suit first, because the town found and ruled that Wayne's not, nor has ever been, in any violation of any law or town ordinance since 1943.
There is just no appeasing a group of libtards when they think they are right. We proved we are right and it absolutely drives them nuts!

 

[namedpipes]

These people will not be deterred. They want to shut down the range no matter what the cost. ...

"These people" are a handful of fruitcakes. The REST of the people in West Boylston either don't give a fig or don't care enough to see their tax rate go up due to blatantly unlawful acts by the town.

THAT population needs to know that their wallets are being jeopardized by the nuts behind this.

 

[Enzo]

Here is the video of last weeks ZBA meeting.
[video=youtube_share;JVV9Y76ES_U]http://youtu.be/JVV9Y76ES_U[/video]

 

[username1]

Here is the video of last weeks ZBA meeting.
[video=youtube_share;JVV9Y76ES_U]http://youtu.be/JVV9Y76ES_U[/video]

The hearing starts at ~19:30.

 

[Enzo]

Was that brutal to watch and listen to......
The motion was to uphold the building inspectors denial to add any restricts to the use of the property. Seems like these are usually voice votes but the ZBA member that sitting second on the right wants a roll call.
First member on the right who made the motion votes yes, second member no, third member briefly zones out at the zoning board then votes yes, fourth member yes, then the Chair now has to vote and the guy who voted no said, " you're the tie breaker" the vote is already 3 yes, 1 no.....LOL!!!
She votes yes and it's done.
So for now Wayne is good!

PS I noticed that comments are disabled for this video but if you look at all the other videos for the Town: Selectman, Planning Board, ZBA....comments are not disabled.

 

[WBspectrum]

For those interested

http://ccwestboylston.com/

 

[drgrant]

I agree on the waste of time, I am more concerned with the moderate folks who might be on the fence, the people who are the neighbors of the vocal few. Those folks who have only heard one side of the discussion, that we are brash, inconsiderate, and selfish people who don't care about our public image.

There's no need to armflap, etc and go full retard but also if you don't call a spade a spade, that's bad too. Like for example if someone finds out that one of these whiners moved next to wayne's property a couple years ago, why is it a bad thing to call him/her really stupid for doing so- This is fundamentally no different than the people that move next to a dairy farm that has been in place for 50 years and then they bitch to the town about the smell of the cow manure every spring. Wayne's has been around a long time. Something obviously changed in the past couple years, and I bet it's more than just "the volume of gunfire".

-Mike

 

[daddysuperfly]

I found this interesting.

http://ccwestboylston.com/frequently-asked-questions.html

Updated on Saturday, April 23, 2016



Qu 18 What is CCWB’s response to the Zoning Board of Appeals ruling on Thursday, April 21, 2016?

CCWB feels disturbed and saddened, disappointed and frustrated, betrayed and angry with the unhelpful decision rendered by the majority of ZBA members on Thursday evening April 21, 2016.

We encourage every concerned citizen of West Boylston to view for themselves the ZBA hearing, especially the last 45 minutes or so. This footage contains town counsel summarizing for the ZBA the complex bylaw zoning issues involved in this situation. It continues to display the conversations among ZBA members as they move toward announcing their individual decisions.

We leave it to each citizen to evaluate and judge how ZBA members considered the evidence and how each formulated his/her vote.

We have been pursuing for well over a year our goal of protecting our families, properties and home life from a public nuisance caused by excessive gunfire. This situation is and always has been focused on our town’s bylaws, i.e., what kind of activities are permissible in single family zoned districts.

We have lost all faith and hope in our town’s ability to protect us and its capacity to rectify a gross miscarriage of justice. Over the past year plus we have cooperatively followed all the directives of various town officials to resolve this issue. Unfortunately, this process has produced less clarity concerning single family zoning bylaws than there was when we began this process.

At this time CCWB has nothing more to say.

I also think the second board member from the left summed it up pretty well. It's a slippery slope and they'd have to almost get into the legislative space. Not something I'd want to do if I were on a ZBA.

Also interesting that they were the ones that kept pushing the board to make a decision.... Well they did.

I was also thinking about this over the weekend. Their lawyer was pretty quick to answer for his clients when asked about shooting hours. Said 8 hours was not reasonable and his clients wanted an hour or two, or something to that affect. Just kind of the opposite of what I saw from Waynes lawyer. The board asked a question to him, and he said he'd have to discuss it with Wayne..... Who was sitting right next to him. The ccwb lawyer was supposedly speaking for multiple people and didn't seem to check in with them at all. Just an observation.

 

[basso]

First member on the right who made the motion votes yes, second member no, third member briefly zones out at the zoning board then votes yes, fourth member yes, then the Chair now has to vote and the guy who voted no said, " you're the tie breaker" the vote is already 3 yes, 1 no.....LOL!!!
She votes yes and it's done.

Actually, the motion required a 4 vote majority to carry. 3-2 would have defeated the motion. The Chair's vote was huge.

 

[Enzo]

Actually, the motion required a 4 vote majority to carry. 3-2 would have defeated the motion. The Chair's vote was huge.

Ok, so not a simple majority. Thanks.
The other thing that was comical was on the voice vote the chair said "all those in favor" and the second member on the right and the Indian guy said they didn't vote but she never asked "those opposed" so how could they vote if they were opposed....what a circus.

 

[Darksideblues42]

Actually, the motion required a 4 vote majority to carry. 3-2 would have defeated the motion. The Chair's vote was huge.

I recall that they said 4 votes were needed to overrule the Inspector, not that 4 votes were needed to affirm the decision (and take no action)

 

[Trackrat]

So many people on a power trip there. Sad.

 

[modernhamlet]

disturbed and saddened, disappointed and frustrated, betrayed and angry

Those concerned citizens sure do have a lot of feels, don't they?

Here's a tissue, Francis...

 

[MachineHead]

Just watched this mess. I agree with the above people. The chairwoman sealed the deal at the end. I just don't understand how the complainants can reason their way out of this. I hope Wayne keeps his place open and passes it on to his relatives. Places like Wayne's need to stay and keep their grandfathered status.

 

[WBspectrum]

Just watched this mess. I agree with the above people. The chairwoman sealed the deal at the end. I just don't understand how the complainants can reason their way out of this. I hope Wayne keeps his place open and passes it on to his relatives. Places like Wayne's need to stay and keep their grandfathered status.

The Chairwoman had to vote in order to get the 4 votes to stop the appeal from overriding building inspector's cease and desist. It was fun to watch them go from "we want a vote now " to "we want an extension" after the one ZBA member said "if I were to vote now it would be to side with Wayne". They knew their fate was sealed.

 

[Coyote33]

"Alternate response":

One possible response to the Zoning Board of Appeals ruling on Thursday, April 21, 2016?

We feel relieved and overjoyed, satisfied and encouraged, affirmed and happy with the just decision rendered by the majority of ZBA members on Thursday evening April 21, 2016.

We encourage every concerned citizen of West Boylston to view for themselves the ZBA hearing, especially the last 45 minutes or so. This footage contains town counsel summarizing for the ZBA the complex bylaw zoning issues involved in this situation, and how it relates to state law. It continues to display the conversations among ZBA members as they move toward announcing their individual decisions.

We leave it to each citizen to evaluate and judge how ZBA members considered the evidence and how each formulated his/her vote.

We have been pursuing for well over a year our goal of protecting our families, properties and home life from a public nuisance caused by excessive infringement and intrusiveness into private matters. This situation is and always has been focused on our state laws.

We have regained faith and hope in our town’s and the Commonwealth's ability to protect our rights and its capacity to follow the right path. Over the past years, we have cooperatively followed all the onerous rules and laws, as well as proper safety protocols. Unfortunately, some people cannot seem to mind their own business..

At this time we have nothing more to say.

(feel free to use, and/or dissect, criticize, and pick apart)

 

[Kellysamia23]

Hey everyone I don't know if many of you heard, but the fight isn't over. They are now bringing Wayne and all the ZBA members to superior court. We are now looking for ways to help them out with there lawyer fees. Please if you have any ideas let me know. VIA Facebook. Kelly Mary Samia. Thank you.