Springfield Armory and the milsurp bug

theGringo

theGringo

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I took my son and a friend of his to the Springfield Armory Museum today. My boy, just turned 13, has been eyeballing milsurp rifles lately ... like every time we go into a gun store. The museum really piqued his interest. We spent an hour and a half there.

He wants to save his money for a rifle, and milsurp collecting is not an area I'm knowledgeable in. Is there any recommendation that can be made for a kid starting out in shooting, and maybe collecting?

I wouldn't mind if this became a lifelong interest for him, and I'd like him to have something he can learn from and which will continue to bring him pleasure through the years.
 
Tough one to put your arms around, G.

If money was not an issue, I'd start him off with a nice M-1 Carbine. Genuine piece of history, nice little shooter with minimal recoil, and a real collector. But the damn things start at about $450 for a "crappy" one. Might take him a while to save up that kind of coin, and meanwhile he's going to be wishing for something else.

With a C&R license you can still pick up a few goodies at low cost. Mosin Nagant rifles are still going for about $69 each (plus shipping), and the Russian 1895 Nagant pistols are at about $79. In general, anything US-built is going to be higher in price than a foreign equivalent.

I guess you need to find out what he'd really like, and talk about a plan to get there.
 
USMA-82 said:
Tough one to put your arms around, G.

If money was not an issue, I'd start him off with a nice M-1 Carbine. Genuine piece of history, nice little shooter with minimal recoil, and a real collector. But the damn things start at about $450 for a "crappy" one. Might take him a while to save up that kind of coin, and meanwhile he's going to be wishing for something else.

With a C&R license you can still pick up a few goodies at low cost. Mosin Nagant rifles are still going for about $69 each (plus shipping), and the Russian 1895 Nagant pistols are at about $79. In general, anything US-built is going to be higher in price than a foreign equivalent.

I guess you need to find out what he'd really like, and talk about a plan to get there.
Click to expand...

I'd love to have another M-1 in the family, but that is cost prohibitive. We spent a bit of time at the Armory looking at the various M-1s there, and I told him abouth the guy who installed our phone lines when we moved out here ... his name was Garand, a great-nephew of John C. Garand.

I don't have a C&R and, frankly, I just don't need the federal involvement in my life right now.

I might head up to Pete's in Adams next weekend and poke around in the racks ... see what catches his eye.
 
depending on your boys stature a 91/30 mosin nagant with a slip on limbsaver recoil pad would be good. they go for $70-$120, You local gun shop should have a few. then you have the Lee-Enfield in 303 Brit. the 303 Brit is a nice round that gives more of a push than a hard kick so that may be good for your boy also. you can get a crappy enfield with a decent bore for around $150-$200.
 
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Man, order a CMP garand and ammo now, when it comes in about 4 months he will love it? Not sure where you are located. But There is a new small shop in middleboro. He had some milsurp stuff.
 
Go for a CMP carbine first, then a Garand. I'm sure he can handle the Garand at 13, but the carbine is much more pleasant, and right now it's also cheaper to shoot.
 
There are a few directions you can go in choosing his first rifle. One thing to remember is you want one that will be comfortable for him to shoot so he'll enjoy it. Is he a big kid? Can he handle shooting a nine pound rifle? Most bolt actions are heavy and pack a good amount of recoil but they are often affordable. Semi autos on the other hand like an SKS or an M1 carbine are lighter but can get pricey.

At around $100 a Mosin Nagant 91/30 is the cheapest rifle available right now but may not be the best for a beginner due to some being finicky when it comes to a smooth cycling bolt. Mosin "sticky bolt syndrome" is a condition some Mosin rifles have where the shooter will sometimes have to whack the bolt with the palm of the hand to open the bolt because it starts to stick after a few rounds.

Everybody has their own idea on why some Mosins have a sticky bolt problem. Ammo casing differences like steel, bi-metal, brass, laquer coated casings, etc. defects in the rifle such as dirt/grease in the chamber or a burr from poor machining, headspace thats slightly out of spec, the list goes on.
I'm not saying you'll get a Mosin with this issue, just saying its a possibility and could easily turn a young shooter off.

Other options for bolt actions are Enfields and Mauser type rifles like Yugo M48s, 24/47s, and Russian capture K98s. Mauser actions are the smoothest out of all the affordable milsurp rifles and are easy to shoot. Both Enfields and most Mauser types will average around $200 to $300 depending on the model and condition of the rifle. Ammo for both is still available in surplus and modern production but 303 British for the Enfield can be a little hard to find and pricey sometimes.

Of course after reading these posts you can guess people are going to recomend what they like to shoot and of course I'm going to tell you to get an SKS.[smile]

Norinco models are at every gun show for under $250 but they are going up and so is 7.62x39 ammo so if you are thinking on getting one, get it soon and buy ammo in bulk like a sleeve or better yet a case. You'll spend money but the savings will be worth it and its not like you'll never use it, trust me.
 
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theGringo said:
I took my son and a friend of his to the Springfield Armory Museum today. My boy, just turned 13, has been eyeballing milsurp rifles lately ... like every time we go into a gun store. The museum really piqued his interest. We spent an hour and a half there.

He wants to save his money for a rifle, and milsurp collecting is not an area I'm knowledgeable in. Is there any recommendation that can be made for a kid starting out in shooting, and maybe collecting?

I wouldn't mind if this became a lifelong interest for him, and I'd like him to have something he can learn from and which will continue to bring him pleasure through the years.
Click to expand...

http://www.thecmp.org/22targetsurplus.htm
 
theGringo said:
I'd love to have another M-1 in the family, but that is cost prohibitive. We spent a bit of time at the Armory looking at the various M-1s there, and I told him abouth the guy who installed our phone lines when we moved out here ... his name was Garand, a great-nephew of John C. Garand.

I don't have a C&R and, frankly, I just don't need the federal involvement in my life right now.

I might head up to Pete's in Adams next weekend and poke around in the racks ... see what catches his eye.
Click to expand...

Pat's in Cheshire(Lanesboro?) had a few milsurps last time I was there, and says he gets a pretty steady flow.
 
'03 Springfield or '03-A3. The recoil is a little harsh but I would think by the time he's at that point he would already have some experience shooting some of Dad's rifles. One in decent shape will be much cheaper than a similar-condition Garand...and a little cheaper than a similar-condition Carbine. Ammo is relatively cheap and easy to find. Very easy rifle to care for and become "intimate" with. However if recoil is going to be an issue, then the carbine sounds like a good choice. Like others have said though, one that is in good condition mechanically and visibly, is going to be rather expensive. A coworker lucked out big time with his carbine from the CMP. It almost looked like it belonged in a museum after a little light cleaning up. His story is far from the norm though.
 
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Well, the boy and me did some window shopping while out and about today, and two items caught my son's interest. One was a Russian Mosin Nagant (maybe it was the bayonet) and the other ... A JC Higgins single-shot .22.

His interests may be a bit too diverse to make this search an easy one. [rolleyes]

I also saw a Walther PPS hanging on the wall and wondered aloud what it would feel like in the hand. The young lady behind the counter was happy enough to show me the pistol, but couldn't figure out how to drop the magazine out. My little guy spied the mag release from several feet away and helped her out. Precocious child.
 
theGringo said:
Well, the boy and me did some window shopping while out and about today, and two items caught my son's interest. One was a Russian Mosin Nagant (maybe it was the bayonet) and the other ... A JC Higgins single-shot .22.

His interests may be a bit too diverse to make this search an easy one. [rolleyes]

I also saw a Walther PPS hanging on the wall and wondered aloud what it would feel like in the hand. The young lady behind the counter was happy enough to show me the pistol, but couldn't figure out how to drop the magazine out. My little guy spied the mag release from several feet away and helped her out. Precocious child.
Click to expand...

I know exactly where you were...[wink]

How did you like the PPS?
 
MassMark said:
Yeah - I didn't like it either - just felt odd to me. Did you see the sweet pre-ban Colt AR? I think it sold, but it was a safe queen that is just dying for a mag dump...
Click to expand...

The girl said it sold. I think she said they put it online and it was gone in a flash.

I walked into Dave's, too. A guy pulled their only AR off the rack, had a short (3 minute) discussion about it, and plunked down the cash. I didn't even have a chance to look at it. [crying]

I wish I had some money.
 
I started into milsurps at 13 myself, now at 14 I have somewhere over 15 milsurps plus my regular guns. My first milsurp was a DDR marked m44 and I still love it.
 

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