Manchester Firing Line

[40 caliber]

OK so I was shooting at MFL today with my 15 year old. Jim has an easel out front that says new membership pricing.
1. new members annual fee $190 (was $175 I think)
2. member renewals fee $165 (was $135)

Member pricing
Lane fees $9 an hour, ( was $8)
Guest fees $9 an hour. (first guest was free)

This is the part that has me grumbling. It cost me $18 to shoot with my 15 year old son for an hour. (Not counting my own bullets targets etc...). He's 15. it’s not like he has a job and is going to split it with me. I would not have a problem with 2 adults but a father and son (minor)?

I have no issue with Jim. I like him a lot. He is honest and has built a multi-million dollar state of the art facility and people are standing in line to get memberships. He has added range officers that make the place safer. It is his business and I have no qualms with him raising his prices at all. At this point, however, I have to ask my self If I am willing to pay this or if its time to join a gun club and let this membership lapse.

I always figured the $150 annual fee and $8 an hour for me and my son beat any local gun club politics and volunteerism. I pay my money, I come in and I leave when I’m done. I have spent close to $1700 this year alone in unplanned gun purchases at MFL. Those sales were because I was there shooting, not that I went there to buy something.

Once again, nothing against Jim or MFL. it is a great place and I am sure he has his own expenses for such a place. But, since I go 3-4 times a month and my son comes half the time, this new $60 to $80 month cost plus the annual fee probably means I need to find another shooting spot.

 

[M1911]

Breaking news: gun clubs are almost always greatly cheaper than for-profit ranges. Details on our 11 PM newscast.

 

[Bigtuna]

Well..not liking the guest fee change on top of a renewal hike. I bought a membership because I bring a guest to shoot with, so now my fees more than double? Not happy if true. I'll also be thinking about which club to join.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

The most relevant question would be "are the prices initially quoted honored for the duration of a paid membership?". If yes, the buyer has nothing to complain about. If no, then it's either improper or they signed a contract paying for the access to member pricing that cannot be known when paying for the year.

The cost to maintain a commercial range must be astronomical between staff, insurance, maintenance, capitalization of facilities, etc. I suspect that the best way to make a small fortune in the range business is to start with a large one.

 

[strangenh]

It was the case that "If a member has 1 guest who shares the member's lane, range time for the guest is free." - is that simply no longer the case? It almost makes sense to always get an extra lane in that case.

 

[Bigtuna]

The most relevant question would be "are the prices initially quoted honored for the duration of a paid membership?". If yes, the buyer has nothing to complain about. If no, then it's either improper or they signed a contract paying for the access to member pricing that cannot be known when paying for the year.

The cost to maintain a commercial range must be astronomical between staff, insurance, maintenance, capitalization of facilities, etc. I suspect that the best way to make a small fortune in the range business is to start with a large one.

I'm guessing there was a clause somewhere in there that makes it legal.

Is the member price now a flat rate of $9/hr? Wondering if they also went up on non members.

 

[drgrant]

Breaking news: gun clubs are almost always greatly cheaper than for-profit ranges. Details on our 11 PM newscast.

+1....

Well, that, and good luck finding a private club (eg one that doesn't offer lane rentals) that has an indoor range that is the same level of quality as MFL's, with a lack of insane rules. This isn't a knock against private clubs whatsoever, it's just a reality check... most private clubs don't have the staff and resources to invest in their indoor facilities the way that a place like MFL or S&W does. Those are the only two indoor facilities I've been in without feeling like I inhaled a bunch of garbage in the process. Part of the reason for this is because Jim invested in this gigantic air filtration system that pumps in gobs of fresh air from the outside, heats it (or cools it in the summer) which sucks all the smoke and garbage downrange quickly. None of the range air is "recycled". There aren't that many ranges around that have that kind of air pressure. Most have something kinda resembling an exhaust fan, if you're lucky, and in a lot of them, during the winter, there is no heat, and all the building does is protect you from the wind/rain/snow.

At this point, however, I have to ask my self If I am willing to pay this or if its time to join a gun club and let this membership lapse.

IMHO everyone should have a regular club membership somewhere, regardless of whether or not they decide to pursue one at MFL. I always prefer shooting outside when I can, when the conditions don't suck too badly for it. I got my membership at MFL because when the weather sucks outside, or I want to shoot in the late afternoons or early evenings in the winter (even if you do shoot outside, most outdoor clubs cease shooting at dusk, so with dusk being 4 pm, you're kinda screwed). The other problem is the club I'm a member at down in MA, after a good snowstorm, even if the driveway is plowed (Which, I will give credit where credit is due, one member generously and religiously plows the dirt driveway with his huge ass truck) Whatever is left will melt and then refreeze into a glacier, good luck getting up the driveway for 3 months- so the range I normally use is effectively closed unless we get a warm spell.

The other thing is MFL is great for overcoming the all too common "we're running a fishing derby/boy scout/3d archery shoot/trap + skeet snob/birthday party event today and the club range is closed" problem. A ton of clubs in MA, and probably some in NH are afflicted with this. Instead of having to throw away a half a day that I set aside to go shooting, I can just call up MFL, get a lane, be there in an hour or so, and actually go shooting. (Again, not knocking the private clubs here- many of them have activities other than shooting, especially the more affordable ones. Some of these activities also raise a ton of money for the private clubs, so I am in no way suggesting that these clubs curtail these activities. )

Yeah, price increases stink, but I guess it all depends on what your threshold of pain is. Are you shooting with just your son? He should be the guest and he should be free on the same lane... unless the rules have changed. Now if you have a 3rd person, then that's obviously going to mess things up. It's possible you got mis-charged by the person that rang you out? (The staff have always been good to me, but everyone makes mistakes.... )

-Mike

 

[40 caliber]

Yeah, price increases stink, but I guess it all depends on what your threshold of pain is. Are you shooting with just your son? He should be the guest and he should be free on the same lane... unless the rules have changed. Now if you have a 3rd person, then that's obviously going to mess things up. It's possible you got mis-charged by the person that rang you out? (The staff have always been good to me, but everyone makes mistakes.... )

-Mike

Yes, The rules have changed. I asked to make sure. This is the new pricing. There is no free guest anymore for anyone over 13. There was only 2 of us. I paid $18 for one hour.

Mike That was my point, I estimate my cost to go to MFL with my son and my normal usage just doubled (conservatively) ~$800+ a year just for lane time (vs ~$350 based on estimated usage on last year and membership fees). That has hit my pain threshold.

I know gun clubs are less expensive and there are issues you've mentioned. At my old cost of MFL, It was not worth the hassle joining one. At this cost, I am willing to investigate and put up with some BS.

The cost to maintain a commercial range must be astronomical between staff, insurance, maintenance, capitalization of facilities, etc. I suspect that the best way to make a small fortune in the range business is to start with a large one.

I agree and don't fault Jim/MFL at all. He is not a non-profit and it is a beautiful facility. He deserves to make whatever the market will bear. I am just saying at this point I don't think I personally can bear it.

 

[Shooters-Hooksett]

More details will come soon.
Minor children < 18 years old will be free on the same lane as the guest!
If you were charged last night for your boy-see me when you come in for the credit.
Jim

 

[Len-2A Training]

Mike, you are welcome to join me as my guest at Braintree R&P anytime! One thing that sold me on BR&P was the HEPA system for the newer indoor range, where literally people shoot blackpowder indoors and the smoke cloud gets carried into the filters and gone (no stink for the rest of us)! I understand that there maybe 1 or 2 other private clubs in MA that have a HEPA system, but it is extremely expensive to install and operate (last I heard some years ago we paid Clean Harbors >$20K/year IIRC to remove/dispose/replace the HEPA filters on a regular basis).

Jim spent a fortune to build the new MFL range and it was inevitable that he'd have to raise the rates to cover his much increased costs of running the place and contribute to pay off some of the capital expense. It is truly state-of-the-art and worth it to those that are concerned about ingesting lead/dust/other hazardous airborne residue from the average club.

 

[Bigtuna]

More details will come soon.
Minor children < 18 years old will be free on the same lane as the guest!
If you were charged last night for your boy-see me when you come in for the credit.
Jim

Jim,
Did you raise pricing on non-members?

 

[Shooters-Hooksett]

No Sir - Non Members are at the top of the scale in my opinion. We were forced to raise the price for Members,as it had not changed in almost eight years. The operating cost for this place is mind blowing to say the least! I've been selling some personal class three stuff to pay the monthly nut,and can never replace them as well as it will run out of stuff to sell over time. It has to at least make the monthly bills. Trying to pay those bills at the old rates is like trying to pay for a 200,000 dollar house with a minimum wage job. Over 2.5 million was spent doing this place, and the bank would like it back every month :>(

In the new facility: Everything is on a larger scale than the old one, to include six more employee's to run the place safer than ever before. Comparing my operating cost to non profit clubs is rather silly, as Uncle Sam does not have his hands in thier pockets,no paid employee's,no 4k light bill,5k heating bill,big mortgage blah blah

I understand if I lose some members,and I'm sad if I do - but it's better than losing my business and having nothing left. I didn't raise the prices when I first moved in, I was hoping the volume would take care of it.
Jim

 

[40 caliber]

More details will come soon.
Minor children < 18 years old will be free on the same lane as the guest!
If you were charged last night for your boy-see me when you come in for the credit.
Jim

Thanks for the consideration Jim. No credit needed!

I understand if I lose some members,and I'm sad if I do - but it's better than losing my business and having nothing left. I didn't raise the prices when I first moved in, I was hoping the volume would take care of it.
Jim

Frankly Jim I think even $10/hour lane time is still reasonable for members and would pay it. I don't even mind the double with an adult guest (excluding the son issue as noted)

We all want you to succeed as we love the place. Thanks for the insight and understanding. I will try to support with all the purchases there I can. (of course I still haven't told my wife about the 1911 SIG I bought from Blake there.)

 

[Shooters-Hooksett]

The credit is due,and your post put my brain in a different direction when it comes to dad's/mom's bringing in the children. I had not thought of that before your post, and never intended to raise prices to capture revenue from kids.

On the day after Christmas, my accountant laid out some numbers,and said "you can't get enough people through your doors each week to pay these debts with your old prices" That was a bad wake up call - especially when the new 150 ton air conditioner was dropped in the back parking lot with a bill for $130,000.00....ouchhhh

I plan on more stuff for the memberships to make it value added, and will always try to find more ways to cut expenses without cutting safety or quality.

Have a great New Year....and Thank You!

 

[ShaunSweeney]

Jim,

I don't want to sound ungrateful considering you made a sizable investment for the local shooting community. However, you must have had some idea of how much more it would cost you to run such a range. I feel as if you were disingenuous to us members that joined after the new range opened as it was a great value and then turn around and charge over double what we signed up for. I have to say I for one can no longer afford to shoot at your facility as I was barely able to at the old rates. I am very displeased that I now have a membership that is only worth its weight in a paper membership card. I will hopefully be joining a local club this season and just accept the loss at MFL.

 

[Shooters-Hooksett]

You say you don't want to sound "ungrateful," and then say that you feel that I was "disingenuous" raising prices, and you posted it on a public forum. Anyone that knows me would NEVER believe that. There was never any master plan to raise rates and it was never considered until the dust settled. Most members were surprised when we opened our new facility that we didn't raise any rates!

One of my employees is on here. Ask "GONZO" if we had EVER talked about raising prises in the five months he's worked for me. As far as your membership goes, the hourly rate went up one dollar, and the renewal went up $35 a year, just $2.92 per month. For the multi-million dollar facility that we have provided for you, that is certainly not a huge increase. The bills are ten fold what they were at the Gay St location.

As for the free guest, this is something I instituted when I bought this place 12 years ago. The former owner charged the guest the same rate. I'm the one that got rid of that, and am now forced to bring it back. If you're not happy, come see me and I'll refund you the prorated amount left of your membership.

As far as saying that your membership is only worth it's weight in paper is another bullshit remark - as even with a guest you are paying almost half what two non-members do. Membership benefits go well beyond just range time at a reduced rate. If you are unfamiliar with these other benefits, call me, and I'll refresh your memory.

When you signed the application, it clearly (in regular size print) stated that prices and benefits may change.

We can't compete with private clubs, they're NON-PROFIT and don't have a tenth of the bills that I do. I love shooting outside when the weather is nice,and belong to two NH Clubs. See me before the week is out, and I'll refund the balance.
Jim 603.396.6540 Cell

 

[strangenh]

If you're not happy, come see me and I'll refund you the prorated amount left of your membership.
[...]
See me before the week is out, and I'll refund the balance.

This is another example of why people say Jim's word is solid. Jim is the consummate businessman, and as such he tends to talk in terms of dollars, but no one should make the mistake to think that means he's out to rip people off.

Jim, that response just earned you first crack at all the firearms-related business I'm gonna do in 2011.

I should also remind people there's actually a backlog for memberships at MFL right now. Someone's gonna be very happy when dongalonga cashes out the remnant of his membership.

 

[ShaunSweeney]

I am truly sorry, but I just don't see how you were not aware that opening this amazing facility was going to cost you more. That just seems like poor planning in my mind. I think you should have taken that into consideration before ever opening the doors to the new location. This way you could have grandfathered in the old members for the remainder of their membership. Then you could have charged any new members the new rates and given them different colored membership cards to easily differentiate. I was not a member before the new range opened and only went to the old range once. Therefore, my suggestions are genuine as I would have still been affected by the new rates and I could have made my decision accordingly.

I understand that you need to make a profit and I am fine with that. Maybe I didn't completely explain myself in my first post and looked like I was just complaining with no solution. I know that you have a great reputation and your offer to refund the remainder of my membership proves that. I have no hard feelings and truly appreciate being able to shoot at such an amazing facility. It is just bad timing on your part to raise our rates right after the holidays when we are all hurting the most. I understand you are probably at the breaking point after the holidays, however, and that probably forced your hand.

My biggest issue is that I never shoot alone. I have recently gotten my wife into shooting, and that is the main reason I became a member of an indoor range. It has been the best place to teach her initial marksmanship skills. However, this is why the new rates hurt so much. I have always paid $8 to shoot and now I have to pay $18. That $10 may not sound like much, but it adds up. My wife and I are regulars and shoot at least once a week every week. That $10 becomes over $500 very quickly. I don't even care about the membership fee going up. That I can understand and actually half expected all along.

Like I said, you are a stand up guy and I probably came off a little too harsh in my original post. I apologize if I seemed unfair initially, but I am sure you know where I am coming from now.

 

[Bigtuna]

The guest issue is a big one for some of us, pretty much adds 100's of dollars to our annual costs. So not really just a couple bucks. Those of us that bought (primarily) because we thought the free guest option was the greatest value are probably in the minority. I've chosen other options. I like the range and when my current membership expires, I'll continue as a non member just not as often. I completely understand your situation and the membership agreement. We all need to do what we have to, no hard feelings.

One positive...I won't have to share a lane anymore, guest can have their own.

 

[40 caliber]

Jim, that response just earned you first crack at all the firearms-related business I'm gonna do in 2011.

StrangeNH I agree with you. I bought a magazine for my Sig last time I went in just because of Jim's last response to me. It ain't much but I will buy whatever I can there to support this place. I know he is trying and doing the best he can.

Dongalonga, you don't know what Jim assumed when he thought he could open the new place with the current rates. Accusing or assuming what he thought does not help your apology.

When I brought this up , I never assumed anything but the best of Jim's intentions. I just stated my own personal impact. We all make our choices,..... Jim has had to make his.....let's leave it at that....

I am sorry, and embarassed I ever started this subject....

 

[Gonzo]

Guys, I don't want to be flippant here, but if an extra dollar for range time kills your shooting habit, I want to know where you buy your ammo on such a tight budget.

Yeah, price increases suck, but we're not gouging for the sake of it, we're aiming to provide the best possible shooting experience at the greatest value. I could work other places for more money as my moonlighting gig, but the community of people that MFL attract is the biggest reason why I stay there. It's fun. I learn things everyday, and get to meet different people.

I and I'm sure Jim appreciate your understanding on the matter and look forward to seeing you guys as often as possible.

-Tall Mike

 

[ShaunSweeney]

If it only cost me an extra buck, I would have no complaints. Unfortunately, I am in the minority and got the membership so my wife and I could shoot together. For us it has become a $10 increase each time we shoot. Considering I shoot about 50x a year thats $500. Last time I checked people will switch car insurance companies,etc to save less than that a year. So please don't try to tell me how the increase shouldn't bother my bottom line. If others have an extra $500 in their budget every year to go shooting good for them. I don't!

On another note, I think I will take you up on your offer Jim. I don't feel like I will be back to shoot enough if at all to make it worth my while.

 

[Bigtuna]

Guys, I don't want to be flippant here, but if an extra dollar for range time kills your shooting habit, I want to know where you buy your ammo on such a tight budget.

Did you read the posts? Nothing to do with an extra buck. What's wrong with some feedback when you make business changes? Especially in the middle of a membership cycle? Geez...you make it sound like spending an extra $300-$400 bucks yearly on guest fees on top of $300-$400 I already spend yearly is nothing and we are being petty! I know Jim has no choice and needs the dough, but as a paying customer I do have the right not to be thrilled with it.

My last post on this...only downhill from here.

 

[drgrant]

I will admit I am slightly disappointed about not being able to have free guest anymore, but it's nowhere near the end of the world, not any stretch. I probably will only end up bringing guests a half dozen times anyways, and even if we burn 2 hrs in there every time, thats still only like $108? over the whole winter "season". Yeah, thats money I could have spent on bullets or something, but in the grand scheme of things that isn't even a big deal. I suppose it's a bigger deal if you go there 50 times a year... hell, I wish I could get to ANY range 50 times a year. As it is, I probably am lucky if I can do a little over half of that.

As far as it going up a buck... I figured it would. The base rates are still very reasonable to me. Going in, shooting for 2 hours, for under 20 bucks, without freezing my ass off when its like 1 degree out (and thats before the windchill) with a maintained, automatic target system.... and courteous staff (which, BTW, are pretty attentive at keeping any knuckleheads under control or at bay) all worth it. Even at current rates, I'll still have 2 bucks left over which is almost enough to get me a large dunks for the ride home.

Whenever I've been up there Jim and his staff have gone out of their way to help me with anything I needed. That kind of service alone is worth it.

If pumping the fee up a buck and cutting out some bennies is what Jim says it takes for them to survive then I would be apt to believe him. I don't think some of the people whining in this thread have any concept of what the climate system alone in there probably costs to run. It's not some pansy assed, milquetoast, forced hot air heater in your house that gets to recirculate the same warm air over and over again, with only a little bit of fresh air from the outside. There is a huge fresh air supply that feeds the ranges, that air has to then be made warm enough to make the place comfortable. In the winter this means taking air at like 30F and heating it to 60-70F. Think about how non-efficient and expensive that is, but how ultimately necessary that process is to keep the air clean. A crappy way of describing it is, it's almost like heating your house with the windows open. There is no way in hell that is inexpensive to pull off, even with all the modern computerized HVAC stuff. (Jim, if you read this, you can feel free to correct me if I'm full of s**t on my analogy about your air system there, but I think I mostly have it correct. )

This is also ignoring all the other cool stuff in there.... like a real bullet trap that you can fire an M1 Garand into without damaging it.

Think about "how much money you are saving" when you're at some other indoor range..... experiencing one or more of the following:

-A freezing your ass off
-Coughing up a lung or a nose full of black snot because the ventilation system sucks or wearing a stupid respirator
-Told you cannot shoot any closer than 25 feet (sucks for defensive handgun stuff)
-Get yelled at for SAFELY drawing from a holster in a controlled manner
-Get forced to shoot targets at the full distance of the range either because of no
target pulleys or byzantine rules
-Can't shoot your rifle indoors because their backstop isn't good enough.
-Can't shoot the kind of ammo you want "wah wah wah we dddddont allow jacketed bullets!!! waaaah!"
-Get whined at for collecting your brass (because the facility wants to steal it all for their own profit!)
-Getting muzzle swept by ignorant asswipes (because nobody is monitoring the
range)
-Get told you can't use the range because they're running some class on it all
day.....
-Getting stuck in a lane waiting queue forever because they have no member system or just clearly inadequate range capacity.

There are maybe only a couple of indoor ranges in new england that don't have any of these problems...or only have a few of them infrequently, and MFL is one of
them. Ponder that for a minute.

It also goes without saying, if you respond "Well, none of that applies when I'm shooting outside" Well, then, frankly, you're doing it wrong. If you can deal with the weather, or have a club membership somewhere, you SHOULD be shooting outside. Or if the response is "My club has an excellent indoor range which has none
of those problems" then you should be shooting THERE instead.

I realize I sound like an MFL fanboi/cheerleader here.... but I think this bears repeating... I am a hardass/curmudgeon when it comes to indoor range facilities,
most people think that I set the bar too high- but MFL is one of the few places that actually exceeds that standard for what I think an indoor range should be. It's nice to be able to go shoot at a place that doesn't piss me off. If that makes me a cheerleader then sign me up and give me the pompoms already.

So, all that said, go enjoy MFL.... or don't! I'm still going. Like when Walter Sobchak gets into the coffee argument in the cafe and pounds his fist on the table and goes "I'm Staying!"

Ok, I've rambled on enough now..... thats the end of my .02.

-Mike

 

[colt_fan]

guests shooting for free... i consider a guest someone i bring to the range a couple times a year. if they are coming a couple times a month, then perhaps they should consider becoming a member.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

Especially in the middle of a membership cycle?

This is the key. Even if it's allowed by contract, putting in a substantial decrease in member benefits in the middle of a paid for cycle is not the best form (if that is indeed what happened). It is unlikely I would buy a membership from any business where the contract allowed the covered services or benefits to be decreased during a prepaid membership period.

There are really two issues - the raising of rates and change of terms. If the rates went up 20% and the membership benefit was "X% off current rate", it wouldn't be a big red-flag item, since the membership sold a "discount off current fee". But, it seems a benefit provided at no charge became a separate charge item in the middle of a membership term. It's sort of like signing up for cable TV on a term contract and having half the channels pulled while the price increased 10%. Although not typical, this individual who is used to bringing a guest under the former terms is seeing a doubling of the cost to use the range. I respectfully suggest that altering terms, not just price, in the middle of a paid membership is something MFL should re-think.

As I said before, the expenses of running a business like this are astronomical, and the per-hour cost just to break even would scare most sane people looking to start a business.

i consider a guest someone i bring to the range a couple times a year. if they are coming a couple times a month, then perhaps they should consider becoming a member.

This should be clearly specified by the membership contract. Some private clubs work on this basis without a formal limit; some have a "one time" rule. The AFS range in N. Attleboro gives members a certain number of free guess passes with their membership. If a commercial range says "one guest free if you share a lane", and does not put limits on it, doing so is not "imposing" but utilizing the offered service. In fact, some people make their "join decision" on this benefit.

especially when the new 150 ton air conditioner was dropped in the back parking lot with a bill for $130,000.00

If the A/C is mounted on the ground rather than the roof of the building, I suggest you have a security camera positioned to get the license plate of any pickup that comes by for night shopping. Trust me on this one .

 

[ShaunSweeney]

Many ranges also allow you to bring your child or spouse for free. I see there is no convincing people that raising rates and eliminating benefits is not cool when someone has 6 months left on a year long membership. Maybe some of you have money to burn, but I do not.

Imagine if you got into your leased car and the loan company decided to leave you a note under the wiper blade the night before that read "Sorry for the inconvenience, but we will be raising your payment and limiting your mileage further. Unfortunately we didn't realize that running a lease program would be so expensive." I'm sure you would all be just fine with that right?

Just stop being "fanboys" as previously suggested and realize that even though Jim is a nice guy he is screwing his members.

 

[MACGYVR]

This is the key. Even if it's allowed by contract, putting in a substantial decrease in member benefits in the middle of a paid for cycle is not the best form (if that is indeed what happened). It is unlikely I would buy a membership from any business where the contract allowed the covered services or benefits to be decreased during a prepaid membership period.

Your local gun club does this all the time. Raise the rates for trap/skeet, memberships, renewals, change the rules at the range preventing you from shooting a caliber or type of gun, remove access to ranges for money making club activities like letting the local police reserve it etc. It is all a complete reduction in benefits that were paid for.

I have no problem paying the range fees at MFL no matter what they are. They are the nicest place i have ever shot. All the employees are always up for good conversation and are helpful on the range. I have borrowed magazines for troubleshooting a 1911, tools for adjusting a sight, had someone help me with my trigger techniques etc all at no extra cost. These are the things that make MFL not just another range and why they will continue to get my business even though its an hour or more drive to get there and a 2 hour wait in line somedays.

 

[strangenh]

This is the key. Even if it's allowed by contract, putting in a substantial decrease in member benefits in the middle of a paid for cycle is not the best form (if that is indeed what happened).

Rob, it is a continual cycle there. Memberships expire continually, all year. Each card runs one year from date of issue - there is no prorated period to true up all memberships to a particular date. By your lights, then, MFL could never raise rates.

 

[piman]

Rob, it is a continual cycle there. Memberships expire continually, all year. Each card runs one year from date of issue - there is no prorated period to true up all memberships to a particular date. By your lights, then, MFL could never raise rates.

Of course not. In fact it makes it simpler. The business would define a sunset date which is a year from the effective date of rate increases. Then for memberships that expire before the sunset date, the old rates would apply for a certain period (others pay the new rates which can be the only ones posted), ideally for the length of the membership which is now guaranteed to be less than a year. If the certain period is less, say 2 months, then the people with affected memberships are given an offer to cancel for an appropriate refund.

I think something like that might cause affected people to more sympathetically consider renewals. The business would also get some valuable info on price sensitivity and membership behavior that would be invaluable in future price increases.

Note I'm only commenting on what I thought was your comment was that rate increases are not possible in a gradual manner. Finally it's Jim's business to run and his members dollars to spend.


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