Shipping Handgun to Myself (VA to MA)

[ruro15]

Hey Everyone, my apologies if this is a dupe but I couldn't find anything through the search function.

Heres the skinny.

Im stationed temporarily down in VA and was looking to buy a revolver down here. VA recently started accepting all other states concealed carry permits. I sailed down here on the ship and we don't have enough room in my armory to sail back with a new purchase. I was wondering what the best way to get this thing back to my safe would be. My father (lives in MA) has an LTC. It'd be nice to ship to him and have someone home on the receiving end, but I'm worried that could be viewed as a transfer.

Really appreciate the help,
Rich

 

[teaser452]

well, since it's been 60 minutes since your post, I'll answer.

I am fairly certain you cannot buy handguns in a state you do not reside in. But it also seems like you're in the service, so maybe you get different rules.

Shipping handguns has to be done through fedex or UPS and i am pretty damn sure it has to be overnight shipping.

Someone else will be along to say I'm right or wrong soon.

 

[CaseHardened]

Read This:

http://www.northeastshooters.com/vb...o-for-Dummies-2016?highlight=shipping+dummies

In this thread I make no attempt whatsoever as to who can own what.

Assuming the shipment is legal, it explains how to do it economically - while following Federal ATF Laws.

---

And I do not know if you can ship any firearm to yourself.

Except if it were a C&R Firearm, and you are a C&R FFL-03, I would expect shipping it to your C&R Address from anywhere would be legal.

 

[CaseHardened]

I am fairly certain you cannot buy handguns in a state you do not reside in.

Is not the burden on the Seller in that other State to confirm you are a legal resident there ? As long as the Buyer was honest about the situation.

I believe if you purchased a Firearm in another State, as a resident there, and move to MA, you can legally bring it along, even if it is a Handgun not on the Handgun Roster.

(obviously if the move is through NY or NJ there may be problems).

Also, Mass "Assault Weapon" and "Magazine Capacity" restrictions would make the mere possession of many guns illegal. But as the O/P stated it is a Revolver, in this case those would not apply.

---

It just may be cheaper, and a lot less risky, just to have an FFL-01 in Mass to receive it and transfer it to you.

And maybe cheaper yet for an Out-Of-State FFL-01 to ship it, too, as they are allowed to use Priority Mail.

---

Does the O/P need to EFA-10 it online ?

 

[CaseHardened]

Hey Everyone, my apologies if this is a dupe but I couldn't find anything through the search function.

Heres the skinny.

Im stationed temporarily down in VA and was looking to buy a revolver down here. VA recently started accepting all other states concealed carry permits. I sailed down here on the ship and we don't have enough room in my armory to sail back with a new purchase. I was wondering what the best way to get this thing back to my safe would be. My father (lives in MA) has an LTC. It'd be nice to ship to him and have someone home on the receiving end, but I'm worried that could be viewed as a transfer.

Really appreciate the help,
Rich

If you've not purchased the Revolver yet, don't.

Just buy one here in Mass and save yourself a lot of trouble and expense.

Most of the best ones will be on the Roster.

Taurus won't be !

 

[browncoat]

Hey Everyone, my apologies if this is a dupe but I couldn't find anything through the search function.

Heres the skinny.

Im stationed temporarily down in VA and was looking to buy a revolver down here. VA recently started accepting all other states concealed carry permits. I sailed down here on the ship and we don't have enough room in my armory to sail back with a new purchase. I was wondering what the best way to get this thing back to my safe would be. My father (lives in MA) has an LTC. It'd be nice to ship to him and have someone home on the receiving end, but I'm worried that could be viewed as a transfer.

Really appreciate the help,
Rich

If your temporary stationing counts as residency, and you can legally buy the pistol, then you can legally ship the pistol to yourself.

You cannot ship it through USPS (since it is a handgun), so you must use a different carrier. The box should be labelled with your name, care of your father. Your father should not open the box until you come home to claim it. To be on the safe side, ship it back boxed in a locked case so that it isn't violating the MA safe storage laws.

 

[dcmdon]

I am seconding what Browncoat wrote.

Your purchase was legal since you are stationed there. (Read the instructions for questions 2 and 20 on ATF form 4473. Hint - google it)

You can legally ship a gun to yourself interstate. Period.


Don


From ATF FAQ:

https://www.atf.gov/resource-center/docs/0501-firearms-top-10-qaspdf/download

May I lawfully ship a firearm to myself in a different State?

Any person may ship a firearm to himself or herself in the care of another person in the State where
he or she intends to hunt or engage in any other lawful activity. The package should be addressed to
the owner “in the care of” the out-of-State resident. Upon reaching its destination, persons other than
the owner must not open the package or take possession of the firearm.

 

[Svt Shelby]

I have a friend that shipped a firearm to his new home state from his old home state he moved from . I'm not 100% sure but if you are the legal owner of the gun you can ups or fedex it to yourself at your new address . The same way you can ship to and from the manufacturer without a FFl

 

[Len-2A Training]

Hey Everyone, my apologies if this is a dupe but I couldn't find anything through the search function.

Heres the skinny.

Im stationed temporarily down in VA and was looking to buy a revolver down here. VA recently started accepting all other states concealed carry permits. I sailed down here on the ship and we don't have enough room in my armory to sail back with a new purchase. I was wondering what the best way to get this thing back to my safe would be. My father (lives in MA) has an LTC. It'd be nice to ship to him and have someone home on the receiving end, but I'm worried that could be viewed as a transfer.

Really appreciate the help,
Rich

Rich,

Thanks for your service. I'll assume you are Newport News. What I bolded could be a problem. Fed Law says that you can buy a handgun in the state where you have PERMANENT DUTY ORDERS. I'm unsure if sailing into NN for a brief stop-over/repair would qualify.

Fed Law also mandates that you can only ship to yourself, not to your Father . . . although he can accept the package, NOT open it and lock the package up until you return home. You can only ship via UPS or FedEx Air (2 day air should work and costs $40-50 typically). You can NOT legally ship via the USPO.

HOWEVER, FedEx and UPS both changed their rules (not a law) such that they will NOT accept guns for shipment unless it is going to/from an FFL (C&R FFL would solve this problem if you had one). Fed Law also mandates that you must declare that you are shipping a gun, so you can't legally sneak one by them.

A dealer can ship via USPO Priority Mail for ~$15.00 including insurance, so if the gun is on the EOPS List and AG Regs compliant, you could arrange for a MA Dealer (ask first) to accept it and transfer it to you when you return.

Of course everything assumes that you also have a MA LTC.

 

[CaseHardened]

The O/P said "Im stationed temporarily down in VA and was looking to buy a revolver down here."

I probably am missing something, but why not just wait until he returns to MA ?

If he just MUST buy, buy something on the Roster:

http://www.mass.gov/eopss/firearms-reg-and-laws/frb/approved-rosters/

- - - Updated - - -

Rich,

Thanks for your service. I'll assume you are Newport News. What I bolded could be a problem. Fed Law says that you can buy a handgun in the state where you have PERMANENT DUTY ORDERS. I'm unsure if sailing into NN for a brief stop-over/repair would qualify.

Fed Law also mandates that you can only ship to yourself, not to your Father . . . although he can accept the package, NOT open it and lock the package up until you return home. You can only ship via UPS or FedEx Air (2 day air should work and costs $40-50 typically). You can NOT legally ship via the USPO.

HOWEVER, FedEx and UPS both changed their rules (not a law) such that they will NOT accept guns for shipment unless it is going to/from an FFL (C&R FFL would solve this problem if you had one). Fed Law also mandates that you must declare that you are shipping a gun, so you can't legally sneak one by them.

A dealer can ship via USPO Priority Mail for ~$15.00 including insurance, so if the gun is on the EOPS List and AG Regs compliant, you could arrange for a MA Dealer (ask first) to accept it and transfer it to you when you return.

Of course everything assumes that you also have a MA LTC.

Len, I thought only HANDGUNS had to be on the Roster.

Am I wrong ?

 

[CaseHardened]

HOWEVER, FedEx and UPS both changed their rules (not a law) such that they will NOT accept guns for shipment unless it is going to/from an FFL (C&R FFL would solve this problem if you had one). Fed Law also mandates that you must declare that you are shipping a gun, so you can't legally sneak one by them.

When did they do this ?

Is it now illegal for a gun owner to ship a defective firearm back to the manufacturer ?

 

[Len-2A Training]

Len, I thought only HANDGUNS had to be on the Roster.

Am I wrong ?

Handguns include revolvers and semi-autos. AG Regs and EOPS List applies to both categories of "short guns".

When did they do this ?

Is it now illegal for a gun owner to ship a defective firearm back to the manufacturer ?

It was a few years ago, I was clued in on it by my BATFE contact down in DC. Given my source and the fact that both changed their tariffs (rules) on this within 10 days of each other, I think it was due to BATFE pressure.

No, all shipments via UPS/FedEx must go to or from an FFL. Guess what? Mfrs, Dealers and Gunsmiths are all required to hold an FFL . . . ergo nothing changed here.

 

[Svt Shelby]

When did they do this ?

Is it now illegal for a gun owner to ship a defective firearm back to the manufacturer ?

Unless the law changed in the last month and it could have . I shipped a handgun to the manufacturer last month using Fedex and they shipped it back and all was fine .

 

[CaseHardened]

Unless the law changed in the last month and it could have . I shipped a handgun to the manufacturer last month using Fedex and they shipped it back and all was fine .

To clarify Len-2A Training, I think he means either the Shipper OR the Recipient must be an FFL.

Right Len ?

And if the Recipient is not an FFL, it must be the Owner ? As when a Manufacturer or Gunsmith ships a gun back to the Owner ?

- - - Updated - - -

Handguns include revolvers and semi-autos. AG Regs and EOPS List applies to both categories of "short guns".




It was a few years ago, I was clued in on it by my BATFE contact down in DC. Given my source and the fact that both changed their tariffs (rules) on this within 10 days of each other, I think it was due to BATFE pressure.

No, all shipments via UPS/FedEx must go to or from an FFL. Guess what? Mfrs, Dealers and Gunsmiths are all required to hold an FFL . . . ergo nothing changed here.

There is no Mass Roster for Long Guns ?

 

[Len-2A Training]

To clarify Len-2A Training, I think he means either the Shipper OR the Recipient must be an FFL.

Right Len ?

And if the Recipient is not an FFL, it must be the Owner ? As when a Manufacturer or Gunsmith ships a gun back to the Owner ?

- - - Updated - - -



There is no Mass Roster for Long Guns ?

Yes, EITHER the shipper or receiver must possess a FFL to satisfy UPS/FedEx rules.

Correct, no roster of approved long guns. Title of this thread is "shipping handgun to myself" thus no discussion from me wrt long guns (other than UPS/FedEx requires one FFL in every shipping situation).

 

[dcmdon]

I have a friend that shipped a firearm to his new home state from his old home state he moved from . I'm not 100% sure but if you are the legal owner of the gun you can ups or fedex it to yourself at your new address . The same way you can ship to and from the manufacturer without a FFl

You can ship a long gun through the post office.

 

[dcmdon]

**EDIT, my statement below is incorrect. I found the law. *****


Len - I'm going to cautiously question your comment that you are legally bound to tell FedEx or UPS that you are shipping a gun. I understand that failing to do so would be against their Conditions of Carriage and any insurance you buy may be worthless, but I have never found anything that says its a legal requirement.

Citation?

Don

18 USC Sec. 922 01/05/2009
EXPCITE
TITLE 18 - CRIMES AND CRIMINAL PROCEDURE
PART I - CRIMES
CHAPTER 44 - FIREARMS
HEAD
Sec. 922. Unlawful acts

“(e) It shall be unlawful for any person knowingly to deliver or
cause to be delivered to any common or contract carrier for
transportation or shipment in interstate or foreign commerce, to
persons other than licensed importers, licensed manufacturers,
licensed dealers, or licensed collectors, any package or other
container in which there is any firearm or ammunition without
written notice to the carrier that such firearm or ammunition is
being transported or shipped;”“2) It shall be unlawful for any common or contract carrier to
deliver in interstate or foreign commerce any firearm without
obtaining written acknowledgment of receipt from the recipient of
the package or other container in which there is a firearm.”

 

[dcmdon]

So we have a classic catch 22.

With an easy solution. When I started writing this thread I figured it was only dealers and manufacturers. But the policy allows "Licensed Collectors".

So this is yet another reason to get your 03, Curio and Relic FFL.


See link: http://www.nraba.org/graphics/Benefits/RevisedServiceMatrix(2).pdf


Here is the "Licensed Collector" language on the FedEx web page.

http://www.fedex.com/us/freight/rulestariff/prohibited_articles.html

 

[dcmdon]

Or just get a real FFL and ship handguns priority mail flat rate box for $7 to $15.

 

[Svt Shelby]

This is on the atf.gov website

6. May I lawfully ship a firearm to myself in a different State?
Any person may ship a firearm to himself or herself in the care of another person in the State where he or she intends to hunt or engage in any other lawful activity. The package should be addressed to the owner “in the care of” the out-of-State resident. Upon reaching its destination, persons other than the owner must not open the package or take possession of the firearm.

 

[dcmdon]

This is on the atf.gov website

6. May I lawfully ship a firearm to myself in a different State?
Any person may ship a firearm to himself or herself in the care of another person in the State where he or she intends to hunt or engage in any other lawful activity. The package should be addressed to the owner “in the care of” the out-of-State resident. Upon reaching its destination, persons other than the owner must not open the package or take possession of the firearm.

That is what I meant by a catch 22. The law allows you to ship a gun to yourself.

But the law also requires you to tell any common carrier (UPS/Fedex) that you are shipping a gun.

If you tell them you are shipping a gun to yourself, they will refuse the shipment.

Get it?

Of course this really only applies to handguns because you can ship a long gun at a post office.

Don