Sig DAK "Law Enforcement ONLY" gun!

[hillman]

Before you ask, yes I used the Search function and found several different conflicting answers.

I have a Sig 226 DAK listed for trade here and on Armslist. I own two of these now, am keeping one and trading off the other. A fellow who saw my ad on Armslist seemed interested until he heard from Four Seasons that that was a "Law enforcement only" gun.

I said "Huh?" It's on the AG list...

Apparently that OTHER list makes it a LEO only gun according to Four Seasons. This is from their web page:

A question that we get regularly: ARE SIG DAK PISTOLS LEGAL TO SELL IN MA? They are on the APPROVED ROSTER LIST.

Answer: No, they are not legal to sell in MA. We have 2 sets of rules that we must follow. The state LAWS (see Approved Roster List) and the state REGULATIONS. Under the state laws the DAK is legal. However, the state's consumer protection regulations require that a double action handgun have a trigger pull of at least 10 lbs. in double action mode. The DAK's trigger pull is 6.5 lbs.

So does this mean that FFLs won't or aren't supposed to transfer them? Because two different local dealers have now transferred these to me with no issues...

Obviously I understand that this isn't on the owner of the firearm but on the dealer, and their house, their rules. I'm just trying to figure out if I'm going to have a hard time transferring this to another person or if I should just wait until January so I can do a personal transfer...or wait, will that not work then either because of the new law?

Thanks.

 

[Another_David]

So does this mean that FFLs won't or aren't supposed to transfer them?

Yes.

click on SPECIFICATIONS and scroll down to COMPLIANT https://www.sigsauer.com/CatalogProductDetails/p226-dak.aspx

The list goes by model number, so if it's a Model 226 DAK, then it's not on both lists but if you take a regular model 226, which is on the list, and install the DAK trigger (I'm assuming you can do this, haven't researched it myself), then the FFL could transfer it.

I forget the details, but I think one of the lists has a minimum trigger pull weight requirement and I suspect the DAK might fail that.

 

[hillman]

Yes.

click on SPECIFICATIONS and scroll down to COMPLIANT https://www.sigsauer.com/CatalogProductDetails/p226-dak.aspx

The list goes by model number, so if it's a Model 226 DAK, then it's not on both lists but if you take a regular model 226, which is on the list, and install the DAK trigger (I'm assuming you can do this, haven't researched it myself), then the FFL could transfer it.

I forget the details, but I think one of the lists has a minimum trigger pull weight requirement and I suspect the DAK might fail that.

Of course. Makes perfect sense. Thank you. I'll just hang on to it until January, then.

 

[M1911]

The DAK doesn't meet the AG's consumer protection regulations. The issue is the trigger pull being less than 10 lbs. Specifically, it violates 940 CMR 16.05 (2):

It shall be an unfair or deceptive practice for a handgun-purveyor to transfer or offer to transfer to any customer located within the Commonwealth any handgun which does not contain a mechanism which effectively precludes an average five year old child from operating the handgun when it is ready to fire; such mechanisms shall include, but are not limited to: raising trigger resistance to at least a ten pound pull, altering the firing mechanism so that an average five year old child's hands are too small to operate the handgun, or requiring a series of multiple motions in order to fire the handgun.

If it had manual safety or a trigger pull greater than 10 lbs it would be OK. Full text of the regulations here: http://www.mass.gov/ago/docs/regulations/940-cmr-16-00.pdf

Note that the consumer protection regulations govern only what a dealer can sell, not what you can sell in a private sale or what you can purchase or what you can possess.

 

[Win]

The last time I was up at Sig one of the instructors was telling me that the DAK trigger was made for police because they tend to pop off too many round in the traditional DA/SA mode. Therefore, sig made the DAK trigger to make it harder to keep popping off rounds with a light trigger pull. The heavier trigger pull after the initial shot is intended to make the officer think harder about whether the additional shots are necessary. True story.

 

[Mike-Mike]

Many times when a dealer advertizes "LE Only" there is often a "discount deal" and the gun usually comes with 3 Standard capacity mags.

 

[MALDENQB02]

Listen, if you own the gun legally in MA, you can sell it in a private sale no matter what it is... unless it has super killy features like a collapsable butstock or bayonet lug or whatever. thats why a glock can be sold privatly and not through an FFL.

 

[EJFudd]

So does this mean that FFLs won't or aren't supposed to transfer them? Because two different local dealers have now transferred these to me with no issues...

Why not simply go back to one of the dealers who was willing to transfer it before?

I'm just trying to figure out if I'm going to have a hard time transferring this to another person or if I should just wait until January so I can do a personal transfer...or wait, will that not work then either because of the new law?

The new law shouldn't be a problem. In January, you will have another four FTF transfers allowed just like in past years.

 

[MALDENQB02]

that whole 4 personal transfer thing is BS. I "know people" who have done at least twice that every year for the past three years. no issues.

 

[Another_David]

The last time I was up at Sig one of the instructors was telling me that the DAK trigger was made for police because they tend to pop off too many round in the traditional DA/SA mode. Therefore, sig made the DAK trigger to make it harder to keep popping off rounds with a light trigger pull. The heavier trigger pull after the initial shot is intended to make the officer think harder about whether the additional shots are necessary. True story.

Meh. That's one theory. And there have been many LE agencies that keep buying heavier trigger pulls, like NYC.

But the Sig DAK was more a result of LE buying auto loaders with one trigger pull weight for all shots and not DA/SA heavy/light pulls. This started with the prevalence of Glock systems--at least for autoloaders. Revolvers worked like this for years. Glock and DAK systems are just simpler systems too: no safety to turn on/off plus no decocker to decock. Less to remember and do after a shooting.

 

[M1911]

And there have been many LE agencies that keep buying heavier trigger pulls, like NYC.

It is cheaper than actually training their officers...

 

[Another_David]

It is cheaper than actually training their officers...

that it is. and I doubt these same agencies are splurging for Sigs

there's nothing wrong with sig DAK though, or Glocks, they're great systems

 

[hillman]

that it is. and I doubt these same agencies are splurging for Sigs

there's nothing wrong with sig DAK though, or Glocks, they're great systems

I absolutely love mine, I now carry it every day. I just don't need two.

 

[Cmaro21]

that whole 4 personal transfer thing is BS. I "know people" who have done at least twice that every year for the past three years. no issues.

I'm not saying I do or do not condone this as all of our GL is pretty much a cluster F, but listing it as advice might not be the best idea.

 

[AngelKing]

ha and I was just eyeing that DAK yesterday!

 

[IvIax]

that whole 4 personal transfer thing is BS. I "know people" who have done at least twice that every year for the past three years. no issues.

If they find out, it's a felony. Will u take the chance to avoid $40 FFL payment?

 

[AngelKing]

This. Don't be that guy. Bullshit or not, all it takes if for some zealous ADA or DA to do an "audit" - they won't bust the balls of the CHRB, they'll bust the idiots who did the extra transfers, put them on the news and claim another victory for their side.

Don't give the bastards the win. Pay the fee, live to fight another day.

If they find out, it's a felony. Will u take the chance to avoid $40 FFL payment?

 

[MALDENQB02]

This. Don't be that guy. Bullshit or not, all it takes if for some zealous ADA or DA to do an "audit" - they won't bust the balls of the CHRB, they'll bust the idiots who did the extra transfers, put them on the news and claim another victory for their side.

Don't give the bastards the win. Pay the fee, live to fight another day.

I dont do it. I just know people who do. I like to keep my hands clean.

 

[hillman]

I will keep it listed for trade. Thanks everyone for the info.

 

[pdm]

You can convert a DA/SA Sig to DAK with some parts.